Why Are Sebenzas So Popular?

[Confederate]

Tell me why.

They're plain looking, outrageously priced, have modest blade lengths. Okay, they have S30V blades; so do other, less expensive, knives. No one can say they're not great quality, but what's the draw that has everyone not only wanting one, but willing to drop wads of cash for them?

Many are as expensive as very decent stainless .357 magnum revolvers.

So why would someone pay as much for one as a S&W 686 combat .357? It seemingly violates the laws of the universe. Or am I missing something?

 

[notdos]

The Sebenza represents a quality benchmark in the knife world that even the newest collector can recognzie. I agree that the look is somewhat vanilla, but you'd be hard pressed to find a better production knife value out there.

Phillip

 

[BlazenGem]

I have never held a Sebenza, but I know enough about it to give you a explanation

sebenzas are sooo popular because of its simplicty, perfect fit and finish, great customer service, great design.

 

[carrot]

I dunno. But I intend to find out soon. Secretly (well, not anymore) hoping I won't like it so I can re-appropriate the funds to something else.

 

[eojk]

JFC, dude. You've been here long enough to know how to use the search function. There was just a multi-page thread debating this very issue. I'm surprised the horse is even identifiable now, it has been mushed into so fine a paste.

 

[Confederate]

You've been here long enough to know how to use the search function. There was just a multi-page thread debating this very issue. I'm surprised the horse is even identifiable now, it has been mushed into so fine a paste.

Ah, but my point is that a great quality knife should not cost as much as a great quality revolver
(more steel, more tolerances, more parts, etc.).

The Sebenza represents a quality benchmark in the knife world that even the newest collector can recognzie. I agree that the look is somewhat vanilla, but you'd be hard pressed to find a better production knife value out there.

Hi, Phillip. The Smith & Wesson 686 represents a quality benchmark in the revover world that even the newest shooter can recognzie. It's a beautiful handgun, and you'd be hard pressed to find a better production revover value out there.

So why does a quality knife cost as much as a quality revolver??

Still not gettin' it.

Confed :grumpy:

 

[Esav Benyamin]

Here's that previous thread. Not easy to find, it was 7 pages back on the New Posts list.

What's with the CR Sebenza? ( 1 2 3 4 5)
StretchNM

A knife has very little in common with a gun. I can carry a knife like the Sebenza almost everywhere I go, and use it for fun, for work, for utility.

Guns are much more restricted for legal carry, and with extremely limited utility. I have never been able to figure out how to slice a tomato with a gun, a task at which my Sebenzas excel.

 

[Rich357]

Love the S&W 686. But, I'd be surprised to find a new one for under $400 USD. Maybe I just don't shop in the right places.

The CR Sebenza is a very sell made, well designed folder. Maybe the price is also part of what makes it interesting. Not everyone is going to spring for one. But, you get more than the knife, you also get great customer service. You can get a second balde fitted to your Sebenza frame. CR will refurb the Sebenza. It nice to know you can screw up something expensive and get it fixed. I like the way the large classic Sebenza fits my hand when cutting things. It feels very natural.

A lot of cutting can be done by of those folding box knives from Harbor Freight but many people want something a little nicer in a carry knife.

 

[Rich357]

Ah, but my point is that a great quality knife should not cost as much as a great quality revolver
(more steel, more tolerances, more parts, etc.).


Hi, Phillip. The Smith & Wesson 686 represents a quality benchmark in the revover world that even the newest shooter can recognzie. It's a beautiful handgun, and you'd be hard pressed to find a better production revover value out there.

So why does a quality knife cost as much as a quality revolver??

Still not gettin' it.

Confed :grumpy:

That's ceratinly a good point. Maybe part of the answer is the volume of sales?

Then again, CR doesn't seem to have a problem selling their knives.

 

[Sam Salvati]

Just get one and you will understand. Sebenzas are like boobs and fireworks, you need to expeirience them to GET IT.

 

[Zero_Time]

Hi, Phillip. The Smith & Wesson 686 represents a quality benchmark in the revolver world that even the newest shooter can recognzie. It's a beautiful handgun, and you'd be hard pressed to find a better production revover value out there.

So why does a quality knife cost as much as a quality revolver??

Still not gettin' it.

