Busse knives really worth the bux ?

[raider63]

When i bought my original Mean Street A2 from Jerry ( and he was the one who answered the phone! ) for about $132.00? You bet your ass it was and still is worth it!! I have used and sorry to say abused this knife since then and its still the best I've ever had or have! Now are the prices getting way too in par with the cult following? IDK but I can't afford them anymore and i def can find good knives for far less money, with that said, i still love busses and if money wasn't a problem I would still buy them.

 

[PharaohX3]

While I have been prowling these forums for a long time I'm not really big on posting, that's why I just registered this year. I come to Blade Forums to gain wisdom, not to impart it. This topic, however, is one close to my heart so i figured I'd weigh in real quick.

I grew up with a father who is a true "knife nut" and possesses more knowledge of knives then most could ever hope to attain. While I have always been an avid outdoorsman, for a long time I never really understood the knife obsession, always thinking to my self "a knife is a knife, as long as it cuts stuff and doesn't break it's fine by me". I ran with a USMC Ka-Bar for years and was fairly satisfied with it.

As time went on I began to get more interested in different blade geometries, heat treats and the different properties of various steels. Thats when the knife bug got me and I started buying knife after knife after knife, looking for that non-existent "super knife that can do it all". Many of you understand this hopeless quest, I'd think. I started looking into higher quality, more expensive knives and inevitably Busse became known to me. When I first saw them they appeared to fantastic knives but I simply could not understand the price tag on them, especially on the secondary market. I refused to take part in the "Busse-hype" thinking all the hub-bub was simply clever marketing.

One day a Busse user (Boss Jack) came my way for a great price and I decided to pick it up and see what all the fuss was about. I loved it immediately. Today I own several Busse. Let me tell you all something: these knives PERFORM. They completely blow away my Beckers and ESEE's and all of my custom and semi-custom hard-use knives. That's not to say those knives are bad knives, in fact many of them are superb knives. They just don't even come close performance of my Busse's.

Does the price of Busse knives bother me? Not at all. In fact, considering the quality and performance you get from them I actually consider Busse to be a tremendous VALUE! Look guys, we are all knife freaks here so in my mind it's not so far-fetched for us to spend money on the things that we love. I mean really, would a car freak drive a Hyundai because it gets him from point A to point B "just as well" as a tricked-out '66 Mustang? No chance in hell.

To those of you reading this thread that have no experience with Busse here's my advice: be patient and wait for a good deal on a used piece (yes, they are out there and not as uncommon as most people think), swoop it up and try it for yourself. Don't take my word for it and don't take the word of those who feel Busse is over-priced, just try them.

 

[PatrickKnight]

While I have been prowling these forums for a long time I'm not really big on posting, that's why I just registered this year. I come to Blade Forums to gain wisdom, not to impart it. This topic, however, is one close to my heart so i figured I'd weigh in real quick.

I grew up with a father who is a true "knife nut" and possesses more knowledge of knives then most could ever hope to attain. While I have always been an avid outdoorsman, for a long time I never really understood the knife obsession, always thinking to my self "a knife is a knife, as long as it cuts stuff and doesn't break it's fine by me". I ran with a USMC Ka-Bar for years and was fairly satisfied with it.

As time went on I began to get more interested in different blade geometries, heat treats and the different properties of various steels. Thats when the knife bug got me and I started buying knife after knife after knife, looking for that non-existent "super knife that can do it all". Many of you understand this hopeless quest, I'd think. I started looking into higher quality, more expensive knives and inevitably Busse became known to me. When I first saw them they appeared to fantastic knives but I simply could not understand the price tag on them, especially on the secondary market. I refused to take part in the "Busse-hype" thinking all the hub-bub was simply clever marketing.

One day a Busse user (Boss Jack) came my way for a great price and I decided to pick it up and see what all the fuss was about. I loved it immediately. Today I own several Busse. Let me tell you all something: these knives PERFORM. They completely blow away my Beckers and ESEE's and all of my custom and semi-custom hard-use knives. That's not to say those knives are bad knives, in fact many of them are superb knives. They just don't even come close performance of my Busse's.

