Can China made produce a good blade?

Status
Not open for further replies.
"China is very much the new japan. In fact I would say they are advancing at a rate that puts japan to shame."

If your example that Chinese factories being able to use high end steels developed in and imported from other countries
somehow "substantiates" your statement, it doesn't.

"Are you under the misimpression that Bohler M390 and S35VN steels are NOT being used by Chinese companies?"

Read the thread please. You're interjecting yourself and going off on a tangent. China's steel industry as late as the 1980s
was prehistoric compared to the developed countries. China has obviously improved and produces a lot of steel today but they are geared for other uses, as cutlery in any country is a miniscule percentage of steel use.
If Chinese steel companies developed and produced steels on a par with Bohler M390, S35VN, or more to the point ZDP189 or
Cowry-X and Cowry-Y, then the OP's statement would have merit. It doesn't.
 
KenHash said:
"China is very much the new japan. In fact I would say they are advancing at a rate that puts japan to shame."

If your example that Chinese factories being able to use high end steels developed in and imported from other countries
somehow "substantiates" your statement, it doesn't.

"Are you under the misimpression that Bohler M390 and S35VN steels are NOT being used by Chinese companies?"

Read the thread please. You're interjecting yourself and going off on a tangent. China's steel industry as late as the 1980s
was prehistoric compared to the developed countries. China has obviously improved and produces a lot of steel today but they are geared for other uses, as cutlery in any country is a miniscule percentage of steel use.
If Chinese steel companies developed and produced steels on a par with Bohler M390, S35VN, or more to the point ZDP189 or
Cowry-X and Cowry-Y, then the OP's statement would have merit. It doesn't.
Click to expand...

There are so many inaccuracy's with this post that I will get banned if I point them all out...

I will attempt a few, and hope for the best.....

China is not the 'new Japan'
China does not invent or push the boundries of technology

American corporations went to China to use a cheap labor force in order to up their profit margins.

The only thing of value that came from this venture on the Chinese end was the ability to use the plants that where built, the machinery that was put in place, and the ideas that where brought over for them to either use or copy.

It amazes me that it's taken 30 years for the Chinese to come out with a few original knife designs.....

I have nothing against the people of China, they are living with the same consequences that we are of the ugly face of what is the American Corporation.

Back to knives.

It's not that I don't want to support Chinese manufactures of knives. The thing is by doing so, I validate everything that has happened since Reganomics, and the start of what is trading the jobs of many for the profit of the few....
 
KenHash said:
"China is very much the new japan. In fact I would say they are advancing at a rate that puts japan to shame."

If your example that Chinese factories being able to use high end steels developed in and imported from other countries
somehow "substantiates" your statement, it doesn't.

"Are you under the misimpression that Bohler M390 and S35VN steels are NOT being used by Chinese companies?"

Read the thread please. You're interjecting yourself and going off on a tangent. China's steel industry as late as the 1980s
was prehistoric compared to the developed countries. China has obviously improved and produces a lot of steel today but they are geared for other uses, as cutlery in any country is a miniscule percentage of steel use.
If Chinese steel companies developed and produced steels on a par with Bohler M390, S35VN, or more to the point ZDP189 or
Cowry-X and Cowry-Y, then the OP's statement would have merit. It doesn't.
Click to expand...

The OPs statement was a question. Can quality blades come from China?

The answer is yes, no matter how much anyone refuses to ever buy or use one could ever speculate otherwise. I read right here among the pages that Chinese steels developed specific to knife blades is pure junk. I paid so little for the 1095 blade I ordered I threw in a 8cr13mov knife to prove it is junk. After I was taught through experience that their 1095 is as good as any no matter the brand stamped on the blade I set out to destroy Chinese developed knife steel. Turns out what I read is dead wrong. It's not a simple copy of AUS8, it's a great improvement over it. From my folder in that steel to my large fixed blade it performs better than the speculations predicted. It also out performs many more trendy grades of steel. Only way I learned was through actual use, something the naysayers can not post.

It's ok to be biased or even hate Chinese blades based on emotions. What people aren't getting is those who own and use them, the speculators look a little off base being so emotionally passionate against them.

Some people do more than look at blades or the made in part on the box, them are the people who recognize the actual quality of a blade no matter where it originated.
 
