WSKO: some knives not as sharp as others

[bgentry]

Ok my friend, take a deep breath. Based on what you've read, I'm guessing you work in a professional kitchen. I'm also guessing you are trying to sharpen some blades that are VERY dull. In my experience with the WSKO, a very dull blade can take quite a bit of work with the P120 belt. I've spent as long as 25 to 30 minutes, from start to finish, on a single blade that was very dull. That includes progressing from P120, to X65, to x22, to X4 with 80% or more of that time spent on the P120.

You ask how can you be removing the sharpie, grinding the bevels, and NOT getting sharp? Easy: The cutting edge of the blade can be so dull as to be FLAT. It will look like this in cross section:

\_/

How can you check to see if I'm right? Stand under a bright light. Hold your blade with edge facing the ceiling so that if you brought it right up to your face the edge would cut your nose, chin, forehead. Now look down at the edge of the blade and slowly move the tip of the blade down towards the floor, and then up towards the ceiling. If your edge is flat, you will see a shiny reflective line on the edge. Sharp blades won't reflect light on their cutting edge. Dull ones will reflect light. The stronger and more obvious the reflection, the duller the blade.

With a blade in that condition you'll grind the sides (edge bevels) and remove ALL of the marker and you won't actually get a sharp edge until you bring the bevels in and slowly remove that flat edge. That just takes continued grinding at the same angle, until you remove enough metal to re-establish a sharp edge.

There's another way: Increase your edge angle and you'll form a sharp edge faster. It will be more obtuse, but it will form an edge.

I say stick with it on the coarse belt, check for reflection on the edge periodically, and keep grinding until it's gone. Once you can't see it any more, you're *right* there and about to form a burr.

The blades you are describing are quality and *will* make sharp edges. They are probably just more dull than you thought.

Good luck and post your results!

Brian.

 

[chado skins]

I've been using the cold steel chefs knife for the past week. this is one i was having some trouble with getting a new edge on. the factory edge was super sharp but didn't last. the knife felt pretty good this week. i did do the sharpie trick, and it took all the sharpie off the old bevel. i didn't have the patience to do it with every belt... just the extra coarse, then i ran it through the progression of x65 x22 and x 4. about 10 passes per side per belt. i'm not exactly happy with the ergonomics, size or shape of this chefs knife (cold steel), but if i can get the edge to hold for at least 2 weeks i'll be happy. i'm starting to realize my knives go through ablsolute hell where i work. it's very fast paced and sometimes outright nutty busy, so i don't always have time to clean them right after i use it. and i use them A LOT. i plan on spending some more time sharpening thursday on my day off... my forschner chefs knife needs a touch up now...thanks for all the time and help guys, i really appreciate it!!


chad.

 

[Bimjo]

You know that once you've taken the Sharpie off the bevel you need to reapply it to the edge only, to ensure you're reaching the apex, right? Just set the tip of the Sharpie on the edge of the blade (blade edge facing up) and pull the Sharpie along the blade. Like you were drawing a line along the knife edge.

Make a pass or two on the KO and examine the edge. If there's any black you haven't reached the apex.

 

[nola who_dat]

Ok my friend, take a deep breath. Based on what you've read, I'm guessing you work in a professional kitchen. I'm also guessing you are trying to sharpen some blades that are VERY dull. In my experience with the WSKO, a very dull blade can take quite a bit of work with the P120 belt. I've spent as long as 25 to 30 minutes, from start to finish, on a single blade that was very dull. That includes progressing from P120, to X65, to x22, to X4 with 80% or more of that time spent on the P120.

You ask how can you be removing the sharpie, grinding the bevels, and NOT getting sharp? Easy: The cutting edge of the blade can be so dull as to be FLAT. It will look like this in cross section:

\_/

How can you check to see if I'm right? Stand under a bright light. Hold your blade with edge facing the ceiling so that if you brought it right up to your face the edge would cut your nose, chin, forehead. Now look down at the edge of the blade and slowly move the tip of the blade down towards the floor, and then up towards the ceiling. If your edge is flat, you will see a shiny reflective line on the edge. Sharp blades won't reflect light on their cutting edge. Dull ones will reflect light. The stronger and more obvious the reflection, the duller the blade.

