Backpacking equipment--deodorant over knife?

[Dannyboy Leather]

Post expired.

 

[guns_and_labs]

Now I suppose I'll have to try other brands. It's not like testing deodorant flammability is difficult, but it could be costly.

Can't you just look for the "don't use near a flame" warning?

Old Spice happens to be what I use, so it was the first one I thought of. It burns nicely. Might provide nice mood lighting for a snow cave, instead of the little candle stub I usually take.

 

[nemoaz]

I've got to agree. I've never gone on a long thru hike, but a friend of my parents has hiked the AT at least five times ... As much time as he spent in the woods and as much as he loves the outdoors, he has very little knowledge or skills of any of the topics discussed on this or any other survival forum.

Exactly.

If Professor Deodorant made the point that he had special skills, and could, in an emergency easily make fire with his bootlace and a bit of wood, but cautioned others to evaluate their own levels of preparedness, I'd buy the argument that Professor Deodorant is just a guy with mad skills. Apparently far greater than Dr Ron Hood--the guy who trains the guys who train our elite forces-- or Ray Mears-- the guy who trains the guys who trains the real SAS-- since those apparently misinformed types still think a knife and firesteel is a good thing to bring along when in the field.

Again, my concern isn't about UL hiking. I've had a few debates here about people being gear whores and carrying too much and especially with SAR "trackers" (I use that term loosely because some are piss poor at it) being too loaded down to be useful. Nor do I have a concern about mailing supplies. Obviously, no one can survive indefinitely (without resorting to things like hunting or trapping which can't be done on the AT). My concern is about the specifics of this guys foolhardy recommendations.

 

[razorsdescent]

If i ran into a guy like that in the woods and he asked to borrow a knife i would let him grudgingly, if afterwords i asked him why he didnt have a knife and he belittled me in any way you would probably hear about me on the 12 oclock news.

 

[Gadgetaholic]

I can't stop thinking about this idea of not carrying a knife and just borrowing one if needed. If you had read the article and seen his picture and then came across him on a trail and he asked if he could borrow a knife then what would you say?

It does occur to me that when I go for a walk for exercise (most mornings) I walk for an hour on a 6km loop from home back to home - I carry as little as possible. Of course I don't worry about camping overnight or meals or anything so I really don't need much gear at all. But I do carry a knife, to keep weight down it is this knife: http://www.agrussell.com/ag-russell-ultimate-pen-knife---titanium/p/RUS-P3TIB/
Now, for walking for days and camping overnight I would prefer something like a SAK with a plain edge blade & saw & can opener & bottle opener. But if I was fanatical about reducing the weight of my gear then I would still add a knife even if it was just the little AG Russell Ultimate Pen Knife - damn the 0.2oz!

 

[lk3331]

if everybody followed his ideas they would all be screwed.

 

[Gadgetaholic]

if everybody followed his ideas they would all be screwed.

LOL:
Person A: "Can I borrow a knife, they are too heavy for me to have one myself?"
Person B: "Oh, I don't carry one, I like to pack light!"
Person C: "I don't have a knife either, I do have some deodorant though"

 

[x39]

LOL:
Person A: "Can I borrow a knife, they are too heavy for me to have one myself?"
Person B: "Oh, I don't carry one, I like to pack light!"
Person C: "I don't have a knife either, I do have some deodorant though"

Person D: "Certainly, although I broke the blade off it to save weight."

 

[attej]

I can't stop thinking about this idea of not carrying a knife and just borrowing one if needed.

At my favourite spot, just a short drive and hike from where I live, I can easily spend a couple of days at a "popular" camp site without seeing anyone. And thats on-season. During winter, I could spend weeks at those woods without seeing a single person. Who would I borrow a knife (or anything else) from?

So I guess it comes down to; what kind of backpacking one does, and where. On a well-marked ready made crowded trail - maybe one doesnt need a knife. Maybe deodorant really is better in all that crowd. I have no right to say how people should enjoy the outdoors, but... I guess this kind of hiking has little to do with "Wilderness and survival"

 

[Wanderlust]

First off I just want to say that I have not been able to read all of these posts yet, but I will. Next I want to weigh into this discussion from a Backpacker and Hiker point of view. I have spent many a night in my tent on a trail someplace in the middle of nowhere and have never done so without a knife or at least two ways to make fire. Ok so like everybody else I find it insane that this gentleman does not carry a knife but on the other hand I know and have spent a lot of time in the woods with very competent people who do not carry a knife or anything more then a SAK. This is more due to the fact that A. they don't need it with today's advancement of freeze dried and prepackaged food and B. What good would it be for them to carry a knife? They do not have the skills to use one in a survival situation anyways so it wouldn't do them much good. The same idea goes with a map and compass, I feel it is insanity to head out into the woods without these two critical pieces of equipment, but if you don't know how to use them they are just dead weight. Now the fire thing, I really want to know how this guys starts his stove. Every backpacker that I know carries at least one fire source, usually a mini bic, to at least light his/her stove to have dinner.

