Bob Cargill Cripple Creek Knives

If I were to spray paint the word Ferrari on a Buick station wagon would it then become a Ferrari? To me, if Cargill didn't make it, it isn't a Cripple Creek Knife.
Other than that I have nothing to add about how the Cripple Creek logo is now appearing on new knives. I would like to keep this thread about what the title suggests.
"Bob Cargill Cripple Creek Knives"
Don't get me wrong, I'm more than glad to see your interest and perspective but when you start asking questions like the ones you posted it will lead to nothing but
conjecture and no real answers. Lot's of "I heard this from so and so and that makes it true" or some such nonsense that seems to appear here on the internet.
Any other info you might be looking for can only come from Bob Cargill and he is private in his matters.
I would be hesitant to hang on the words of anyone that is currently using his logo in hopes of making money from the sweat of another man's brow.
Greg
I've never seen any reason to consider a knife NOT made by Bob Cargill, or under his guidance, a Cripple Creek Cutlery knife. The mere use of a Trade Name or Logo does not make a thing the genuine article. I have never seen anything that indicates how SMKW wound up with the name and logo, and I suspect I never shall. I guess that means I firmly expect that they were acquired completely legally. We all know, or we have the idea at least, that legally does not necessarily mean on the best of the up and up of things. On the slightly positive side of things, Queen did make some knife patterns that at least had historical precnedents that were actually made by Bob Cargill. While we can say that the Great Eastern knives are of a seemingly high quality, the patterns are merely their stock and trade patterns, stamped and etched with any of the seemingly dozens of Trade Names they have been able to acquire. It's some surprise if one brand hasn't would up in another brand's box--er, tube. The real joy of having been a collector of Bob Cargill's knives is that, every once in a while, a Cripple Creek Cutlery or Cargill one as never seen shows up (or, even imagined), as with the Gold and Ivory sleeveboard. (On the idea of a new owner making a brand of knives, Gerber made the originally licensed, mass produced, Paul® knife. After Fiskars bought Gerber, they decided to make a Paul® knife, but had to have it made by Peterson Precision Engineering, in Redwood City, CA.)
 
Which Queen made knives had historical precedent of Cargill made knives. It wasn't the Effingham Barlow. I am not 100% sure of the Effingham Buffalo Skinner.
Maybe you're referring to something more recently made. I don't even bother giving those a glance so I am guessing that is what you're referring too?.
Greg
 
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Which Queen made knives had historical precedent of Cargill made knives. It wasn't the Effingham Barlow. I am not 100% sure of the Effingham Buffalo Skinner.
Maybe you're referring to something more recently made. I don't even bother giving those a glance so I am guessing that is what you're referring too?.
Greg
Were not the 2009 muskrat, gunstock, and whatever else made by Queen (Schatt & Morgan)? If I've got that wrong, apologies! They were patterns made by Bob Cargill, however.
 
No apologies needed. I'm sure they made those patterns but so did every knife making company. I doubt they did so with actual Cripple Creeks in mind.
If they did it was just a ploy to deceive.
They just slapped the logo on them and charged extra for it..
It goes back to the Buick station wagon comparison.
Greg
 
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Barry, on the Amerindian knives for Hughes Cutlery, I know there were at least 2. The Ira Hayes and the Jim Thorpe. Do you, or anybody else, know of any others?
Greg
 
Barry, on the Amerindian knives for Hughes Cutlery, I know there were at least 2. The Ira Hayes and the Jim Thorpe. Do you, or anybody else, know of any others?
Greg
I know only the Ira Hayes in the second LI4 pattern with jigged honey bone and the Jim Thorpe Barlow with jigged green bone scales. I've never seen any others--but, then, I'm a relative newcomer.
Insofar the S&M patterns with the Cripple Creek Cutlery logos on patterns Bob Cargill ACTUALLY made, who knows what the intentions of Queen Cutlery were. I NEVER SAID they were Cripple Creek Cutlery knives. Just that with the stuff that GEC is grinding out these days--patterns with logos for each and every of the DOZENS? of brands they've acquired--it was still "refreshing" to see someone make a pattern actually made by Cargill! Of course they're not really Cripple Creek Cutlery knives!
 
