Why Toolless Disassembly Should Be The Future of Knife Design

Disagree with post #40. I like this knife to fall open and/or shut when the button is pressed and have no blade play. I wire brush most of the rust away. Then I polish the area with a Spyderco extra fine triangular prism. Very little material is removed, and the high spots that touch the Teflon washers are very smooth. When flipping ability slows, the thumb stud can still open the knife.
 
I don't mind the idea of user disassembly, but tool-less disassembly? No way. A knife needs pretty tight tolerances to be good. Every precision instrument I've dealt with that had a tool-less breakdown got sloppy quickly or was annoyingly gimmicky. Not to mention the other point made about small easy to lose parts, etc....

You can usually break down a modern folder with a $10 - 20 driver set. I've never had issue where it was too much of a hassle to go find one.
 
tltt said:
I don't mind the idea of user disassembly, but tool-less disassembly? No way. A knife needs pretty tight tolerances to be good. Every precision instrument I've dealt with that had a tool-less breakdown got sloppy quickly or was annoyingly gimmicky. Not to mention the other point made about small easy to lose parts, etc....

You can usually break down a modern folder with a $10 - 20 driver set. I've never had issue where it was too much of a hassle to go find one.
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Couldn't agree more.
 
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tltt said:
I don't mind the idea of user disassembly, but tool-less disassembly? No way. A knife needs pretty tight tolerances to be good. Every precision instrument I've dealt with that had a tool-less breakdown got sloppy quickly or was annoyingly gimmicky. Not to mention the other point made about small easy to lose parts, etc....

You can usually break down a modern folder with a $10 - 20 driver set. I've never had issue where it was too much of a hassle to go find one.
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The CRKT Homestead is held together in 2 places. The rear connection is a screw operated with a thumb wheel held in place by an E clip. The front connection is a rotating post operated by a thumb lever. This post grabs the left scale much like a bayonet fastener on a camera lens.
The only loose parts are a blade stop post, a flat Teflon washer with bearings, and a Teflon T washer without bearings. The action is smooth, and there is no blade play.
 
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Here's a tool/less folder that's easy to clean.
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tiguy7 said:
View attachment 1456977

The CRKT Homestead is held together in 2 places. The rear connection is a screw operated with a thumb wheel held in place by an E clip. The front connection is a rotating post operated by a thumb lever. This post grabs the left scale much like a bayonet fastener on a camera lens.
The only loose parts are a blade stop post, a flat Teflon washer with bearings, and a Teflon T washer without bearings. The action is smooth, and there no blade play.
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I think what tltt said still applies to the Homefront.
 
Insipid Moniker said:
Sounds more like a solution in search of a problem to me. I used to disassemble my knives regularly, largely because the enthusiast community convinced me that I should for...reasons? Eventually I realized that was silly and stopped. I can count on one hand the number of times I've needed to disassemble a knife, and I could still count them if I lost 4 fingers on that same hand. There's nothing wrong with disassembling your knives and tinkering with them, but the truth is that 99.95% of the time you're doing it it's because you want to, not because you need to.
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I agree with this. After initial break-in, it's a good idea to disassemble to get the steel dust out, just as it is a good idea to change oil in a new car after 600 or 1000 miles instead of the usual interval. After that, only if it gets REALLY dirty somehow and you're not sure you can get it clean through normal methods.

Some people do make it sound like a knife should regularly be taken apart to clean it. That's like changing oil in a car every 3000 miles, because of what Jiffy Lube recommends, regardless of what the owner's manual says. ;-)
 
Smaug said:
I agree with this. After initial break-in, it's a good idea to disassemble to get the steel dust out, just as it is a good idea to change oil in a new car after 600 or 1000 miles instead of the usual interval. After that, only if it gets REALLY dirty somehow and you're not sure you can get it clean through normal methods.

Some people do make it sound like a knife should regularly be taken apart to clean it. That's like changing oil in a car every 3000 miles, because of what Jiffy Lube recommends, regardless of what the owner's manual says. ;-)
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Why would I need to disassemble a knife to get the dust from the lock surface out? It is not a closed system like the lubrications of a modern engine.
 
Heck, we each enjoy knives in our own way. I don't doubt that some people enjoy taking their knives apart and giving each individual piece a thorough cleaning. Is it necessary, no. But if that's what they enjoy doing, more power to them.

Reminds me of guys who spend every weekend detailing their cars (sometimes with Q-tips). It makes them happy. And I assume it makes them feel a closer bond to their "baby".

I figure as long as a person isn't endangering themselves or others, then there's really no wrong way for them to enjoy their knife. Their money, their knife, their problem if they mess it up (or lose parts).

Of course, like my old man always told me as a kid- "Don't take something apart unless you can put it back together. And if you can't put it back together, don't come cryin' to me".
 
Smaug said:
I agree with this. After initial break-in, it's a good idea to disassemble to get the steel dust out, just as it is a good idea to change oil in a new car after 600 or 1000 miles instead of the usual interval. After that, only if it gets REALLY dirty somehow and you're not sure you can get it clean through normal methods.

Some people do make it sound like a knife should regularly be taken apart to clean it. That's like changing oil in a car every 3000 miles, because of what Jiffy Lube recommends, regardless of what the owner's manual says. ;-)
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I'll be honest, I don't feel any need to disassemble for that reason, either and it's never caused any problems at all for me.
 
Smaug said:
I agree with this. After initial break-in, it's a good idea to disassemble to get the steel dust out, just as it is a good idea to change oil in a new car after 600 or 1000 miles instead of the usual interval. After that, only if it gets REALLY dirty somehow and you're not sure you can get it clean through normal methods.

