Why do people like 1095 for pricier knives?

[KingMC]

Perhaps we need another "fact"...such as what the hell constitutes "pricey"?
Without that being agreed upon, the rest of it is silly bickering, really.

So what is it?
And for what size? (obviously, pricey for small might be cheap for big...)
And with what accessories (kydex sheath versus leather, etc.)?

The OP tried to come up with a 'fact', this is one of his first posts.

That rather depends on the extras and competition, as well as how much people valuate those extras. I make kydex sheaths, so they seem inexpensive. Other people see them differently.

But $100 for 1095 seems high, to me. The additional cost of O1 is a tiny fraction of that price.

 

[marcinek]

Aboot time for the fork?

Smart man. I concur.

 

[RX-79G]

The OP tried to come up with a 'fact', this is one of his first posts.

Maybe this is why you keep getting confused about my posts. The "to me" is an indicator of opinion, not the way we state facts.

 

[stabman]

The OP tried to come up with a 'fact', this is one of his first posts.

We'd still need to know what size of knife $100 is pricey for.
And with what handle material.
And where it's made.

A 3 inch blade knife made of 1095 steel in China with rubber handles and a flimsy sheath would be overpriced.

 

[RX-79G]

We'd still need to know what size of knife $100 is pricey for.
And with what handle material.
And where it's made.

You could compress that all down to profit margin. The best measure of "pricey" is the percentage profit built into the price.

Not something easy to find, though, when you have secret steels and "proprietary" heat treatments.

 

[stabman]

You could compress that all down to profit margin. The best measure of "pricey" is the percentage profit built into the price.

Not something easy to find, though, when you have secret steels and "proprietary" heat treatments.

But heat treat does make a difference.
If you have differential heat treat done on all the knives by one or two people, that really does increase the price/lower the profit margin.

 

[Aleous]

If you love/like a knife you don't care how much it is, you just want it. Also as a side note I forgot how beautiful a hamon 1095 can produce.

 

[KingMC]

Missed it. My apologies to you.

He was accusing you of a personal attack, nothing that was removed caused a misunderstanding between you and the post you quoted. You did nothing wrong.

 

[marcinek]

He was accusing you of a personal attack, nothing that was removed caused a misunderstanding between you and the post you quoted. You did nothing wrong.

I was apologizing to knarfeng about missing his post and not heeding it.

But my statement is out there.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Even cheap Morakniv uses low alloy steels instead of 10xx.

Actually, their carbon steel models are C100, which is the Euro equivalent of 1095.

 

[KingMC]

Actually, their carbon steel models are C100, which is the Euro equivalent of 1095.

"That's not 1095" - RX-79G

 

[RX-79G]

"That's not 1095" - RX-79G

It's not. You could have looked this up yourself:
http://zknives.com/knives/steels/steelgraph.php?nm=c100&hrn=1&gm=0

Silicon. An element that makes alloys tougher.

I have no doubt that in Europe it is the equivalent choice for a basic, inexpensive carbon steel. But it isn't chemically identical.


And Moras are also made of O1 for the laminated blades. They used to be pretty cheap, too, just 5 years ago.

 

[marcinek]

I have nothing against 1095. All steels excel at something, and 1095 excels at making a tough, sharp knife for relatively little expense. I just don't personally understand why anyone would choose a knife made of 1095 if they are spending into the tool steel price range unless there simply is no other choice to get the features they desire.


I realize this is a controversial viewpoint, but keep in mind that nothing I've written is factually inaccurate. The boys over on the blademakers subforum would not disagree about the relatively simplicity and low cost of grinding and heat treating 1095. It is a very good steel, and there are better.


Please post your thoughts.

Becuase there is more that goes into the ocst of a knife than the price of the steel...as has been said many times before.

If one wants to cherry pick the factors that go into the cost of a knife (or the factors that make a bushcraft knife, or a quality steel), just for the sake of an argument...which seems to be happening in several threads, then bully.

I don't think it makes for a particularly informative discussion, but some seem to relish it.

Good day.

 

[RX-79G]

Becuase there is more that goes into the ocst of a knife than the price of the steel...as has been said many times before.

If one wants to cherry pick the factors that go into the cost of a knife (or the factors that make a bushcraft knife, or a quality steel), just for the sake of an argument...which seems to be happening in several threads, then bully.

I don't think it makes for a particularly informative discussion, but some seem to relish it.

Good day.

Consumers are able to comparison shop, looking at the features. The blade steel is one of those features, so it doesn't get a pass.

 

[AntDog]

Perhaps we need another "fact"...such as what the hell constitutes "pricey"?
Without that being agreed upon, the rest of it is silly bickering, really.

So what is it?
And for what size? (obviously, pricey for small might be cheap for big...)
And with what accessories (kydex sheath versus leather, etc.)?

Exactly what I was saying earlier. This discussion makes no sense from the get go, because "pricey" is definitely a relative term.

 

[RX-79G]

Exactly what I was saying earlier. This discussion makes no sense from the get go, because "pricey" is definitely a relative term.

It is relative. So everyone can make their own call when a knife leaves the bargain pricing category. And when it does - for you - then you might consider what the steel is.

I don't understand the preoccupation with creating a formula for "value". We use that word all the time without needing math to help us.

 

[stabman]

I don't understand the preoccupation with creating a formula for "value".

Then why make this thread in the first place?
The entire thread topic is about perceived value.

 

[wsantaclaus911]

I feel that my bk 11 has better edge retention than that of my Jeff white French trade knife

 

[Fanglekai]

What materials testing data shows Becker steel is superior to Rowen's 1095?

You could certainly ask the metallurgists why they add alloying elements to steel, or what chromium or vanadium do to form carbides and refine them. It would be up to you if you believe them, and I'm not a metallurgist, so there is little point in trying to get you to believe me.

You made the claim for several pages now. If you have no evidence why are you making claims about superiority?

I'm still waiting to see the materials data that shows 1095cv is superior to Rowen's 1095. Where is the evidence? If you can't produce any evidence, why are you making the claim, RX-79G?

 

[RX-79G]

I'm still waiting to see the materials data that shows 1095cv is superior to Rowen's 1095. Where is the evidence? If you can't produce any evidence, why are you making the claim, RX-79G?

Because one is a raw material and the other a finished product?