Confed :grumpy:

Ahh... but you must know right here you are making a specious comparison. You JUST said (and I quote you again for fun)

production revover

Come on now. I don't buy into the Sebenza hype myself, but a Seb ain't just a regular production knife. Besides, who said that a Sebenza was a quality knife? Only you. I say it is a SUPER quality knife. Why do Mercedes cost so much- can't there be cheaper cars? Sure. Faster and cheaper? Sure. A Sebenza is not something anyone NEEDS. It's a want, and fulfills a function that many, many lower-priced models would do just as well at. I know a man who was buying his wife a car for Christmas. He complained to my dad that he had to get her a Mercedes, even though it was $20,000 more than a Lexus, which did everything just as well, basically only difference being the hood ornament. Yep. Wants, not needs. Are there cheaper quality .357 revolvers out there? If not (or virtually none) then you must realize that your argument is faulty at this premise.
Zero

 

[AfterTFD]

Just get one and you will understand. Sebenzas are like boobs and fireworks, you need to experience them to GET IT.

I say the same thing about revolvers.

I'll assume that sebenzas are extraordinary knives for the sake of discussion because I've never handled one. However, they're still just a small knife. There is a limit to how much I think makes sense to spend on a knife no matter how good it is.

 

[Confederate]

Okay, I acknowledge the sales. I can't dispute the fact that Sebenzas sell, but it doesn't answer my question of why.
Sure, knives can be used where handguns can't, but shoes can be used where a car can't. That doesn't mean that
shoes should cost as much as a car.

I also acknowledge the customer service. But knives aren't generally that expensive that you will need to have them
refurbished. Let me try to put it this way:

A couple of years ago, I saw the CRKT S-2, often called the "poor man's Sebenza" for the incredible price of twenty-five
bucks at Smoky Mountain Knife Works. I even posted it here (after I had ordered seven of them for myself). These S-2s
had titanium frames and ATS-34 blades that were sharp right out of the box. Now an ATS-34 blade ain't as good as an
S30V, but it's not bad. It used to be a high end stainless. It has a nice look, not too far removed from the Sebenza, and
it's held up remarkably well. It probably will last the rest of my life without needing to be refurbished or repaired, but if
it does, I can throw it away! No need to have it repaired, no need for customer service.
.

.

The regular price of an S-2 is about $100. It's exceptionally well made. Realistically, what would a Sebenza do for me
that my S-2 wouldn't? Both are just knives. Their value is dependant on what people will pay; but what they will pay
doesn't have a bearing on the intrinsic, logical return that such a knife actually provides.

Now you take our 686 revolver. How much time, effort, and materials does it take to make one? Gun manufacturers also
must comply with numerous state and federal laws and there is very little overhead. The heat treat of the steels must
be precise, the tolerances measured in thousandths of an inch. The sights must be assembled, the cylinder must be
aligned precisely with the barrel and the hand, or pawl, must be precisely the length and shape to move them into
alignment. The barrels must be machined and milled with the lands and grooves of a precise diameter, and the chambers
also machined to exact measurements. Finally it's all hand assembled, inspected, test fired, boxed and shipped.
.

.

Okay, now how can a mere knife even start to compare? If I were going to pay the going price of a Sebenza, I'd want
the blade polished to a mirror brightness. It also would be nice if it came with a leather sheath and a belt clip.

So I'm trying to understand this and you guys with Sebenzas are the best ones to ask.

My own personal theory is that people who buy Sebenzas are 1) so wealthy that they can buy a truckload of
revolvers and knives and not worry about it or, 2) the quality of the knife is so far beyond regular knives that the
sheer quality is somethng they feel must be possessed to be appreciated, and that they'll pay whatever price it takes.

A knife can be expensive. It can be made with a fine Damascus blade and be engraved and adorned with fine
workmanship. But a Sebenza is a working knife. People don't display it or keep it in a safe very often.

In some ways it's like the Korth .357. Sells for $4,700. Very puzzling, indeed.

.

 

[lmeister]

They're good! Good Quality is a good investment.

 

[Rich357]

I've wondered why a 1911 costs more than the S&W 696.

 

[AfterTFD]

Ahh... but you must know right here you are making a specious comparison.

I consider even crappy revolvers to be greater than the best folding knife on earth. The S&W 686, however, is not in any way a crappy revolver. It's the superb product of brilliant engineering and it has proven its value continuously since its introduction. It could be claimed that it's not the best revolver of its size on earth, but it can also be claimed that the sebenza is not the best folding knife of its blade length on earth. Some of you may disagree with that last statement, but since 'best' is subjective that doesn't really matter.

A Sebenza is not something anyone NEEDS. It's a want, and fulfills a function that many, many lower-priced models would do just as well at.

So you're admitting that it's not really worth the money except as a toy for rich people? I guess that answers Confederate's original question.

Are there cheaper quality .357 revolvers out there? If not (or virtually none) then you must realize that your argument is faulty at this premise.