Some people do make it sound like a knife should regularly be taken apart to clean it. That's like changing oil in a car every 3000 miles, because of what Jiffy Lube recommends, regardless of what the owner's manual says. ;-)
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That's how Jiffy Lube makes their money..... in the old days, it really was 3,000 miles. Then it became 5,000 and now with synthetic oil it's 10 or even 15K. Good thing I think.

I took my Toyota pickup to the dealer for an oil change at 3K. It was new. They shuffled me right out the door.... come see us at 5K and we'll change the oil at 10K.

Do the owner's manuals recommend that you take apart your knives? I would guess, No.

As a kid, I took apart an old pump shotgun...... wiped all the parts down and put it back together..... mostly.... except for this one part I could never figure out where it went. I do not take apart knives. I will rinse them off, lube them, even use something to kill germs if I feel it's necessary. But take apart, not so much.
 
I take mine apart. Its simple to do, not rocket science. I just took apart my Shaman, cleaned all the lint and dirt out, cleaned up some corrosion, used Tuf Glide on those surfaces, lubed the pivot, adjusted the lockbar (previous adjustment gave me a tiny bit of blade play, so that's fixed now), and its back together and tuned perfectly and waiting on the loctite to dry so I can take it to work and use it tomorrow. What's the big deal? I haven't stripped one screw yet, even a few so tight I thought I was going to, and that's with cheap Lennox torx bits. If I mess it up I'll own it, but being used to tinkering with small fasteners I know not to be ham fisted with them.

I really don't see why people are always saying "they shouldnt be taken apart! we never did it in my day!" they have screws, and while they may not need to be taken apart some of us like to do it for fun. Let us have our fun. It's not hurting anyone.

And you don't need to buy any $80 tools for any knives. I know I'm not buying one for my Hinderers. You can get a spanner bit for pennies, and a flat head screwdriver works just fine. But I haven't had to take my Hinderers apart yet, although my XM-18 probably needs a little TLC since I've carried it pretty much every day since I got it.
 
"I really don't see why people are always saying "they shouldnt be taken apart! we never did it in my day!" they have screws, and while they may not need to be taken apart some of us like to do it for fun. Let us have our fun. It's not hurting anyone."

I agree that what is right for you is whatever you have found it to be. In my case I have 50 years of knife use with no taking folders apart. Like forcing patinas it's whatever you like and want depending on your needs . My preferences will pretty much be only useful and correct for me . If I wanted a perfectly jeweled and balanced fidget toy I might see the need to take knives apart for cleaning and adjustment but that like a knife with a forced patina just isn't my thing. As far as drop shut? Not as sharp as I regularly use and prefer my knives. Too dangerous.
 
I believe I can clean my folders well enough without disassembling them.

I have taken my knives apart in the past to adjust the mechanism. With mixed success. I try not to do that anymore.
 
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tltt said:
I don't mind the idea of user disassembly, but tool-less disassembly? No way. A knife needs pretty tight tolerances to be good. Every precision instrument I've dealt with that had a tool-less breakdown got sloppy quickly or was annoyingly gimmicky. Not to mention the other point made about small easy to lose parts, etc....

You can usually break down a modern folder with a $10 - 20 driver set. I've never had issue where it was too much of a hassle to go find one.
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Have you ever seen a high end 1911 pistol, like a Wilson Combat or Nighthawk? These have super high tolerances and tool free (in many cases) disassembly.

I’m just saying, it can be done.
 
soc_monki said:
I take mine apart. Its simple to do, not rocket science. I just took apart my Shaman, cleaned all the lint and dirt out, cleaned up some corrosion, used Tuf Glide on those surfaces, lubed the pivot, adjusted the lockbar (previous adjustment gave me a tiny bit of blade play, so that's fixed now), and its back together and tuned perfectly and waiting on the loctite to dry so I can take it to work and use it tomorrow. What's the big deal? I haven't stripped one screw yet, even a few so tight I thought I was going to, and that's with cheap Lennox torx bits. If I mess it up I'll own it, but being used to tinkering with small fasteners I know not to be ham fisted with them.

I really don't see why people are always saying "they shouldnt be taken apart! we never did it in my day!" they have screws, and while they may not need to be taken apart some of us like to do it for fun. Let us have our fun. It's not hurting anyone.

And you don't need to buy any $80 tools for any knives. I know I'm not buying one for my Hinderers. You can get a spanner bit for pennies, and a flat head screwdriver works just fine. But I haven't had to take my Hinderers apart yet, although my XM-18 probably needs a little TLC since I've carried it pretty much every day since I got it.
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I think you're largely fighting a strawman here. If you want to disassemble your knives, go for it. I just don't think you gain anything other than a sense of satisfaction from doing so.
 
tltt said:
I don't mind the idea of user disassembly, but tool-less disassembly? No way. A knife needs pretty tight tolerances to be good. Every precision instrument I've dealt with that had a tool-less breakdown got sloppy quickly or was annoyingly gimmicky. Not to mention the other point made about small easy to lose parts, etc....

You can usually break down a modern folder with a $10 - 20 driver set. I've never had issue where it was too much of a hassle to go find one.
Click to expand...

You're welcome to speculate about sloppy gimmicks, but based on my hands on experience, I conclude that CRKT and Ken Onion have produced a quality knife that will offer useful service and serviceability for many years to come.
 
The_Knife_Man said:
I'd be down with a backspacer that doubles a a breakdown tool.
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...except that the back spacer is held between the scales with screws. You'd need a screwdriver first!
 
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