Does the price of Busse knives bother me? Not at all. In fact, considering the quality and performance you get from them I actually consider Busse to be a tremendous VALUE! Look guys, we are all knife freaks here so in my mind it's not so far-fetched for us to spend money on the things that we love. I mean really, would a car freak drive a Hyundai because it gets him from point A to point B just as well as a tricked-out '66 Mustang? No chance in hell.

To those of you reading this thread that have no experience with Busse here's my advice: be patient and wait for a good deal on a used piece (yes, they are out there and not as uncommon as most people think), swoop it up and try it for yourself. Don't take my word for it and don't take the word of those who feel Busse is over-priced, just try them.

This is where you and I would differ. I have used several Busse and kin blades and maybe im just not using my knives right but I have yet to have a time where my ESEE 3 couldnt do something a Busse could do. I personally have no need to chop a concrete block with a knife and I think that is a useless test of a knife as it is completely impractical. So I have yet to see a Busse knife perform any kind of a test that knives costing much less wouldnt also do.

I would like to state I am not speaking about Swamp Rats here only the INFI steel Busse brand.

 

[PharaohX3]

Well, to be clear I'm not really talking about absurdities like bashing concrete or slicing chain, I'm just talking about day to day standard knife use. Things like processing wood and game etc. Just out of curiosity, what Busse's do you own that you are comparing to your ESEE?

Thanks for your response!

 

[Codger_64]

I figure that my best FB knives now are ESEE's considering my knife use\interest\philosophy. I tend to, but not always, buy with outdoor use in mind. Am I really gaining much more in a knife by going from ESEE to Busse ? If I'm paying 3-4 times more for the knife, will I get a 3-4 times better knife ? I know about the Busse mystique and have read up on INFI, which sounds impressive. I'm asking here because we generally buy for practical outdoor utility, not status. But I will admit that my attraction is growing for Busse.

I have quite a few knives that originally sold fo $20 as much as 46 years ago that I could sell today for over ten times that tomorrow. They are not Infi, by the way. Can anyone show me their 46 year old Infi knife? No? Didn't think so!

Yes, I am going to pick and nudge and pull chains. All in good fun I hope you know. Buy what you like because you like it. Not because someone else does and not because you expect it to be a good investment. Use it or don't, however you like.

I think that many of us old codgers have stuff like that. I bought a used Randall #1 in 1967 for $25. I sold it 5 years ago for $900. I bought a lot of Randalls for $20 to $25. That was a lot of money in the 1960s.

However, I am wondering what the point of this thread is. I suspect that it's purpose is to bash Busse knives and I don't really understand that kind of thinking. No one HAS to buy a Busse or any other
brand of knife. I bought an Esee 4 and didn't like it. I bought a Becker BKT-2 and didn't like it. I bought Busse Ergos and didn't like them. So what?

Nah. I don't see that at all. I see a sometimes humorous discussion about the pros and cons of the OP question. Some interesting points are being made on both sides of the question. If someone here feels that I am being unfair, send me a Busey knife to use and test and I'll report back. Maybe some usable (for my purposes) design like a 5-6" blade general use woods knife that will clean critters, not be too heavy or large to wear on my belt and include an original sheath just to make the user review and comparison fair.

 

[PatrickKnight]

Well, to be clear I'm not really talking about absurdities like bashing concrete or slicing chain, I'm just talking about day to day standard knife use. thinks like processing wood and game etc. Just out of curiosity, what Busse's do you own that you are comparing to your ESEE?

Thanks for your response!

I am a small fixed blade fan so most of the ones I have used have been under 4.5 inches in length the two Busses I used were a Inactive Duty and a Boss Street. I am in no way saying they were bad knives and please dont take it as such, I just can not see them ever performing better than my 3. I think they would all three do the same things. One thing I really did not like was I thought the blade thickness was to much for a blade of this length.

On a side note I would like to add that I had a chance to use a Swamp Rat RS which, in my eyes out performed all three. (Both the Busses and my ESEE.)

 

[cricketdave]

The only real differences I've noted in the esee's and Beckers and busse knives I've owned and used was edge retention. The grips are more comfortable on the busse for me too. Other than that, not alot of difference. I would not expect any of them to fail in use. The higher rc of both busse, swamprat and scrapyard just holds a sharper edge longer, as well as the strength of infi not chipping or breaking at that higher hardness.