Now my advice to any new hiker is to not go out alone, go with somebody experienced your first couple of times because it can be dangerous and its a lot more fun if you're with people who know what they are doing. Also do what I did thin your pack out from experience. When I first started I would carry everything I thought I would ever need, now I have learned that I don't need some things and I leave them at home, or I have figured out how to make one thing do many things.

I also found a very interesting article from REI. REI sells and markets to the ultra light crowd and here is their list for the top Ten Essentials that every hiker and backpacker should have on them, for a day hike or through hike, no matter what. This list includes: navigation, fire, and a multi-tool such as a SAK. Even most of the ultra lighters out there think you need these basic things.

These are just a few of my thoughts YMMV.

 

[JSmith88]

Even though I am one of those hated UL guys, I use the weight savings from my Big 3 to allow me to carry a fire starting kit, my trail fly rod for fishing, a Mora, and sometimes an axe.

I still come in under a 30 pound pack. I don't bust on others because of what they choose to carry, although the guy on the AT in 06 with the box dolly was a little much.

 

[Cpl Punishment]

No, if you go out prepared, you're not one of those "hated" ultralighters.

If you go out unprepared, preaching your superiority with plans to mooch what you're "too good" to carry, then you're one of "those" hated ultralighters.

 

[Bushman5]

Person D: "Certainly, although I broke the blade off it to save weight."

or Person E: "i drilled holes in my knife to save weight"

No, if you go out prepared, you're not one of those "hated" ultralighters.

If you go out unprepared, preaching your superiority with plans to mooch what you're "too good" to carry, then you're one of "those" hated ultralighters.

BINGO! +1

 

[Ramm9]

If you go out unprepared, preaching your superiority with plans to mooch what you're "too good" to carry, then you're one of "those" hated ultralighters.

You just said a mouth full...+1

 

[Gadgetaholic]

I also found a very interesting article from REI. REI sells and markets to the ultra light crowd and here is their list for the top Ten Essentials that every hiker and backpacker should have on them, for a day hike or through hike, no matter what. This list includes: navigation, fire, and a multi-tool such as a SAK. Even most of the ultra lighters out there think you need these basic things.

Holy crap!
That is a lot of common sense on one page!

I think a good SAK can be your only knife if you want to carry light or it can be a bloody useful backup if you are carrying a decent knife already. You can get small & light SAKs but I would advise anyone to consider something like a Huntsman or Ranger - big blade, small blade, saw, scissors, can opener, bottle opener, etc. Talk about a lot of useful tools in one compact package! It is hard to beat a good SAK in terms of number of tools for the weight carried. I keep the blades on my SAK 'shaving sharp' and they are actually pretty capable for a lot of knife duties. I would personally throw a Mora into my pack as my main knife and carry a good SAK as a backup knife/tool kit. I think the gear can still be light enough without leaving out important essentials.

 

[beef]

I also found a very interesting article from REI. REI sells and markets to the ultra light crowd and here is their list for the top Ten Essentials that every hiker and backpacker should have on them, for a day hike or through hike, no matter what. This list includes: navigation, fire, and a multi-tool such as a SAK. Even most of the ultra lighters out there think you need these basic things.

These are just a few of my thoughts YMMV.

That's a good article, and the video is great! The technique of throwing the bag from person to person really keeps the energy flowing. I like the idea of emergency gear that requires little to no skill too.

 

[tradja]

Before we get into another "ultralight" thread that needs to be moderated by closing it down lets get some perspective.

This "pack light" mindset comes mostly from trekkers hiking the long trails in a single season. They are not doing an overnight or a few days, they are hiking substantial miles almost every day for months. Some here on BF have hiked these in a season and it is a serious outdoor accomplishment. For those that are not aware, the USA long trails are:

The Appalachian Trail Georgia to Main 2,160 miles

The Continental Divide Trail Canada to Mexico 3,100 miles

The Pacific Crest Trail Canada to Mexico 2,650 miles

The AT is pretty well worn, the others are far different. Google them to see the routes and terrain. When you need to pack an ice ax and crampons you are not going for a walk in the park.

I've been fortuanate enough to thru-hike all 3.