Knife-craft including folders isn't exactly rocket science LMAO, of course China is capable of making a good blade. They're a nuclear country, has a space program, and directly clone our next gen fighter jets from hacked blueprints for crying out loud. They have at this point the same CNC machines in their facilities. Machines that produce knives are peanuts in the grand scheme of things anyway. Cmon people don't be so narrow minded. Yes, hate China all you want more power to you but don't be ignorant.
 
BLD, Purple, I think what Ken was trying to say got confused. He is saying that China is not producing its own "super" steels unlike other countries like Japan, which he is of course correct about.

There seems to be a lot of people making a lot of confusing arguments back and forth and much is getting lost in the fray.

None of this negates the fact that China can produce fine knives. As has been said many many times in this thread, it is not like the country produces the knives, it is companies. Lots of the crap Chinese knives we see produced are made under the guidelines of American companies. Country has very little to do with it, the bottom dollar does.

As to follow up on Ken's point before it got all messy, it will be interesting to see if/when the Chinese companies producing quality knives use a higher end domestically produced steel. Does anyone know if they do now?
 
China and India probably have more foundries and produce more steel than anyone.

Any super uber steels specifically for the knife market? I guess not. Fancy knives are an export market to them so let's not push our luck.......... All we need is China flooding yet another market.

Can they if the wanted to? Without a doubt.

Do we want to challenge them to make some and take more jobs?
 
Apologies to leghog for not getting his name right. I was rushing out the door at the time. :o

So I'm sticking with the Purple One's classic comment. If you don't have direct, personal experience with Chinese-made knives, why should I listen to anything you have to say when those who do, myself included, uniformly praise them?
 
To summarize:

Yeah it's fair to state that you don't buy Chinese, you don't support them....Also fair to suggest that others do the same. All for various reasons.

But it isn't fair to categorize ALL as crap without first hand experience. When someone DOES have experience with low quality Chinese goods (we all do ;)) We should also not be ignorant to the fact that it's our very own American companies ordering these low quality goods to their own specifications to save money. Big irony there.
 
Stays Sharp said:
To summarize:

Yeah it's fair to state that you don't buy Chinese, you don't support them....Also fair to suggest that others do the same. All for various reasons.

But it isn't fair to categorize ALL as crap without first hand experience. When someone DOES have experience with low quality Chinese goods (we all do ;)) We should also not be ignorant to the fact that it's our very own American companies ordering these low quality goods to their own specifications to save money. Big irony there.
Click to expand...
We also need to acknowledge that Chinese manufacturers have upped their game and are producing knives that are as well-made or possibly even better-made than those being produced here . . . especially at the price points they're being sold for. Spend a little time in the Kizer and Reate forums and you'll see what I'm talking about. The positive reviews just keep coming and coming and coming . . .

EDIT: The real truth is, Chinese manufacturers have had the ability to create high-end knives for a long time. They've just been taking the easy way out and copying other people's designs. A lot of folks are PO'd about that and rightly so. But it doesn't take away from the fact that these manufacturers know how to make beautifully crafted knives. And for those folks, that's the hardest pill of all to swallow.
 
Last edited:
bld522 said:
We also need to acknowledge that Chinese manufacturers have upped their game and are producing knives that are as well-made or possibly even better-made than those being produced here . . . especially at the price points they're being sold for. Spend a little time in the Kizer and Reate forums and you'll see what I'm talking about. The positive reviews just keep coming and coming and coming . . .
Click to expand...

Serious question... Has Kizer and Reate began to enforce a MAP yet :p

Ok, maybe it was rhetorical. The biggest advantage China has is price (in all cases, not just knives). Even at pre MAP prices, they are still ultra competitive against ZT and BM prices. I wonder if these companies will respond. Probably not, we as a country never seem to anymore. Unfortunately, I think that for every "buy USA only guy", there's a dozen others who seem to not care and do value the cost savings that the Chinese offer. This is just the beginning.
 
leghog said:
More than one person's experience with one source in the PRC. Another (from dave14):
Click to expand...

Apples and oranges. I went a to mcdonalds and got a cold burger old crusty fries and a flat pop. So by that token I shouldnt eat out ANYWHERE because that bad experience means all food served in America must be of equal quality. Sorry man, even if you had 20 people share negative stories on china it only means they had a bad experience and its too small of a sample size to mean anything especially if they are unrelated products. So there is a dude claiming a solid piece of steel had a half melted bolt in it. Great. Audi, bmw, Apple, etc all have factories in china making parts and whole products and the quality is extremely high. If china can build a luxury automobile and no one is the wiser then I am pretty sure they can make a knife. But if you tell them we need these to sell in wal-mart for under $20 that is naturally going to have a negative impact on quality. But I am sure random unrelated experiences from unverified sources are much more reliable than verified testimony from materials providers, designers, makers and dealers alike who have actually used and owned many of the products in question. Because when I want the truth I trust random people on the internet.
 