With a blade in that condition you'll grind the sides (edge bevels) and remove ALL of the marker and you won't actually get a sharp edge until you bring the bevels in and slowly remove that flat edge. That just takes continued grinding at the same angle, until you remove enough metal to re-establish a sharp edge.

There's another way: Increase your edge angle and you'll form a sharp edge faster. It will be more obtuse, but it will form an edge.

I say stick with it on the coarse belt, check for reflection on the edge periodically, and keep grinding until it's gone. Once you can't see it any more, you're *right* there and about to form a burr.

The blades you are describing are quality and *will* make sharp edges. They are probably just more dull than you thought.

Good luck and post your results!

Brian.

I just bought the KO sharpener and having a tough time getting my blades sharp. I've been reading this post and others on this site and have determined my issue could very well be what is described in this particular post.

Here's a little background.
I'm sharpening mainly kitchen knives, nothing expensive and a couple filet knives. The blades are not nicked or messed up in any way-they are just dull. Do have a few pocket knives that need sharpening but have not attempted those yet. Want to concentrate on the kitchen knives first.

Here's the process I've used which is mainly according to the instructions.
At first I did not use the P120 belt and could never get any knife hair shaving sharp nor a very noticeable burr. I did use a sharpie and on the first pass at 20* it removed the sharpie so I figured I was good with the angle. I used each belt and made a min of 10-15 passes on each side at an angle of 20* as noted in the instructions. Since I was not getting the result I wanted, I changed the angle to 17.5 and did the same thing as before. Still not hair cutting sharp.

So I found this site and started reading. Found this post and I think the explanation that Brian gave may be my issue.
I do have a decent Victorinox chef's knife that is decently sharp but not hair shaving sharp. I went through the belts beginning with the X22 and finishing with the X4. Used a 20* angle but it made no difference. The blade felt sharper but would not slice an onion any better than before.

Since I am new to knife sharpening, I am guessing I need to change the angle to 15 and spend more time on the P120 belt and then progress through the belts. I've read in this post about increasing / decreasing the angle. Can someone explain the difference between each angle? Which angle would be best for slicing and chopping? I am not necessarily looking for a hair shaving knife but I do want a knife than can slice a tomato or onion with zero or minimal effort.

I received the KO on Friday and have played around with it for a total of 2-4 hrs and so for not happy with the sharpener. I do attribute my issues with user error and from reading the many posts / reviews on this site and others that the KO can achieve what i am after. The YouTube video's make it seem so easy to get a nice sharp edge and that's what I was expecting. Guess I should have known nothing is as easy as it appears.

So Brian or any one else, given what I have posted here, do you think I need to change the angle to 15* and start with the P120 and progress through each belt? Also, how would an inexperienced sharpener know when it's time to move to the next belt? Also there is mention about stiffer belts? Are those from WorkSharp or another site? I am planning to order the Econabrasive set that Amazon has for $39. Has anyone used those and if so are they worth it?
Thanks Eddie

 

[nola who_dat]

Ok my friend, take a deep breath. Based on what you've read, I'm guessing you work in a professional kitchen. I'm also guessing you are trying to sharpen some blades that are VERY dull. In my experience with the WSKO, a very dull blade can take quite a bit of work with the P120 belt. I've spent as long as 25 to 30 minutes, from start to finish, on a single blade that was very dull. That includes progressing from P120, to X65, to x22, to X4 with 80% or more of that time spent on the P120.

You ask how can you be removing the sharpie, grinding the bevels, and NOT getting sharp? Easy: The cutting edge of the blade can be so dull as to be FLAT. It will look like this in cross section:

\_/

How can you check to see if I'm right? Stand under a bright light. Hold your blade with edge facing the ceiling so that if you brought it right up to your face the edge would cut your nose, chin, forehead. Now look down at the edge of the blade and slowly move the tip of the blade down towards the floor, and then up towards the ceiling. If your edge is flat, you will see a shiny reflective line on the edge. Sharp blades won't reflect light on their cutting edge. Dull ones will reflect light. The stronger and more obvious the reflection, the duller the blade.