AT: SAK Tinker. Overkill and barely used in 6 months.
PCT first time: SAK Classic. Useful, mostly for cutting toenails.
PCT second time: SAK Classic. Same as first.
CDT: My first thru-hike as a knife nut. Murray Carter necker. :thumbup: A joy to carry and use, but definitely a luxury. Didn't "need" it once. Found excuses to use it all the time.

The CDT is definitely the most remote, wildest and wooliest of the 3, but most of my friends did it with a Micra, Classic, razor blade, a $0.99 gas station knife, or nothing at all.

We're planning to do the PCT again this year. I'm trying to select a knife for the hike right now which is lots of fun. I'm shooting for a 9lb pack this time. Now that I'm a knife knut, of course I'll carry, use, and enjoy a real knife (are you kidding?), but I know that this is a luxury, and one that will seem odd to other thru-hikers. Indeed, if it wasn't for my past achievements, it would mark me as a noob in that community.

Long-distance hiking is its own thing. It is not car camping, SERE, SHTF, hunting, four-wheelin', zombies, bushcraft or survival. As Ramm9 notes, on occasion the PCT/CDT turns into unplanned mountaineering. OK, sometimes it can get to be survival-ish: once on the CDT I stood out in a huge storm batoning wood to get a fire started, just to test my skills. I got it started, but I would have been better off under the tarp in my bag with my dry wife. To her enduring credit, she did crawl out to stand in the rain/snow near my fire with me. :thumbup:

The point is, these people that hike a distance of 2,000 - 3,000 miles in a Spring to Fall season have some ideas about what works for them. I may not agree with each "ultra light" choice and may think some are downright foolish but I will respect that they know something about what they are doing. After all, you get plenty of time to think when you are hiking sunup to sundown every day for weeks on end.

:thumbup:

The reason most thru-hikers don't carry much of a knife is because after several tens of thousands of nights of collective real-woods experience, it has not been necessary. Thru-hikers must be spending too much time in the mountains to read our forums so they can learn that they need a huge knife.

I know this is blasphemy in a knife forum, but believe me, if thru-hikers found that they actually needed a Busse to hike from Mexico to Canada, they'd have one. Most REI-style yuppie weekend backpacking is similar.

And you know what? That's fine. It's just a different thing than what we discuss here. That being said, most of the REI-cover campsites I wander into usually have an 8oz. multitool stuck in the peanut butter jar.

It's like the threads where we try to tell deployed soldiers what kind of knife they should have brought to the sandbox. Our hobby is not their reality.

Still, the guy in that link seems like mostly a clown. Maps are pretty important and will save your butt in the woods more often than a big knife or deodorant.

You have to remember, take the AT. You essentially CAN'T get lost on the AT. You may not be able to plan well - but it is a HUGE trail with a LOT of blazes. Most are eating freeze dried meals and sleeping in shelters.

This is an accurate assessment of the AT. Still, it was a great time and I can't wait to do it again with my wife. I knew dudes who got lost on the AT.

ETA: My goal packweight for our next AT is 7lbs. However, I'm thinking of bringing a huge knife just 'cause I can. If I want a machete or ax, there are plenty of discarded ones along the first 50 miles of the trail each spring, along with gallon jugs of shampoo, frozen blue jeans, tightie whities, and other crap that bubbas think you "need" for a 2000 mile hike.

...until they have to carry it for a distance greater than a campground, that is. We've all seen those guys. Heck, I used to be one.

 

[Reznik572]

I don't even like to leave my house without a knife, forget heading into the woods. Just my $.02 though.

:thumbup: Agreed! I think most of us don't get dressed in the morning without putting a blade in our pocket or on the belt. I don't understand how anyone can go about there day without a knife on them, let alone go hiking.

 

[remmmm]

I've been fortuanate enough to thru-hike all 3.

AT: SAK Tinker. Overkill and barely used in 6 months.
PCT first time: SAK Classic. Useful, mostly for cutting toenails.
PCT second time: SAK Classic. Same as first.
CDT: My first thru-hike as a knife nut. Murray Carter necker. :thumbup: A joy to carry and use, but definitely a luxury. Didn't "need" it once. Found excuses to use it all the time.

That's impressive, seriously. Not the knife part, the fact that you've done all three. You definitely have my respect. How many people would you guess have actually done all three in say, the last 10-20 years?

 

[Wanderlust]

tradja thanks for giving us some first hand experience, its good to hear from somebody who has been out there and done them. Also you bring up some great points from a sort of ambassador between these two groups of people. And I am with you, you may be able to get by with a SAK classic but come on its so much more fun to carry a nice knife.