KenHash said:
"China is very much the new japan. In fact I would say they are advancing at a rate that puts japan to shame."

If your example that Chinese factories being able to use high end steels developed in and imported from other countries
somehow "substantiates" your statement, it doesn't.

"Are you under the misimpression that Bohler M390 and S35VN steels are NOT being used by Chinese companies?"

Read the thread please. You're interjecting yourself and going off on a tangent. China's steel industry as late as the 1980s
was prehistoric compared to the developed countries. China has obviously improved and produces a lot of steel today but they are geared for other uses, as cutlery in any country is a miniscule percentage of steel use.
If Chinese steel companies developed and produced steels on a par with Bohler M390, S35VN, or more to the point ZDP189 or
Cowry-X and Cowry-Y, then the OP's statement would have merit. It doesn't.
Click to expand...


What knife companies manufacture their own steels? None of them. Every factory that makes knives whether its benchmade, lionsteel, Chris Reeve all use suppliers to get their steel. And they import it from all over the world. So what is your point exactly? If that doesnt substantiate the argument then you had a poor one in the first place considering that is what every single knife factory does. Not even most custom makers are going in their back yard and digging up iron ore and making their own steels.

JR88FAN said:
There are so many inaccuracy's with this post that I will get banned if I point them all out...

I will attempt a few, and hope for the best.....

China is not the 'new Japan'
China does not invent or push the boundries of technology

American corporations went to China to use a cheap labor force in order to up their profit margins.

The only thing of value that came from this venture on the Chinese end was the ability to use the plants that where built, the machinery that was put in place, and the ideas that where brought over for them to either use or copy.

It amazes me that it's taken 30 years for the Chinese to come out with a few original knife designs.....

I have nothing against the people of China, they are living with the same consequences that we are of the ugly face of what is the American Corporation.

Back to knives.

It's not that I don't want to support Chinese manufactures of knives. The thing is by doing so, I validate everything that has happened since Reganomics, and the start of what is trading the jobs of many for the profit of the few....
Click to expand...

its funny you dont even know he was replying to something I said. You two actually have the exact same views yet you are too emotional to see you guys are on the same team. And people wonder why these threads go to pot. And please, keep your politics out of it.
 
craytab said:
BLD, Purple, I think what Ken was trying to say got confused. He is saying that China is not producing its own "super" steels unlike other countries like Japan, which he is of course correct about.

There seems to be a lot of people making a lot of confusing arguments back and forth and much is getting lost in the fray.

None of this negates the fact that China can produce fine knives. As has been said many many times in this thread, it is not like the country produces the knives, it is companies. Lots of the crap Chinese knives we see produced are made under the guidelines of American companies. Country has very little to do with it, the bottom dollar does.

As to follow up on Ken's point before it got all messy, it will be interesting to see if/when the Chinese companies producing quality knives use a higher end domestically produced steel. Does anyone know if they do now?
Click to expand...

Yeah I get that but I dont see any merit to the argument. I see it as pigeon holing the whole country because of that one issue. No knife companies produce their own steel. The only one that I even know of is brian tighe and thats because he owns part of a steel company. And really I think lionsteel makes pretty damn good knives. But I dont think they have a very large steel industry either. The fact remains that since most knife companies dont make their own alloys then it should have no merit on their ability to make knives with it. All factories import materials.
 
PURPLEDC said:
Yeah I get that but I dont see any merit to the argument. I see it as pigeon holing the whole country because of that one issue. No knife companies produce their own steel. The only one that I even know of is brian tighe and thats because he owns part of a steel company. And really I think lionsteel makes pretty damn good knives. But I dont think they have a very large steel industry either. The fact remains that since most knife companies dont make their own alloys then it should have no merit on their ability to make knives with it. All factories import materials.
Click to expand...

Well, I disagree a bit. I think it says something to have the steel made in the same country the knife is made. That says a little something to me about the health of a country's knife manufacturing abilities. I am sort of surprised China hasn't come up with their own versions of the better steels out there for manufacture in their own country. I mean, they've done everything else, why not that? I can guess some of the obvious reasons but it has to be costly to import s35vn and the like.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top