A reality check for most makers

Hi Les-

I was simply quoting Martin, as I thought it was kind'a funny and applied to the "massive" threads we've had here lately. :)
 
Hi Delbert,

I hear you. If I was selling Mokume I would have to speak up and support it.

Camels will be around long after I am gone as well...doesn't mean they should their bones should be put on a knife.

What percentage of your Mokume is sold to custom knife makers in the US..for knives, not pens or rings,etc?

I am seeing much more demand for Timascus as a bolster or spacer material now than Mokume.

Different materials are tried for knives, steels, bolster material, scale or handle material, etc. Some catch on for the long term, some are fads...like Mokume. Doesn't mean that some makers don't use it...however, it is just not something that is seen as much as it was say 4 years ago.

I'll be judging the custom knife competition this year. I'll bet you a coke, I won't need both hands to count how many knives incorporate Mokume that are submitted for that particular competition. No I don't deduct points for the use of Mokume. LOL

Your business is to make and sell Mokume.

My business is to track custom knife trends and look for current indicators and future indicators as to what custom knife buyers will want.

BTW, how many knives each year do you personally buy that have Mokume on them?

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
Hi Nick,

LOL, I knew you were quoting him. He is right to a degree. Which is why we have so many massive threads. Everyone has an opinion.

It is amazing how passionate people can get about their knives and their collections.

That is one of the things I love about custom knives! The passion.

Les Robertson
 
Les Robertson said:
Hi Delbert,

I hear you. If I was selling Mokume I would have to speak up and support it.

Thank you I appreciate that acknowledgement

Camels will be around long after I am gone as well...doesn't mean they should their bones should be put on a knife.

What percentage of your Mokume is sold to custom knife makers in the US..for knives, not pens or rings,etc?

A very small one since I usually only make it upon request, though I usually keep a bit of it around.

I am seeing much more demand for Timascus as a bolster or spacer material now than Mokume.

They really did hit on a good I dea there didn't they, I expect that one won't be a "fad"

Different materials are tried for knives, steels, bolster material, scale or handle material, etc. Some catch on for the long term, some are fads...like Mokume. Doesn't mean that some makers don't use it...however, it is just not something that is seen as much as it was say 4 years ago.

I'll be judging the custom knife competition this year. I'll bet you a coke, I won't need both hands to count how many knives incorporate Mokume that are submitted for that particular competition. No I don't deduct points for the use of Mokume. LOL

Your business is to make and sell Mokume.

Yes, mostly rings now, and that business is smokin' hot

My business is to track custom knife trends and look for current indicators and future indicators as to what custom knife buyers will want.

BTW, how many knives each year do you personally buy that have Mokume on them?

Well, since I havn't bought a knife in, oh, about 10 years, I would have to say its not measurable.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
Click to expand...


Les,
Thank you for responding to my post, and in such a lenthy manner. I was curious what your response would be and I must say I am quite pleased.
I put my own responses to your questions to me in bold to seperate them from the rest of your post, I do take enjoyment from reading your posts.
Thank you,
Del
 
Hi Delbert,

You are welcome.

I am here to learn just like everyone else. That is why I asked the business oriented questions.

Special orders for Mokume...Custom Mokume if you will. Im sure you enjoy making that.

I appreciate you taking the time to answer.

I did know that Mokume is very hot in the jewelery sector, so it appears you positioned yourself correctly in that market.

Im glad you get some enjoyment from my posts. I try to inject some humor into most of them...however it doesn't come across that way sometimes.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
ptgdvc said:
The truth of the matter is that, the work of a majority of custom knife makers, is simply not worth the time and effort to critique, or to collect.
Click to expand...

I'm not a knife maker, so I'm going to comment on this from the perspective of simply a buyer/collector.

And I'm going to start by simply saying that you are basing your post on a faulty assumption. You are asserting that the any knife which isn't of a certain minimum (but undefined) level of quality isn't worth the effort to critique or collect. I disagree with this on both parts.

With regards to critiquing, anyone who's learning needs to be critiqued, else they won't be able to recognize all of the flaws that exist. It's a simple fact that many (most?) people are poor critics of their own work, at least in the eyes of other people (who will be looking at the knife from a very different perspective). I'm more than willing to provide criticism, if I think I'm capable, and someone is asking for it. If it makes them a better knife maker, then I'm happy to help.

With regards to collecting, there are a great many people who purchase custom knives in order to get a knife that meets their specific desires, as opposed to something they think will appreciate in value. In this case, they are looking for a level of quality that meets their needs, along with a cost that meets their finances. Finding this balance is made much easier by the difference in quality and ability of different knife makers. Being able to get an inexpensive knife in a design that I specify from a less mature knife maker may be a trade-off I'm willing to make to get the knife that I want, even if it isn't as perfect as a more expensive knife might be.

Different levels of experience is a good thing, and people selling slightly imperfect knives and lesser prices is also a good thing. Watching the custom knives for sale here, I see a much greater number sold in the $80-$250 range than I see in the $250+ range. Sure, the quality on a knife that costs $1000 is probably going to be greater than that of a $150 knife, but there's a lot more people who can afford $150 on a knife than $1000.

