Zt 0801cf

[Kai Corp.]

Well of course the dates on my 2 posts change the reply. We could have shipped a small batch many weeks ago, but held off till more were produced. We're building more now, so hopefully won't be much longer, and the larger 1st run size will be in play.

 

[Lee D]

We're building more now, so hopefully won't be much longer, and the larger 1st run size will be in play.

:thumbup:

 

[RamZar]

That is a "limited edition". Am I missing something here?

I've spoken on this many times, and am unsure we're suffering from an "identity crisis". We're an evolving brand that is just looking to make good all around knives for a variety of users. I believe our current identity has captured that. We're really not trying to be known for 1 specific genre, but when we see a pattern that we feel will be embraced by customers, whether that be existing or not, we'll go for it. If that brings on a identity, well then it will be what it will be. Our goal is to just keep bringing on really solid knives.

There is a lot of exciting projects and changes for the now and the near future with ZT. I feel confident that there will be really a lot of positivity with our future plans.

Yea you know, I don't like giving hard #'s and dates any more. No surprise there. The 077CF will be out very soon. Whether your order will be allocated is beyond my knowledge. There will be a pretty good sized 1st run when it hits the streets.

Thomas

Well of course the dates on my 2 posts change the reply. We could have shipped a small batch many weeks ago, but held off till more were produced. We're building more now, so hopefully won't be much longer, and the larger 1st run size will be in play.

I think there's a difference between "Limited Edition" and "Limited Production". Personally, ZT 0560CBCF falls into the latter category and the secondary market pricing, which in many cases are lower than the primary, attest to that.

The "Identity Crisis" that ZT is "suffering" through can be looked at from three viewpoints: KAI, dealers and customers. When you go through a 6 year period from inception catering solely to the "Hard-use Built-like-a-tank" it's difficult to broaden the base without alienating the core initial base (many threads on this from last year). Personally, I commend what ZT for what it has accomplished the past year with the limited editions, smaller folders and even a full titanium (0801). Hopefully, one day you'll cater to those limited to 3 inch (or less) folders.

It's good to hear that the first batch of the 0770CF folders will be a "substantial" quantity!

 

[bld522]

Well of course the dates on my 2 posts change the reply. We could have shipped a small batch many weeks ago, but held off till more were produced. We're building more now, so hopefully won't be much longer, and the larger 1st run size will be in play.

That's what I was hoping to hear. As far as I'm concerned, it's better to wait a little longer and have enough to go around than have them show up and not be able to get one. Thanks.

 

[Kai Corp.]

I think there's a difference between "Limited Edition" and "Limited Production". Personally, ZT 0560CBCF falls into the latter category and the secondary market pricing, which in many cases are lower than the primary, attest to that.

Sounds like you're splitting hairs here. Is there a number total and the secondary market needs to soar to catagorize as you say? Meh...

The "Identity Crisis" that ZT is "suffering" through can be looked at from three viewpoints: KAI, dealers and customers. When you go through a 6 year period from inception catering solely to the "Hard-use Built-like-a-tank" it's difficult to broaden the base without alienating the core initial base (many threads on this from last year).

Disagree, plus I don't think the forums are a good example of our core customer. FWIW, I haven't heard squat one from dealers with regards to all of this.

Hopefully, one day you'll cater to those limited to 3 inch (or less) folders.

As I've said, it's a genre, just not one with a lot of volume to it. We'll get there, and we'll see how it goes. Don't be surprised though...

 

[Stays Sharp]

Limited editions are usually a one time deal. There are exceptions like the popular Tilt getting another run. But most of the time, it's one and done like the BM Gold Class, true Spyderco sprints, and the ZT CBCF. They made plenty CBCF's but they were limited edition nonetheless.

Examples of Limited productions are the Spyderco Ti Millie, Left handed Millie, BM 940CF, Damascus Skyline, Wilson Starbenza... Made in batches or runs. Limited availability, but not permanently removed from the lineup.

There's no solid rule between them but that's my take on it.

 

[RamZar]

Hopefully, one day you'll cater to those limited to 3 inch (or less) folders.

As I've said, it's a genre, just not one with a lot of volume to it. We'll get there, and we'll see how it goes. Don't be surprised though...

No worries. I'll just be pleasantly shocked if/when I see one!

I still think there's a product gap between high-end Kershaw and smaller ZT folders with premium material.

 

[Scurvy092]

Zt produces too many Le's to satisfy demand and people compassion that there are too many and the secondary prices are low.

Zt produces too few and people complain that there aren't enough and secondary prices are too high.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

 

[jstn]

FWIW Thomas, you guys are doing an awesome job. I have no complaints, have had excellent experiences with your warranty department, and appreciate the innovation and great value ZT brings to the table.

I am getting married in June, and have already explained to my wife-to-be that there will be a few large knife purchases in our future with the 562CF, 620, and 620CF coming out, and to be ready Hope you guys keep putting out great stuff!

 

[grownstar]

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

No s*@t, right?

 

[RamZar]

Limited editions are usually a one time deal. There are exceptions like the popular Tilt getting another run. But most of the time, it's one and done like the BM Gold Class, true Spyderco sprints, and the ZT CBCF. They made plenty CBCF's but they were limited edition nonetheless.

Examples of Limited productions are the Spyderco Ti Millie, Left handed Millie, BM 940CF, Damascus Skyline, Wilson Starbenza... Made in batches or runs. Limited availability, but not permanently removed from the lineup.

