Why not more Ball Bearing Locked Knives?

KG3, you are describing custom knives, but wanting them from production companies. I'm not sure I get it. If you want a custom, buy it. If you like a production companies line, buy them.

I do believe that if buffet style knives were as easy as you seem to think we would already have companies doing so. It's a competitive business and there are some savy folks working hard trying to keep productive in a dynamic market.

Plenty of very fine custom makers here on Bladeforums actually. I'm pretty sure you can find one to make your perfect knife. Joe
 
KingGeorgeIII said:
Excuse my ignorance if this isn't a good concept
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You know, I started my whole post out saying this, and I get looked down upon. I'm just having difficulty understanding how you can be rude to someone who is simply uneducated in areas where you are. I'm sure there are plenty of things I understand that you don't, but if you came up with an idea that wouldn't work in an area of knowledge that I am fluent in, I don't think I would reply in the manner in which I was received. I would politely explain to you how it wouldn't work (I feel as if Mastiff and Jackson were more polite).

I sign onto a lot of forums and at first I thought this would be a forum of mature folks into collecting knives that I could learn from, but it seems like you aren't particularly receptive to people who aren't up to your extensive knowledge.

In pointing out to me something that you say a simple minded person should notice, I feel as if I am being mocked. I obviously realize that Spyderco production costs are much higher than Nike's, the point of the comparison wasn't production costs, it was using Nike's ID shoe line to help give an example of what I had in mind.

Also, it isn't like when I posted that I thought I was on some kind of genius trip, instead, when I posted it I was thinking how hard it would be for anyone to understand what I meant, and how far-fetched of an idea it was.
 
KG3, your idea is based on, not one, but several incorrect assumptions daisy-chained together. One of the major ones is patent and trademark issues. Some locks, some opening devices, many assisted opening systems, and possibly a few clip designs are either patented or are trademarks. Next, not all lock mechanisms can be fitted into a given handle shape. Finally, as has been pointed out, there's your assumption of excess production capacity to devote to this.

The closest to it in the real world with a large manufacturer would the Buck custom shop - two models = one folder, one fixed, extremely limited choice of steel, somewhat wider choice of scale material, and that's about it. There are a couple smaller manufacturers who offer similar limited options on their knives, Chris Reeve comes to mind. If you want something beyond that, there's the option of engaging the services of a customizer or a custom maker. I've done that several times.

But don't feel bad, this idea is posited at least twice a year here.

Paul
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My Personal Website - - - - - - A Beginners Guide to Spyderco Collecting - - - - - - Kiwimania
Dead horses beaten, sacred cows tipped, chimeras hunted when time permits.
Spyderco Collector # 043 - - WTC # 1458 - 1504 - 1508 - Never Forget, Never Forgive!
It's easy to grin when your ship comes in and good fortune and fame are your lot, but the man worthwhile is the man who can smile with his shorts twsited up in a knot. - Morey Amsterdam
 
I'm not trying to be rude, but - didn't Sal just post about how hard Ball Locks were to design in the first place and build in the second? What about Yablanowitz comment about the pivot and width trade-offs? I suspect that a knife design that could have any lock mechanism dropped into it would be generic and boring and optimized for nothing. In order to make them affordable, a minimum run for each option component would be needed. If demand isn't quite high, a *lot* of inventory sits on the shelf, waiting for a buyer. That's expensive. Tolerances are much closer for knives, if you want them to work, than for shoes. Heck, I've had Nikes that were off by a full size.

The last time I checked, the other company that folks have referred to only made one "custom" model, and you could choose only a few options, a couple of steels, one lock, finger grooves or not, and a half dozen scale materials. It's an interesting concept and I like that it helps keep higher skilled Americans employed that might otherwise be let go. I had one of my knives re-bladed there in BG-42 for a very reasonable price and am thrilled with it. Unless Spyderco needs to do something like this or fire a bunch of folks in Golden, I'd rather see a bunch of exciting new models instead.

Gordon

KingGeorgeIII said:
Excuse my ignorance if this isn't a good concept, but why doesn't a knife-maker make semi custom knives like nike has for shoes (you know where you pick the style and shoe color and everything). You could have a choice of "frame" to start out with, which would have the handle and blade style. Then you could pick blade steel, clip style, screws, etc. You could pick a locking mechanism, even assisted opener or regular, as well as thumbstud or thumb hole or nail nick or what have you. You could even choose colored handles and material used for handles. It would be an expensive knife, but if they properly designed it and priced the knives based on the choices you made (like, this feature adds an additional $20) they could feasibly keep them relatively affordable (once again depending on the features you choose) while still offering uniquely custom knives.