Here is a unique one with a history involving Bob Cargill. In 1988, my home town was celebrating it's 200 year bicentennial. To commemorate, my grandfather sold the county commissioners on the idea of doing a limited run of knives, which would then be sold to the public. This knife is the 1 piece prototype that was created and submitted to the county for their approval. It is a Queen 1987 canoe pattern, with handles jigged and supplied by Bob Cargill, and the blade etching done by Jim Sargent. Unfortunately, the commissioners took too long to vote and approve the design, and by the time they placed the order, there was not enough time to get these knives made. So a more generic bronze cast handled knife by Utica was created instead.
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A 1981 or very early '82 LI-1.(no dated tang stamp) This would pre-date the Knife World knives of the same pattern that came out in 1982.
Greg

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Mitch, you'll get the hang of it. I've been doing a lot of trial and error here myself.

TA-NA-SI is the Cherokee word meaning Tennessee, or in their terms, the area itself without the boundaries we have now . The Cherokee Nation was pretty big.
The TA-NA-SI series of Cripple Creeks contains a number of knife patterns. Exactly how many I don't know at this time. Hopefully we can update the info. I'll post photos of some that I do have soon.
Here's an ad promoting 4 patterns.
Notice that Cargill called what some recognize as a Banana pattern a HOBO. Hobo being short for Hoe Boy or a fella that would move from farm to farm by
rail hoping to work the fields. A knife like this would be pretty handy for all types of things.

You might notice that I removed the phone number that was in all the ads I post. Calling that 30 year old number would only bother someone that doesn't know anything
about knives and would not reach Cargill. There is always at least one "knuckle head" that would just have to see if it would. I can guarantee you that it won't.

We will update this post as new photos and information comes forth.
More later.
Greg

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With the addition of the photos below combined with the info in the ad we know that there are at least 6 different knives in the TA-NA-SI series
and there are 150 of each. To date we are still missing #3 a 2 blade honeybone mini trapper. A total of 6 knives.
The Christmas Tree scales that Cargill used are tuff as nails and I have never seen one break down or gas.
I've never seen or heard of it doing so on a Cripple Creek.

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Knife below reads TA-NA-SI #6 1 of 150
Cherokee Princess
Nancy Ward.
.

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TA-NA-SI #4 Stag Boot Knife from the Loy Collection. Mr. Loy had a very fine Cripple Creek Collection.

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I'd intended to add this before today, but forgot, then didn't get back to it. I had some dealings with Gabriel Loy, and I believe he said the collection was with at least one brother. He was one of the very early collectors and had some really wonderful Cripple Creeks. I am posting the Fixed Blade Ta-Na-Si I had simply because it included the custom sheath offered with the knife for the merest $15. The best of the sheath is how well it was FIT TO the knife and not just something thrown into the deal to make a few more bucks. (Of course, that wasn't Bob Cargill's style at all.) And, yes, it is the only Cripple Creek fixed blade with which I am familiar. (I'd love to see another!) Of course, Cargill didn't make a lot of fixed blade knives at all!
 