With a blade in that condition you'll grind the sides (edge bevels) and remove ALL of the marker and you won't actually get a sharp edge until you bring the bevels in and slowly remove that flat edge. That just takes continued grinding at the same angle, until you remove enough metal to re-establish a sharp edge.

There's another way: Increase your edge angle and you'll form a sharp edge faster. It will be more obtuse, but it will form an edge.

I say stick with it on the coarse belt, check for reflection on the edge periodically, and keep grinding until it's gone. Once you can't see it any more, you're *right* there and about to form a burr.

The blades you are describing are quality and *will* make sharp edges. They are probably just more dull than you thought.

Good luck and post your results!

Brian.

I just bought the KO sharpener and having a tough time getting my blades sharp. I've been reading this post and others on this site and have determined my issue could very well be what is described in this particular post.

Here's a little background.
I'm sharpening mainly kitchen knives, nothing expensive and a couple filet knives. The blades are not nicked or messed up in any way-they are just dull. Do have a few pocket knives that need sharpening but have not attempted those yet. Want to concentrate on the kitchen knives first.

Here's the process I've used which is mainly according to the instructions.
At first I did not use the P120 belt and could never get any knife hair shaving sharp nor a very noticeable burr. I did use a sharpie and on the first pass at 20* it removed the sharpie so I figured I was good with the angle. I used each belt and made a min of 10-15 passes on each side at an angle of 20* as noted in the instructions. Since I was not getting the result I wanted, I changed the angle to 17.5 and did the same thing as before. Still not hair cutting sharp.

So I found this site and started reading. Found this post and I think the explanation that Brian gave may be my issue.
I do have a decent Victorinox chef's knife that is decently sharp but not hair shaving sharp. I went through the belts beginning with the X22 and finishing with the X4. Used a 20* angle but it made no difference. The blade felt sharper but would not slice an onion any better than before.

Since I am new to knife sharpening, I am guessing I need to change the angle to 15 and spend more time on the P120 belt and then progress through the belts. I've read in this post about increasing / decreasing the angle. Can someone explain the difference between each angle? Which angle would be best for slicing and chopping? I am not necessarily looking for a hair shaving knife but I do want a knife than can slice a tomato or onion with zero or minimal effort.

I received the KO on Friday and have played around with it for a total of 2-4 hrs and so for not happy with the sharpener. I do attribute my issues with user error and from reading the many posts / reviews on this site and others that the KO can achieve what i am after. The YouTube video's make it seem so easy to get a nice sharp edge and that's what I was expecting. Guess I should have known nothing is as easy as it appears.

So Brian or any one else, given what I have posted here, do you think I need to change the angle to 15* and start with the P120 and progress through each belt? Also, how would an inexperienced sharpener know when it's time to move to the next belt? Also there is mention about stiffer belts? Are those from WorkSharp or another site? I am planning to order the Econabrasive set that Amazon has for $39. Has anyone used those and if so are they worth it?
Thanks Eddie

 

[nola who_dat]

Sorry for the double post. Please delete if needed.

 

[bgentry]

At first I did not use the P120 belt and could never get any knife hair shaving sharp nor a very noticeable burr. I did use a sharpie and on the first pass at 20* it removed the sharpie so I figured I was good with the angle. I used each belt and made a min of 10-15 passes on each side at an angle of 20* as noted in the instructions.

Especially with dull knives, you really need to start with the P120. Kitchen knives that have been used for a long time can be shockingly dull. So dull you'd have to work hard to cut yourself with one. Try the reflected light technique I described above. If your edge reflects light, it's dull.

Since I was not getting the result I wanted, I changed the angle to 17.5 and did the same thing as before. Still not hair cutting sharp.

If your blade is dull, and it hasn't yet gotten sharp with a larger angle like 20 degrees, then lowering the angle to 17.5 won't help at all. It will only remove metal near the shoulder of the blade, as opposed to the apex (the part that cuts).

I do have a decent Victorinox chef's knife that is decently sharp but not hair shaving sharp. I went through the belts beginning with the X22 and finishing with the X4. Used a 20* angle but it made no difference. The blade felt sharper but would not slice an onion any better than before.

