Why do you baton?

As a SAR volunteer in the Pacific Northwest, I consider batoning an essential skill - for me.

We spend a fair amount of time training for hasty improvised shelter and ricky-ticky firecraft; doing both on missions as well.
For me I find a largish, sturdy, fixed blade knife the ideal tool for both tasks, as well as quickly clearing a stokes path, LZ, etc. ...

Having tried MANY combinations of cutting tools over the years, including a hatchet, and small ax, the afore-mentioned knife and
folding saw have proven themselves as a versatile set of tools :thumbup: !

The SAR community seems as varied in opinions on this as this online community is, but I have noticed a growing number of
SAR types sporting robust fixed blade knives...

Your mileage may vary.

8
 
This is a great thread...
thanks for all the info

I have never batoned, mainly because I never carried a large knife.
I only carried a folder.

I carried a sharp Hudson Bay axe, and it did everything I needed it to do.
It chopped, notched and split.
But I stopped carrying it because of the weight.

I moved on to a folding saw to save weight.
So I gave up on splitting!

I found a folder and a lightweight folding saw gave me everything I needed.

And the weight I saved meant I could carry and extra quart of fuel for my stove, which was good for a week of cooking.
 
neeman said:
This is a great thread...
thanks for all the info

I have never batoned, mainly because I never carried a large knife.
I only carried a folder.

I carried a sharp Hudson Bay axe, and it did everything I needed it to do.
It chopped, notched and split.
But I stopped carrying it because of the weight.

I moved on to a folding saw to save weight.
So I gave up on splitting!

I found a folder and a lightweight folding saw gave me everything I needed.

And the weight I saved meant I could carry and extra quart of fuel for my stove, which was good for a week of cooking.
Click to expand...
I think we followed quite the same trail, except for one detail that you may have missed: you can baton with any fixed blade. Actually I've done most of my batoning with a mora, on pretty hard wood (beech): the thinner the blade, the better. The only limit is blade length, but as some one already pointed, you don't run into nice big "fireplace logs" so often when outdoors (except manmade stacks).

By the way, you can also baton with a folder: unlock handle, and do as if it was only handle. Avoid as much as possible the handle. I know some people who batonned with a spyderco endura.
 
hey, hey- no fair! Some of the naysayers need that argument bout ridiculously oversized blades! It's not fair to them to mention batoning with a reasonable 4 or 5 inch blade. :D
 
BAH!

Hogswallow I say!

No reason to walk about with such undersized girly blades when you can carry TWO FEET of steel!!!
:D :D :D

GiantChitlangiBowie08.jpg
 
Batoning more or less for those people who want to see how tough their knives are. There really no need to split anything even after the rain unless you talking about burning a tree trunk. Anything the size of your forearm doesn't need to be baton if it was reasonably to begin with. Rain storm is not going to get the wood wet to its core. All one has to do is feather a few pieces of wood to start the fire and put so call small twigs on it , once fire is burning hot put on damp wood in it its a done deal. No need to screw up a knife by batoning especially if its in a survivor mode. Question for those who baton is if you knew you may be out there in survivor mode for awhile you only had one knife would you still baton. You are dry, but its cold will you baton and risk breaking the knife to build fire or find another way to build fire without batoning? Back in the day, most people had knives whose steel quality were suspect, I don't think they baton just to make a fire.
 
Ravaillac said:
By the way, you can also baton with a folder: unlock handle, and do as if it was only handle. Avoid as much as possible the handle. I know some people who batonned with a spyderco endura.
Click to expand...

:D

http://metalx.org/raum/Articles/Opinel10.html - Batoning with an Opinel
http://metalx.org/raum/Articles/UKPK.html - Batoning with a Spyderco UKPK (Video footy)

I've never understood why people think batoning is so above and beyond the ability of a chunk of steel to withstand. It's really not that tough on a knife if you use proper technique.

Why is it that I can successfully baton with an Opinel and a small slipjoint or a Swiss Army knife and people here are afraid to do it with fixed blades with much thicker, more robust blades, that have not been reprofiled to the geometry of either of these knives?