Is the added expense of the busse and not coming with a sheath still worth it? Yeah for me since I simply like them and don't care all that much as long as I can afford what I want at the time. As for a sheath, thats not a big deal to make or get one. I really like using the esee molle backs and pouches with kydex for those.

 

[SpyderPhreak]

Do I think Busse knives are worth the money? In general, probably not. The secondary market has inflated the prices beyond what I personally think are reasonable. I only own a single Busse blade (a Team Gemini Light Brigade) and it is primarily because I really like that particular design. However, I have not used it for anything yet, and for this, there is still a reasonable chance I will sell it.

Having said that, I agree with many here that Swamp Rat and Scrapyard are where it is at! :thumbup: I believe these two lines hit the sweet spot in regards to price/performance ratio. Many of their designs are intended to be used in the field, and do quite well at tasks such as cutting up sticks or dressing fish and game. 52100 is a GREAT steel, especially with a good heat treatment protocol. So what if it stains? So does 1095... :foot:

I got "into" Bussekin many years ago when looking specifically for a good, mid-sized knife to carry while Elk hunting, and also a larger one to use for quickly quartering an Elk. I looked hard at ESEE, Fallkniven, RAT, Chris Reeve, and Becker, but in the end decided on Swamp Rat. In part because of the fantastic lifetime warranty, and also because I liked their designs and chpoice of steel better. Overall, they weren't are more or any less expensive than the others I was looking at. The three knives posted below are examples of EXCELLENT outdoors knives:

Ratmandu Bowie, 5.5" edge, 10.5" oal

Gen2 Howling Rat, 4.5" edge, 9" oal

Rodent Solution, 3.5" edge, 8" oal

Add to that the Bussekin companies also occasionally use some pretty sweet stainless steels. A good recent example of that are the Scrapyard Elmax models. Excellent bird&trout knives!!! :thumbup:

Scrapmax 460, 4.6" edge, 9.25" oal

All of that being said, variety is the spice of life. If everyone liked the same things, it would be pretty darned boring! There is no right answer to the question. The simile that has been made here to optics is a good one; not everyone can afford the Swarovski stuff, and you can get ~95% of the performance for a quarter (or less) of the money. Buy what you like and what you can afford. However, I am someone who prefers to buy the best that I can afford, versus going cheap and having to do it over later on down the road.

And Gary Busey & Co. seem to be very successful at promoting it via their business model. Kudos to them.

Well now, THERE is your problem Codger! Gary Busey is an actor, NOT a knifemaker! What the heck would he know about heat treating??? What a silly mistake!

 

[benthughes]

As to whether Busse knives are worth the money, that's pretty subjective. What's your disposable income and how do you plan to use your knife? This goes for pretty much any hobby so you have to take that into consideration. I'm a bass player who could get by with a $400 Jazz bass but I own a $3000 custom bass because it has features I want and it makes me happy.

Busse knives tend to be beefy and overbuilt with an average thickness of .20-.25" . This thickness tends to be great for choppers but for 6" or under blades you sacrifice cutting ability, especially combined with a wide edge angle which while it affords great durability sacrifices cutting ability. Larger blades that are .25"-.32" thick tend to be exhausting to swing for extended periods of time and I'm not a small guy... that's a lot of steel which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

As far as practicality I don't quite get Busse knives. In smaller blades I prefer something like SR-101 of CPM3V that offers a bit better edge retention over durability. In larger blades Infi is nice because of it's qualities and it's semi-stainless qualities are pretty cool. For me ( and most people I imagine) I would be better served with something like a hatchet, kukri or machete for chopping. I'd like to have a FBM or another monster Busse but would go to those tools mentioned for the same job. The Busses I currently own are the SAR5 and HG55 because they fit me well and they have the qualities that I like in a fixed blade.