It doesn't seem to me like that would effect his argument at all. Either way there are cheaper revolvers both in terms of quality and cost.

 

[Scott Dog]

Because I can't carry a .357 everywhere (well almost everywhere) without putting my freedom at risk. Plus guns are a PITA to carry and are rarely usefull. In my almost 50 years of life I've only needed a gun 3 times. Knives I use daily. Plus I really like Sebenzas and I guess that's what matters.

 

[knarfeng]

So why would someone pay as much for one as a S&W 686 combat .357? It seemingly violates the laws of the universe. Or am I missing something?

I think you may be missing something. I think the profit margin on a CRK knife may not be as much as you think.

As far as manufacturing costs go, S&W makes a whole lot more guns than CRK makes knives. S&W is a whole lot more automated as well. So CRKs overhead and manufacturing costs is likely much higher than that of S&W on a per unit basis. CRK has to pass that on to the customer. And because of the other reasons already posted, people are willing to pay that much for that knife.

All goods worth price charged. Precision is expensive. Handwork is expensive. Low volumes make for high per unit overhead costs.

 

[hardheart]

something to notice is how retailers cannot sell the sebenza below msrp, most other knives are sold well below, and several have an msrp very, very close to the sebbie.

 

[Zero_Time]

First off, I'd like to go on record, and say that AfterTFD's post is the exact reason most of my posts are huge-normous. I don't like to leave my arguments full of unexplained holes; and I am not quite good enough to do it in that few of words. Most people don't respond to my posts; either because they're too big, or because I mostly cover the logical holes. That said, let's get on to my response.

I consider even crappy revolvers to be greater than the best folding knife on earth.

Well, this is not meant to be nasty or anything, but that is your value judgement, and other people might judge the exact opposite.

The S&W 686, however, is not in any way a crappy revolver. It's the superb product of brilliant engineering and it has proven its value continuously since its introduction. It could be claimed that it's not the best revolver of its size on earth, but it can also be claimed that the sebenza is not the best folding knife of its blade length on earth. Some of you may disagree with that last statement, but since 'best' is subjective that doesn't really matter.

Again, you should hardly find a problem with people disagreeing with Sebenzas being the best in the world. As someone said, a Sebenza is like a Mercedes. Is a mercedes best? Well, Rolls may be considered better, or Maybachs, but they are good enough for most anyone with expensive taste. Let me state right here, I am out of my element when talking revolvers, so do bear with me and any mistakes I make.

So you're admitting that it's not really worth the money except as a toy for rich people? I guess that answers Confederate's original question.

Well, perhaps not the way you say it like that. A toy for rich people generally goes more expensive in my opinion (ferraris, anyone?). Maybe a toy for well-off or wealthy, but my opinion of rich is apparently way different (said as a college student, scrounging for odd jobs. Oh yeah, and a Sebenza is about as far/likely from my budget/future as the public is about liking the Iraq war). But yeah, I don't think you'll find anyone that says a Sebenza will outcut any other blade. And no one here seems to suggest that it is criminal that our soldiers are not issued Sebenzas. Everyone more or less agrees on that, if I'm not mistaken, but if I am, please do post someone disagreeing with me.

It doesn't seem to me like that would effect his argument at all. Either way there are cheaper revolvers both in terms of quality and cost.

Alright. I don't know revolvers, as previously stated, so my question is there a cheaper revolver that has the same specs and approaches the same quality (I literally don't know). If there aren't, then it DOES affect the argument. In microeconomics, we talk about substitute goods. That being, if one good gets expensive (maple syrup) people substitute another (Log cabin syrup) in the original's place. Is log cabin the same as maple? No. Is it (to some) similar in quality? Apparently. I don't know if the only other revolvers in .357 at that price are chinese knockoffs that no one at all touches, or if there are viable alternatives. If there are alternatives, then they can be substitute goods, and the question then is why you purchased the more expensive good (because I'm from Maine, and the only syrup that tastes right comes from trees).
Why the talk about substitute goods? Because there are knives of similar quality to Sebenzas for cheaper. Thus, there are substitute goods for Sebenzas, and the question is: why a Sebenza over a substitute? Or why a Mercedes over a Lexus? If there are no substitutes for a 686, then there is no comparison, because people don't choose the 686 over the competition, they choose it because it is in a class of its own, and there is no substitute. (E.g., why not a ...... something over a Humvee/Hummer? And don't get me started on what's better at off-roading. I mean, as a mobile vehicular base that civilians could buy to make a good military vehicle. Any real production line competitors?).
Zero