I mean, it sounds like it would be a hassle, but most of the major companies definitely have the staff and ability to make this happen, plus it would bring them so much business I couldnt see how it wouldn't work. It would need to be a well designed interactive web program, but I think it would be a great idea.

Oh, and if a knife maker reads this and follows up on it, I'd enjoy it if I could get one of these at some type of discount.
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KingGeorgeIII said:
You know, I started my whole post out saying this, and I get looked down upon. I'm just having difficulty understanding how you can be rude to someone who is simply uneducated in areas where you are. I'm sure there are plenty of things I understand that you don't, but if you came up with an idea that wouldn't work in an area of knowledge that I am fluent in, I don't think I would reply in the manner in which I was received. I would politely explain to you how it wouldn't work (I feel as if Mastiff and Jackson were more polite).

I sign onto a lot of forums and at first I thought this would be a forum of mature folks into collecting knives that I could learn from, but it seems like you aren't particularly receptive to people who aren't up to your extensive knowledge.

In pointing out to me something that you say a simple minded person should notice, I feel as if I am being mocked. I obviously realize that Spyderco production costs are much higher than Nike's, the point of the comparison wasn't production costs, it was using Nike's ID shoe line to help give an example of what I had in mind.

Also, it isn't like when I posted that I thought I was on some kind of genius trip, instead, when I posted it I was thinking how hard it would be for anyone to understand what I meant, and how far-fetched of an idea it was.
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King George...No one was offending you or being rude. Your reading too much into this. Someone just pointed out the facts. Plain and simple with no flowery language.

and you are right you do not know much about the complexities of knife production. You just recieved an education in the old " it looks good on paper but in reality school of thought"...now you have learned something:thumbup:

be of good cheer dont get all offended...no one is trying to disrespect you.
 
KingGeorgeIII said:
Excuse my ignorance if this isn't a good concept, but why doesn't a knife-maker make semi custom knives like nike has for shoes (you know where you pick the style and shoe color and everything). You could have a choice of "frame" to start out with, which would have the handle and blade style. Then you could pick blade steel, clip style, screws, etc. You could pick a locking mechanism, even assisted opener or regular, as well as thumbstud or thumb hole or nail nick or what have you. You could even choose colored handles and material used for handles. It would be an expensive knife, but if they properly designed it and priced the knives based on the choices you made (like, this feature adds an additional $20) they could feasibly keep them relatively affordable (once again depending on the features you choose) while still offering uniquely custom knives.

I mean, it sounds like it would be a hassle, but most of the major companies definitely have the staff and ability to make this happen, plus it would bring them so much business I couldnt see how it wouldn't work. It would need to be a well designed interactive web program, but I think it would be a great idea.

Oh, and if a knife maker reads this and follows up on it, I'd enjoy it if I could get one of these at some type of discount.
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Well, it's been tried before. Look up Speedtech knives, and their synergy model. Basically you could go to their website and build a knife with your choice of blade style, handle finish, custom ground or standard blade, etc. They went out of buisness a while back, it's a difficult model to make a profit with in a niche market like knives.
 
Sal, I'll give you a dollar if you whip me up a Mini Manix with red G10, a ball lock, and an H1 blade. :eek: :thumbup:


:p :D
 
This IS the Spyderco forum. For anyone interested in being offended, I could suggest a couple of better places to draw fire. :D
 
In an attempt to get this thread back on track. In my opinion, the ball lock, although interesting from an academic/technical point of view, fails on one major point in real world use. It is difficult, and in some cases virtually impossible, to close except under the most ideal of circumstances. The caged ball is better in that regard, but I will still opt for a midlock/frontlock myself.

Paul
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My Personal Website - - - - - - A Beginners Guide to Spyderco Collecting - - - - - - Kiwimania
Dead horses beaten, sacred cows tipped, chimeras hunted when time permits.
Spyderco Collector # 043 - - WTC # 1458 - 1504 - 1508 - Never Forget, Never Forgive!
It's easy to grin when your ship comes in and good fortune and fame are your lot, but the man worthwhile is the man who can smile with his shorts twsited up in a knot. - Morey Amsterdam
 
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