I agree to the comparison to Hinderer knives. They're great knives, beautifully built by people who are awesome to deal with. Customer support means a lot, especially in a hard use knife. In the end the XM-18 didn't provide me anything that my Spyderco Military didn't except $500 in my pocket. If you can swing the price of a Busse and still eat then give it a shot, you can sell it for close to what you paid for it which can't be said for many knives. Form your own opinion, this is just mine.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Add to that the Bussekin companies also occasionally use some pretty sweet stainless steels. A good recent example of that are the Scrapyard Elmax models. Excellent bird&trout knives!!! :thumbup:

Scrapmax 460, 4.6" edge, 9.25" oal

If they made more stuff along those lines I'd be a bit more personally enthused with the brand. MUCH closer to the sort of knife I can get excited about. What's the thickness?

 

[Codger_64]

...
Well now, THERE is your problem Codger! Gary Busey is an actor, NOT a knifemaker! What the heck would he know about heat treating??? What a silly mistake!

Took yas long enough! poke-poke! Srsly, send me one and I will try it.

 

[Guyon]

The answer totally depends on your definition of "worth."
I've sold a lot of my Busses, but I still have some of my favorites. I like them and use them.
Some that have hung around? Some original Game Wardens, couple of CABS, the Busse Muk, the MOASH, the SFNO LE, the SHBM, the SE FBM '07.
I paid after-market prices for my original SR Ratweiler, and it's still worth it. Great 7" camp knife. I'd probably let all the Busses go before I'd sell that one.
YMMV.

 

[SpyderPhreak]

If they made more stuff along those lines I'd be a bit more personally enthused with the brand. MUCH closer to the sort of knife I can get excited about. What's the thickness?

Those are a thin 0.090-0.095!!! :thumbup:

Took yas long enough! poke-poke! Srsly, send me one and I will try it.

Heh heh!!!

I paid after-market prices for my original SR Ratweiler, and it's still worth it. Great 7" camp knife. I'd probably let all the Busses go before I'd sell that one.
YMMV.

If I had to sell all my other knives, the green Chopweiler would be the last to go!!!

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Those are a thin 0.090-0.095!!! :thumbup:

Ok--yeah. More of that please. That's much more my style.

 

[shunsui]

Ok--yeah. More of that please. That's much more my style.

I'd say it is really worth the bux to keep track of what Busse and kin are offering over time.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

I'd say it is really worth the bux to keep track of what Busse and kin are offering over time.

Not really sure what that's supposed to mean?

It's still not quite what I'd want personally, but it would be nice to see more thin blades like that in their lineup. I'm no expert, but based on what I've seen they haven't made a whole lot of knives that are 1/8" or thinner. Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that knives like that one are still a minority in their usual offerings.

 

[SpyderPhreak]

The best thing about those Scrapmax knives was the price - that particular model (4.6") was a mere $90!!! The shorter ones (3.4") were even less!

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

The best thing about those Scrapmax knives was the price - that particular model (4.6") was a mere $90!!! The shorter ones (3.4") were even less!

Yeah those I think I could get excited about.

 

[PatrickKnight]

Those are a thin 0.090-0.095!!! :thumbup:



Heh heh!!!



If I had to sell all my other knives, the green Chopweiler would be the last to go!!!

I will say without a doubt the Chopweiler is my favorite knife they have ever made followed shortly by the RMD. Basicly im a fan of the Swamp not of the Busse brand. The Swamp has better designs and a better steel in my eyes.

 

[soapboxpreacher]

The majority of Busse knives people buy are fondled, admired, bragged upon -- basically collected and never used. I think that tells the story more than anything else.

I have a few favorite field knives that I use. But if I'm told I have to go to some unknown place for a couple of years and only take one knife, I'm not taking my ESSE 6, Bravo 1 or Ratmandu, I'm taking my Fallkniven S1. A tough, laminated stainless knife with a grippy handle will fair much better in the jungle, on a tropical island, Pacific rain forest, snow, mud and other wet environments. All these other knives will simply rust away over time. Since I see the S1 as my knife of last resort, I consider it my most valuable knife and will not pay more to get less.

I have to agree. My Falks are my favorite knives! I beat my A1 like it owes me money!!! I have pryed with it, chopped, baton, dug....it isnt that pretty anymore but I have had to touch it up either! The grip is awesome...eats up shock, grippy when wet. It is also very minimal for its size, weight is excellent, not too excessive on thickness and the grind is really the best for most general use! The sheath I hated at first and now I love it. Very minimal and works better than expected. I put a bunch of paracord around it and just flat out love it! It is my go to!