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Cargill made a lot of fixed blades (Cargill Stamp) but not many fixed blade Cripple Creeks. The TA-NA-SI is one and he made at least 2 models in 1991
etched Operation Desert Storm. They were part of the Warrior series. Pretty darn had to find. I'll post some photos of them soon.
I'll put the photos toward the beginning of this thread with the other Warrior knives (page 4) and some on this end of the thread as well.
Greg
 
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The Warrior Series on page 4 has been updated. I will be leaving those new photos there. Thee isn't any reason to drag them to
this end of the thread.
Greg
 
Some examples of Cargill's second cut stag. He would cut it down to the bone but leave just enough of the contours from the stag.
For the longest time I thought this was some freelance jigging. No two pieces are the same. A good way to utilize some stag that
isn't quite good enough for scales.
Greg

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The Chief Anderson knives are a 15 knife collection of mostly 10 made of each knife. There are 2 patterns of 20 pieces. If you go looking thru the history books for Chief Anderson
you won't find squat. A man by the name of Frank Phelps was a good friend of Cargill and commissioned him to produce the Chief Anderson knives.
Frank was known to his friends as "Chief" and he lived in Andersonville. That's where the name came from. Frank also supplied some of the scale material
which is on the large banana trappers, coke bottle, toothpick and the saddlehorn. Frank Phelps had friends who worked for Queen and KABAR
and got the material from one of them. KABAR used it on Limited Edition
trapper with a dogs head shield.
There are 13 knives in the catalog page plus two that are not. A total of 15 knives.
Greg

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This is knife number 14. A 2 blade trapper. The one in the catalog is a single blade with a spear point blade.
Knife number 15 is the White Bone Coke Bottle in the next post.

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Frank Phelps was a really interesting character and I was able to acquire a number of good Cripple Creeks from him
Neither of the Chief Anderson knives I'm posting was from him, but I am posting them because they are not represented with the page of the Jim Parker catalogue that features the 13 Chief Anderson knives. I'd never realized that there were only the two 1 of 20 knives. The original pattern LI5 stockman with the single blade was one. The single blade muskrat, LI8 was one of the 1 of 10 knives. (Oddly, when I got it off ebay, I didn't realize it was the muskrat pattern, but wanted to get it because I all ready knew Frank, and, so, wanted the knife.) Of other things, it's also interesting that 1985 and 1986 are represented on a few of the knives, but most are undated. It would be nice to see the small 1-bl. stag trapper and the 1-bl. B-W-R large coke as well as the green bone toothpick (and it would mean all the 15 Chief Andersons were on the thread.)
 

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There are a total of 15 different Chief Anderson knives. Page 3 should have all the info on them.
Greg
 
Frank Phelps was a really interesting character and I was able to acquire a number of good Cripple Creeks from him
Neither of the Chief Anderson knives I'm posting was from him, but I am posting them because they are not represented with the page of the Jim Parker catalogue that features the 13 Chief Anderson knives. I'd never realized that there were only the two 1 of 20 knives. The original pattern LI5 stockman with the single blade was one. The single blade muskrat, LI8 was one of the 1 of 10 knives. (Oddly, when I got it off ebay, I didn't realize it was the muskrat pattern, but wanted to get it because I all ready knew Frank, and, so, wanted the knife.) Of other things, it's also interesting that 1985 and 1986 are represented on a few of the knives, but most are undated. It would be nice to see the small 1-bl. stag trapper and the 1-bl. B-W-R large coke as well as the green bone toothpick (and it would mean all the 15 Chief Andersons were on the thread.)
Thank you for posting the pics of the Chief Anderson knives. If you ever want to get rid of the single bladed muskrat, please contact me off the site. I've also seen the large Coke bottle in a white handle, I can't confirm it came from Bob that way. Someone might of put it on because the red/white/blue handle shrunk. There are also 10, 2 bladed stag trappers out their. I know a person that has all of them, just waiting for him to get tired of them. I'll send Greg a picture of my single bladed trapper for him to post. I'll also take a picture of the single bladed muskrat, it was supposedly a prototype. Part of the blade and the back of the tang aren't even buffed. Thank you all for keeping this thread alive, I learn something every time I return to the site. Thanks, Mitch
 
Photos of Chief Anderson knives on page 3 have been updated.
Guys, in the future do yourself a favor and don't use any fabric, towels, or anything red or orange for the background when taking photos of your knives.
To be short, It just screws everything up.
Greg
 
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