The x22 is a good finishing belt for kitchen cutlery. It's not a great place to start though, as it removes very little metal. Again, I'd start with the P120 and get that blade back into shape. That's what the low grit coarse belts are for: SHAPING the blade. You should do 70 to 90% of your work on the low grit belts. That way you grind and form the edge bevels, nice and flat and consistent, until they meet in the middle at a sharp apex. Even the edge from the P120 should be sharp. All of the belts after that are mostly for polishing the bevels that you SHAPED with the P120. This concept applies to all sharpening. You do most of the work with the coarse belt (or stone) and then polish it up from there with finer belts (or stones).

Can someone explain the difference between each angle? Which angle would be best for slicing and chopping?

Smaller angles yield a sharper overall blade. However, they are also less tough, and get dull faster. Sharpening to a low (small) angle will also take longer, as you have to remove more metal from the blade to reach the apex. 20 degrees is a decent starting point for kitchen knives. Stick with that angle until you can get edges that cleanly cut paper and shave hair.

Also, how would an inexperienced sharpener know when it's time to move to the next belt?

Excellent question! You should sharpen each side of the blade, spending at least 3 or 4 passes before switching sides. Every couple of passes, check to see if you have formed a burr. A burr is a curl of metal that forms on the OPPOSITE side of the blade from where you are grinding. So if you're grinding on the right side, the burr will form on the left. ONLY when you have formed a burr will you know that you have completely apexed the edge. You should form a full length burr on one side, then switch sides and do it again until you form a full length burr on the other side. This can take more time than you might expect, especially with extremely dull, used and abused blades. The burr is your indicator that you have finished forming the edge bevel on one side.

I should also mention that the speed setting of the WSKO makes a huge difference. I usually go right in the middle at speed 6 or 7 (out of 14). Speeds 1 through 3 are dramatically slower than 5 - 8. If you have really dull blades, you should really be at speed 5 at least. Just remember to check your progress frequently.

Also there is mention about stiffer belts? Are those from WorkSharp or another site? I am planning to order the Econabrasive set that Amazon has for $39. Has anyone used those and if so are they worth it?

I seem to be the only one jumping up and down about how great the stiff belts are. I like them a lot. WorkSharp sells them through their web site or via phone. They cost $4 to $5 each with around $8 in shipping. This forum thread discusses them somewhat and has a table at the end of all the new belts.

A couple of guys posted their impressions of the Econoway belts a while back and I wasn't impressed by what I read. I wouldn't personally bother with them, especially since the Norax belts from WorkSharp are so good!

Good luck,

Brian.

 

[cbwx34]

Great post bgentry!

I think it's hard for some to understand, with any sharpener, why it takes longer than expected, or longer than the directions say. The reality is, most knives are duller and take more work than most people realize. Your posts are very descriptive of what to really expect, and look for.

I seem to be the only one jumping up and down about how great the stiff belts are. I like them a lot.

I'm with you... I got some for the Blade Grinder Attachment... great belts. There's also a coarser belt avail. (X200 or P80 Norax) to take care of the "grunt" work.

 

[nola who_dat]

Brian, thanks for the reply. I did achieve a burr on each side using the P120 belt. It was at that point I switched belts and made the progression to the X4. After I finished with the P120 belt, it felt like the blade was getting to where i wanted it but the X22 belt seemed to make the blade more dull. It didn't progress to where i wanted it. I continued to work with the X22 but nothing seemed to work. I felt with the time I put in the blade should have been sharp enough to slice paper or shave hair but it's no where near that point. I think that's the part I get frustrated with.

Maybe I should increase the angle. I suppose I'm still doing something wrong and just don't know it.
Before I bought the KO, I felt it would be the easiest sharpener for a beginner vs getting a whetstone. Now I'm second guessing myself.
I'll continue to play with it for a couple more days to decide if I will keep it. If I decide to keep it, I may order some of the stiffer belts. Which ones would recommend?
Thanks again.
Eddie

 

[bgentry]

What are you using to test sharpness? I ask because you said the X22 made things worse, so I'm wondering what might be wrong.