There's no solid rule between them but that's my take on it.

The true limited editions from Benchmade and Spyderco have an announced quantity. For example, Benchmade 586-142 Mini-Barrage with a 200 Piece Limited Edition run and Spyderco C81CFPE2 – Para Military 2 Carbon Fiber CPM 154/CPM S90V composite blade with 300 produced.

ZT no longer announces the quantity in limited edition runs mostly due to the 0560CBCF when the initial announced run of 1,000 ballooned to 1,500 and there were cries of foul.

 

[RamZar]

Regarding the limited edition 0801CF I certainly hope to see a good 1,500 of them produced so that everyone gets one and there won't be an initial mad dash to pay exorbitant secondary market pricing like in May of last year for the 0560CBCF.

You can still find 0600, 0600BLK and 0560CBCF at reasonable prices. That's not the case for 0777, 0777-M390, 0777-M390BLK and 0888 but it should be noted that they were very limited numbers produced.

 

[miltmaldo]

Well it's music to my ears to hear that ZT might be doing something with the 3inch blade . My Techno and my 755 need some competition . :applause:

 

[PURPLEDC]

No worries. I'll just be pleasantly shocked if/when I see one!

I still think there's a product gap between high-end Kershaw and smaller ZT folders with premium material.

I got to agree. And the identity crisis theory is sorta true from my perspective because I have seen ZT do things over the years that I thought they would never do. Like for instance when they first came out the brand was sorta touted as a military/law enforcment brand of which would have limited dealer distribution and fixed pricing. And it seemed the knives were for hard used tactical only. Now we are seeing more knives with some finesse too them. I dont know if I would call it a "crisis" but some things they have done have been surprising.

As a customer living in a not so knife friendly state I would love to see some sub 3" bladed ZT's. Unfortunately though when i do see smaller variants being made they change other things about the knife that made me want it to begin with. I wish they could do the hinderer thing and make identical models in various sizes. Not all but some.

Zt produces too many Le's to satisfy demand and people compassion that there are too many and the secondary prices are low.

Zt produces too few and people complain that there aren't enough and secondary prices are too high.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

And its always going to be that way. When you make a successful product especially with items that are collectable passions for that product are going to develop. There is no such thing as pleasing everyone. No matter the choice being made people will want to profess their support or lack of support for that decision. Expecting them not to I think is a bit unrealistic. The key here is how a company chooses to respond to the feedback. I think every company should do their best to develop some thick skin and do their best to ignore that of which they dislike.

 

[Apec]

Zt produces too many Le's to satisfy demand and people compassion that there are too many and the secondary prices are low.

Zt produces too few and people complain that there aren't enough and secondary prices are too high.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

I personally don't mind either situation, though I could live easily without the LEs. In fact, there's nothing wrong with the first situation - it would take a punch out of those people who solely buy LE knives to flip them for gain.

Regardless, I will be looking forward to new offerings in ZT's regular lineup. I do wish the tomahawk's head wasn't skeletonized though.

 

[ToxicBot11]

Zt produces too many Le's to satisfy demand and people compassion that there are too many and the secondary prices are low.

Zt produces too few and people complain that there aren't enough and secondary prices are too high.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Before the CBCF,s came out they advertised for a year that approximately 1,000 CBCF's were to be made then wound up making 1,500..I'm not sure how you define "approximately" but in my book 1,500 is not "approximately" close to 1,000..

That was the issue, they advertised for a year one thing, then turned around and did another..

They could have have advertised they were going to make 5,000 CBCF's and actually made that many and that would have been fine..

 

[bld522]

So what's the beef? Did producing 1500 CBCF's create a quality control problem that wouldn't have occurred if they had only made 1,000 of them? Did it make them less valuable than if they had only made 1,000?

 

[RamZar]

So what's the beef? Did producing 1500 CBCF's create a quality control problem that wouldn't have occurred if they had only made 1,000 of them? Did it make them less valuable than if they had only made 1,000?

No QC issues.

It was more a matter of people overpaying for the secondary market pricing since everyone thought 1,000 pieces would be it and they'd miss out. Had everyone known that it was going to be 1,500 pieces people would have patiently waited and paid MAP or below pricing instead of MAP to MSRP+.

MSRP was $425 and MAP was $340.

Anyway, either one announces a set number of pieces for limited editions like Benchmade & Spyderco and sticks to it or just don't announce. ZT has taken the latter path.

 

[bld522]

Yes, that makes sense. Then again, a manufacturer is not bound to make only a set number of pieces unless they GUARANTEE that they will only make that number of pieces. And the adverb "approximately" is a matter of perspective just like the adverb "soon" is. When it comes to dealing with ZT (and a lot of other knife makers as well, I might add), those kinds of words should taken with a large grain of salt!

 

[RamZar]

The 801CF is a spectacular knife, and will be out next month.

Really looking forward to getting my ZT 0801CF this month. I preordered with two sources during Blade Show in May 31-June 2, 2013. Hope it still looks like the prototype in every detail and feature.

TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS

• Made in the USA
• Frame lock, with hardened steel lockbar insert
• Reversible, deep-carry pocketclip
• Steel: M390
• Handle: Titanium, bronze PVD coating, carbon fiber inserts
• Blade length: 3.5 in. (8.9 cm)
• Closed length: 4.7 in. (11.9 in.)
• Overall length: 8.2 in. (20.8 cm)
• Weight: 5.7 oz.