To each their own. Don't try to dictate what is good enough to sell. The market will do that quite nicely.
 
oh les, i am not a troll

to quote one of your favorite people "I post in anonimity to avoid wasting my time." :)

i just like to confirm the validity of people's statements so as to give it appropriate weight.

as it has been correctly pointed out, you do not need an advanced degree to run most businesses.

however, if you are going to use business terms and concepts to support your arguements, it is important to use them correctly and in their proper context.

how about giving an actual example of how you use beta...with some actual numbers and what the numbers mean to you?


and as you say "everyone's opinion is welcome. However you have to check the source of the information". i can not agree more

you give a variety of knife-buying, business, tax, and investment advice here. some of it is excellent, unfortunately some of it makes me cringe

you frequently utilize your MBA and military experience to support your positions.

you relate 5 1/2 years of experience with the 101st and also served with an intelligence unit as a company commander per another post here.

how long did you serve after the 101st?

it would help me to understand who is best qualified to make such statements
 
Bandaidman, I’d also like to see some actual long term and short term mathematical equations, calculations, graphs etc., that forecast which of the current established trends will lose ground or peak out, when and to what degree, which new trends are emerging,… and the future of knives with brass fittings from a global market perspective.
 
I’d also like to have a look into the database and see if it’s sufficient.
 
after reading most of this thread, i would have to say there are some collectors that i wouldnt sell one of my knives to. i dont consider my knives collectors pieces, i consider them a tool. i make a knife to be used and not sit in some drawer or safe. i have close friends wanting to buy one of my knives because i show them whatever knife i happen to be working on and they see what i put into making them. i have one friend that has been bugging me for years to make him a knife. i told him when he gets ready to help make it then he'll get his knife. that way he can appreciate the knife more and see exactly what goes into making one. if some of these collectors would actually take the time and make a knife then maybe they would have as much respect for the new makers as they do for the well known makers.
 
Les Robertson said:
Hi Delbert,

I hear you. If I was selling Mokume I would have to speak up and support it.

Camels will be around long after I am gone as well...doesn't mean they should their bones should be put on a knife.

What percentage of your Mokume is sold to custom knife makers in the US..for knives, not pens or rings,etc?

I am seeing much more demand for Timascus as a bolster or spacer material now than Mokume.

Different materials are tried for knives, steels, bolster material, scale or handle material, etc. Some catch on for the long term, some are fads...like Mokume. Doesn't mean that some makers don't use it...however, it is just not something that is seen as much as it was say 4 years ago.

I'll be judging the custom knife competition this year. I'll bet you a coke, I won't need both hands to count how many knives incorporate Mokume that are submitted for that particular competition. No I don't deduct points for the use of Mokume. LOL

Your business is to make and sell Mokume.

My business is to track custom knife trends and look for current indicators and future indicators as to what custom knife buyers will want.

BTW, how many knives each year do you personally buy that have Mokume on them?

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
Click to expand...

I think Mokume still has a place, it was never as mainstream as damascus, SS or NS, and it never will be, but WD Pease's currently made danglers pretty much all have Mokume bolsters and they sell like hotcakes, and that's just one, quick example, so, I don't see Mokume as being dead just yet, it works on some knives, but its never been as mainstream a material as SS, NS or damascus for bolsters. I kind of like it in moderation and on certain knives.

On the other hand, I don't like giraffe bone on knives, but, that doesn't mean you can't. :)
 
Hey Meg,

Mokume has a place, Giraffe Bone has a place, brass has a place. All of these have their place in custom knives.

As I have stated before, I make this posts:

1) to inform people...example if you buy a knife with camel bone...don't expect to get your money back.

2) to inform collectors that there is no reason to contact me by phone, by email or worse at a show (where time is limited) wanting to sell or trade me a knife with Mokume, Giraffe Bone, Camel Bone, Brass, etc.

I suspect you have never been called a FU***NG A$$H*LE because you wouldn't buy a knife or take a knife in trade. Worse yet, being the first person to inform a collector that you are just not interested in their knife at any price. I have...on more than one occasion.

Hold on now I know some of you are thinking "are sure they just weren't commenting on what they thought of you...knives aside?" :D Oddly enough I would have much less of a problem with that. Because it didn't waste my time. Someone made a comment and kept walking....as long as they don't mind me reciprocating.:D

I deal in the 80% range (those knives that if properly priced, right materials and design elements) have a chance for resale...and a great chance of being sold again, and again.

In the 90's I had knives made with Amber, Fossil Dino Bone (one of the coolest knife handle materials out there), Jade, Tiger's Eye, Jasper, Lapis, etc.

These handle materials were considered by some to be "out there". To this day I think those knives were some of the most Beautiful I have ever seen.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
So Les, no exceptions to the giraffe bone rule? :)

CFF_2010.jpg
 
I certainly don't look for giraffe bone on a knife, however IMO it's a mistake to totally rule it out as some looks good and it's durable.

Below is a Jerry Lairson example.

2927_4_b.jpg
 
Les Robertson said:
Guys,

Feel free to spend your money in whatever way you see fit.

I'll bet both knives were orders.

Who in their right mind would but $1.00 worth of handle material on a $2,000 folder??? :D

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
Click to expand...

Les, I bought the Lairson Bowie from Knife Art in May 2002 for $850.00 and sold it thought Blade Gallery in Nov 2005 receiving $1036 after consignment fee for a profit of $186. Perhaps the market was a little kinder for giraffe pieces at that time. ;) But it is a very nice piece, better than the photo gives credit for.
 
Hi Kevin,

You did well indeed, buying a $550 bowie from knife art for $850 and then finding someone else to buy it for even more...Amazing. I'll bet Blade Gallery wouldn't give close to what it sold it for on a trade in today.

How many Giraffe Bone Handled knives are in your collection now?? :D

You are correct, 6 years ago Stag was drying up and makers were looking for the "next" thing. They found it...Giraffe bone.

Amazing, a $1,000 plus knife with $3,00 worth of handle material on it.

Quality of the work is not in question. In 2002 Jerry using Giraffe bone is not in question.

What is in question is using that material on knives today.

Again, how many knives do you have on order with Giraffe bone??

Let me see if I can tell the future again....0, none, nada!

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
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