I can think of a couple of things right off:

1. The stock belts are very flexible, which means they will kinda wrap the edge a bit. For *me* this led to the higher grit belts not making full contact with the edge, as I was pressing too hard with the coarse belts. I had to spend more time on the higher grit belts, and in some cases, slightly increase my edge angle for the last few belts. Keep in mind that I don't use the guide and do it all freehand, so my margin of error in the angle is probably higher than someone using the guide.

2. I like to form a burr on both sides of the blade with EVERY belt. That lets me know that I actually got to the edge of the edge. The burrs get smaller, and smaller, and smaller, so they are harder to detect, but they will form.

3. Deburring is extremely important. With a sharpener this powerful, you can end up with big floppy nasty burrs that hang on from belt to belt. Ideally, you want to deburr after each belt, so you start with a clean apex. At a bare minimum, you want to deburr fully after your last belt. I like to use a cork or piece of soft wood to draw the edge through. It seems to strip off most of the burr, and leaves me with a more clean edge for the belts. I always deburr at speed #1. Plus, because I'm doing it freehand, I lock the trigger in place. This has the side effect of running the belt slower than if you held the trigger down, as there is slack in the trigger. So speed #1 with the trigger held down is faster than speed #1 with the lock on. It's taken me quite a while to learn to deburr with the WSKO. It's more difficult for me than doing the same with bench stones.

I feel pretty confident that you can get screaming sharp edges with the WSKO. We just need to do a little troubleshooting.

Brian.

 

[nola who_dat]

I'm using computer paper to test sharpness. I'll try phone book paper tomorrow and see how that works.

I watched your YouTube video on free hand today. I think I will give that a try. Doesn't seem to be overly difficult. Only issue would be the angle. I'll have to estimate but I think I can get close to 20*.

I'll also try using a cork as you mentioned and demonstrated in your video.

Btw great video.
One other point. You mentioned the flexible belts. When using the guide I felt the blade was not making complete contact with the belt. I'm wondering if that was occurring and causing my issues.

I'll try the freehand way tomorrow and will report back.

If I end up keeping the KO I'll order some of the stiffer belts.

Again thanks for the info.

 

[nola who_dat]

One more note. The last time I attempted sharpening I did feel a burr using the p120 belt. I made it a point to check for a burr with each additional belt and I did notice one but not so much along the entire blade. Seems it was more prominent at some points than others.

 

[nola who_dat]

Went ahead and tried freehand this morning. Have a cheap kitchen knife that I used to practice. Started with the P120. Made 15 passes on one side. I could feel a "ridge" on the opposite side so I will assume that's a burr. Switched sides and made another 15 passes. At this point the blade was somewhat "choppy". What I mean by that is if I run the blade across a towel, it grabs. So I went ahead and made 5 more passes on each side but the blade was still choppy. At that point I made 10 alternating passes. The blade was smoother than before but still grabbed a little when passed over a towel.

I felt I would try the X65 belt. Started with 10 passes on each side. Did feel a small burr. Blade was fairly smooth but dull. Did 5 alternating passes then switched to the X22 belt. Again made 10 passes on each side. Small burr formed then made 5 alternating passes. Blade did not grab the towel but again still dull. This is the point I am currently at. Will continue working with the X22 belt but I really do not feel any progress is being made to get a sharp blade.

What I will say is I much prefer freehand vs using the guide. But still disappointed I have not been able to get a sharp blade or at east progress to a point where I feel the blade is getting sharp. Keep in mind this is my first time free-handing so the angle may not quite be at 20*. I have tried to keep it close but it could be off a bit.

 

[cbwx34]

One thing that might help,,, the bevel with a 20 ° convex should be wider than a flat angle (see this post for a description). So you may need to try a lower angle... you might have an actual angle higher than what you want, especially if you're using more pressure.

Another point... although when you make alternating passes you no longer feel the burr, you may still have a burr or wire edge that instantly fails when you actually start cutting. Try deburring with a pass or two with the 6000 belt and see if that helps.

 

[nola who_dat]

I'm at a loss. Still no better than before. Should I start with the P120 and try all over again?
Could it be I'm not taking enough metal off with the P120? Could the angle I am using be wrong? I've watched Brian's video and I feel I'm doing what he did and also the other video's I've watched.