Does one need to baton to start a fire? 99% of the time, no.

-BUT-

It's a useful skill to know in case you ever do need it. Why not practice it, get the technique down, then just have batoning in your skill set should you need it some day?

I've had some rainy days and some snowy days where I probably could of found dry wood, but it was much less hassle to split open the first good looking log I saw and have all the firewood I need from that one log. I make wood curls from the dry inside for tinder, break tiny sections off for wonderful kindling, then section off progressively larger pieces for slower burning chunks of wood to toss on top once the flames are going good. It's really convenient to get your entire fire going from a single log, up until you need to put more wood on.

If you're still afraid to baton your knife, go buy a Busse. They'll replace it if it breaks. So will a few other companies from what I know.

If that isn't enough for you, how about this? Carve a wooden wedge, then baton that instead of a knife. In a "survival" situation that's what I'd do if I needed to baton and had the time (e.g. wasn't freezing) to carve a wedge. Batoning isn't restricted solely to knives.
 
Vivi said:
If you're still afraid to baton your knife, go buy a Busse. They'll replace it if it breaks. So will a few other companies from what I know.
Click to expand...

He he, that's what I did. No problem batoning here, when it's needed, or I just feel like it for the fun of it!

Really though, replacing it isn't the issue - if it breaks you might not get back to get that replacement. That's why *I* baton with my knives even when I don't *need* to. It gives confidence in them; I know they can do it should I need to rely on them.

I'll have to have a try with my SAK though; I'll have a look at your links.
 
hannibal lecter spyderco said:
No need to screw up a knife by batoning especially if its in a survivor mode.
Click to expand...
I've baton quite a lot with my mora, doesn't seem screwed up a bit.

hannibal lecter spyderco said:
You are dry, but its cold will you baton and risk breaking the knife to build fire or find another way to build fire without batoning?
Click to expand...
Just curious, if you don't use your knife to start a fire, why is it so important? what do you plan to use it for: stabbing wild animals?
 
hannibal lecter spyderco said:
Batoning more or less for those people who want to see how tough their knives are. There really no need to split anything even after the rain unless you talking about burning a tree trunk. Anything the size of your forearm doesn't need to be baton if it was reasonably to begin with. Rain storm is not going to get the wood wet to its core. All one has to do is feather a few pieces of wood to start the fire and put so call small twigs on it , once fire is burning hot put on damp wood in it its a done deal. No need to screw up a knife by batoning especially if its in a survivor mode. Question for those who baton is if you knew you may be out there in survivor mode for awhile you only had one knife would you still baton. You are dry, but its cold will you baton and risk breaking the knife to build fire or find another way to build fire without batoning? Back in the day, most people had knives whose steel quality were suspect, I don't think they baton just to make a fire.
Click to expand...

1st off good point...Ok I would Baton but I never carry just one blade...I mentioned before,I have a few blades designated to be baton with and I carry one of them and a smaller fixed blade as well as a folder...do not own a axe or hatchet that I carry with me that is the reason for the hefty FB knife. Today's time there is more steel choices than you can shake a stick at. pick the steel that suites your needs...plenty of makers custom or product to fit most folks income.
 
Here's a picture of TonyM batoning at a recent gathering. This is why we sent him to Marty's course...he wasn't clear on the concept:

baton-bob.jpg
 
You two are just making a mockery of this! But then, after 7 pages...

Love them boots!
 
foxyrick said:
You two are just making a mockery of this! But then, after 7 pages...

Love them boots!
Click to expand...

Nah, just a mockery of TonyM. :D

Funniest part is he told his wife he shaved his legs for "bicycle racing" - no hair makes for cleaner scrapes. But, she is very quickly questioning this, because Tony does not own a bike.
 
One of the biggest advantages to my mind is that bark does not burn so cleanly as exposed wood. A fire will burn cleaner and more efficiently if you use pieces with exposed split sides. Likewise if you're caught without a chopping tool batoning a small blade will allow you to take down saplings and the like.
 
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