 

[bgentry]

I think it's cool that you're trying a new method; and one that I think is vastly superior to using the guides. Without going point by point here are some thoughts:

When you first form a burr on the low grit belts, it will probably form in one area first and then grow along the edge until you have a full length burr from the heel all the way to the tip. If you don't have that, the entire edge isn't apexed yet. I'm not sure if you got a full length burr or not. Next, after you form a burr on one side and start grinding the other side, you should find that you form a burr MUCH faster than the first side. It's not unusual to spend 15 or 20 passes on one side, and then get a burr on the other side in just 3 or 4 passes. The key is to check for a burr every pass or two to see how you are progressing. Again, form a full length burr on the second side.

At that point the blade is shaped and can be made pretty darned sharp by properly deburring and perhaps a bit of stropping. A clean edge from the P120 should cleanly cut printer paper, but it will be "loud".

When you go to the next belts (X65, X22, etc), each successive belt should only take 2 to 5 passes to form a new smaller burr. Detecting burrs can be difficult when you first start. Smaller burrs are harder to feel or see. But you should get them with each belt. There's no need to do as many passes on the X65 as the P120. With every blade I've done, (give or take) it's only taken a handful of passes with each higher grit belt *after* the edge is formed with the low grit belt.

So how do you deburr correctly? Start with doing a few alternating passes with the speed set as low as it will go. I call that speed #1. Feel for a burr before and after. You will probably find that you are flipping the burr from side to side as you go. Use a light touch. Less than the weight of the blade is sometimes necessary. You can also *slightly* decrease your edge angle. That will make the edge contact *less* with the blade and will help remove the burr without forming it again on the other side. When you've reduced the burr or you think it's entirely gone, draw the blade through cork or soft wood. Do 3 or 4 passes through the cork. You should see metal left behind in the cork as gray or black. After your 3rd or 4th pass, it should leave a clean cut in the cork without any metal. Check for a burr again on both sides. If you feel one, try doing another light pass or two. Hopefully you'll make the burr very very small. Finish up with the cork always to do a final cleaning.

If you want to be very strict about this, deburr after EVERY belt. You should be able to get a clean edge from the P120, but it's pretty tough to deburr with it. Just try to reduce it as much as possible at each belt, and make it nearly undetectable on your last belt. You can stop at X22 for kitchen cutlery. But if you want to impress yourself, go to the X4 and you'll get a screaming sharp, hair popping, phonebook paper slicing edge. It probably won't hold up for long, but it will prove to you that you are doing it right and what the machine can do if you do your job.

Should you start over? Sure. You'll know right away if you apexed the edge. If the edge *is* apexed, you will literally do one pass on the P120 belt and form a full length burr. If you don't form a burr the first pass, all the way down the edge, with no gaps, then you weren't done yet and you should keep going until you *do* form a full length burr. If you have apexed the edge, then you'll progress through the 4 belts in a just a couple of minutes, forming a burr on each side with each new belt.

I suspect you just need to deburr correctly, but you also might have missed a spot or two on the blade with the first belt. It's hard to say trying to diagnose this via forum text.

Keep at it and I know you'll get it. You might need to walk away a time or two, perhaps even overnight. But you'll get it.

Best of luck and report back!

Brian.

 

[nola who_dat]

Brian, thanks again for answering. I kind of feel bad for the issues I am having and hijacking this thread. I may just go ahead and start my own thread about these issues as I don't want to overtake the OP's thread.

I found another cheap knife with a SS blade that I felt I wanted to practice on. This knife has never been sharpened as is the case for most of my other knives. Still trying freehand so started with the P120 belt. After 5 passes, no real imminent burr so continued for 5 more. Could feel a small burr forming but not across the length of the blade. So made another 5 passes. Ended up making 30 passes each way and there is a burr but it's not real big. So I wasn't sure if i needed to continue or just move to the next belt. After the 30 passes on one side and then switch to the other side and make 30 passes, is that considered deburring? Guess I'm a bit confused still with the burr and how to deburr correctly and about the apex. I can say that after making 60 passes the blade is choppy as it will catch when passing it over a towel. So I'm not sure if that's the way the blade is supposed to be or not. I did run the blade through a cork, it felt smooth but I could see the blade had remnants of the cork due to the choppiness of the blade.

I can tell that I am removing metal as there is a lot of metal dust on the towel that I have under the sharpener. I feel that once I made a total of 60 passes that I was ready to move on to the X65 but just wasn't sure if I needed to spend more time with the X65 or not.

When one deburrs after every belt is that using the same belt or is that using another belt to deburr?

There has to be something I am still doing wrong as the video's Ive seen make it look much easier than it actually is. I do really prefer the freehand way and may never go back to using the guide. At this point I am really frustrated as I feel no progress is being made in achieving a blade that can slice through paper with no effort.

Again, thanks to Brian and all others who posted.

BTW I can see how it is next to impossible to try and diagnose a problem by forum text. Some of the things I described may not be totally accurate since I am still new and not affluent with all terminology.

 

[chado skins]

don't feel bad, your questions are exactly why this thread was made! i was having a lot of the same issues as you... today i sharpened 5 knives, some i have had on this system, one filet knife new to this setup. i was able to get all the knives respectably sharp. they will pop a few a hairs. not clean shave my arm though.. one thing that helped me today was changing the belts. i have been on the same ones for a couple months now, even though WS says a set can sharpen over 100 knives, i noticed a clear difference when changing the x65 and x 22. i was able to bring all the knives back using just x65 and x22. and using the low speed. i'm going to skip the x4 belt on this run and see how the edges hold up to everyday use. i also dialed down all my angles to 15 degrees. i have not noticed any decrease in performance, the edges don't chip etc due to lower angle. these knives will cleanly cut tomatoes and onions. 2 weeks seems to be the lifetime of a tomato cutting edge in my world of usage. dam i cut a lot of tomatoes lol

took me a while to get used to the setup... one set of belts later, i feel a lot more confident in sharpening knives on it. the knives that have seen action on this sharpener don't take long to bring back. i like that a lot! i use the guides unless the knife doesn't fit in them. i like knowing i'm getting the right angle every time, and not just guessing. i clean them after every knife or if the dust is noticeable. it will leave marks on your knives and i don't feel like taping them all up.

i could be wrong, but i don't see anything wrong with deburring with the next level belt. IOW's, you've formed a burr on one side with p120, your first pass on the other side will remove the first burr. after you form a burr on the second side, you're ready to move to x65, the first pass on the other side will take off the burr. by the time you get to x4, just finish the knife with an alternating pass on the last stroke to remove any potentional burr formed... although there probably won't be one with the x4

 

[nola who_dat]

I received the KO on Friday so I've spent a few hours on it over the weekend. I started with the guide but didnt feel the blade was making enough contact with the belt. So I watched Brian's video on freehand and tried that yesterday. I much prefer that but the problem is the angle. I've estimated I'm at 22 or 22.5 but that could be off. Not too worried about it as I just use these knives for personal use, chopping / slicing onions, tomatoes, etc. I dont really need to have a blade that will shave hair but it would be nice just to say I did it. I just want something that will slice a tomato with little effort.

Back to the sharpener. I thought free handing would help but so far it hasn't. I didn't really have a chance to mess with it yesterday but will give it a try again tonight. If I decide to keep the KO i'll order the stiffer belts that Brian mentioned in his post but for now the ones that came with it will have to do.

It's really frustrating not being able to get a knife sharp. Hard to determine if the angle is the culprit but it has to be something minor and it's just a matter of figuring it out. I'm doubting the purchase now and feel maybe I should have went with whetstones or something. I surely do not want to spend an hour on one knife every time it needs to be sharpened. Granted these knives were dull but they still cut with some effort. The only really dull knife is the filet knife but I have not tried to sharpen it yet.

Anyways, I'll give it another try tonight and see what happens.

 

[nola who_dat]

Another attempt, another failure. I'm at a loss. Spent another hour on two knives. Started with the P120 went through X22. Still no sharper than before. One knife is so dull it would not slice paper.
Would whetstones be easier?
I need something that would put a good edge on a knife to chop / slice veggies, something that would cut meat. Don't need a restaurant quality sharpness but definitely something more than what i have.
The X22 and X4 is already showing signs of wear along the edges.