Carbon vs Stainless Steel

eKretz said:
Still waiting to hear what "steel" has no carbon. Even maraging steel has SOME carbon.
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“Maraging steels are carbon free iron-nickel alloys with additions of cobalt, molybdenum, titanium and aluminium.”
https://www.imoa.info/molybdenum-uses/molybdenum-grade-alloy-steels-irons/maraging-steels.php
Carbon is often listed with a maximum with managing steel, because it is usually not an intentional addition and in fact they are trying to reduce the carbon as close to zero as possible.
 
I like and agree with your conclusions. Back in the 1960's everyone "knew" that stainless was harder (HRC) and harder to sharpen and carbon took and kept a better edge, while being easier to sharpen.

That's a relic of time long gone. With so many great steels to choose from, that old binary choice just isn't true anymore. For which I am profoundly grateful.
 
eKretz said:
Still waiting to hear what "steel" has no carbon. Even maraging steel has SOME carbon.
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Elements of Metallurgy and Engineering Alloys, F.C. Campbell, editor, p 349:
“In the past, steel has been described as an alloy of iron and carbon. Today, this description is no longer applicable since in some very important steels, such as interstitial-free steels and some stainless steels, carbon is considered an impurity and is present in quantities of only a few parts per million. Steels are iron-base alloys containing one or more alloying elements, generally including carbon, manganese, silicon, nickel, chromium, molybdenum, vanadium, titanium, niobium, and aluminum”.
 
another great article, Sir. great topic...also great setup with interesting history and links to other relevant articles. very well done.....
 
danbot said:
Elements of Metallurgy and Engineering Alloys, F.C. Campbell, editor, p 349:
“In the past, steel has been described as an alloy of iron and carbon. Today, this description is no longer applicable since in some very important steels, such as interstitial-free steels and some stainless steels, carbon is considered an impurity and is present in quantities of only a few parts per million. Steels are iron-base alloys containing one or more alloying elements, generally including carbon, manganese, silicon, nickel, chromium, molybdenum, vanadium, titanium, niobium, and aluminum”.
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Again...IS present. Carbon-free to me means zee-roh. Trying to reduce it to zero isn't the same as reducing it to zero. In practice, outside of a lab, I think you'll find that no steel is "carbon-free."
 
Additionally - in the context under discussion - steels for knife blades, maraging steel is useless.
 
eKretz said:
Again...IS present. Carbon-free to me means zee-roh. Trying to reduce it to zero isn't the same as reducing it to zero. In practice, outside of a lab, I think you'll find that no steel is "carbon-free."
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Well, for all intents and purposes, it can be considered "carbon-free". And I'm okay with calling it carbon free if the minuscule amount of carbon has no impact on the properties of the steel.
 
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OK eKretz, you win. There are enough carbon particles floating around in the air currents from all the wild fires in the Western United States to polute every batch of steel in the world, unless it is made in a vacuum chamber. And, your point is............????? Please ignore him, Larrin. The rest of us are.
 
tim37a said:
OK eKretz, you win. There are enough carbon particles floating around in the air currents from all the wild fires in the Western United States to polute every batch of steel in the world, unless it is made in a vacuum chamber. And, your point is............????? Please ignore him, Larrin. The rest of us are.
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There's usually a point in the discussion when it is clear there isn't anything left to gain. :)
 
eKretz said:
Again...IS present. Carbon-free to me means zee-roh. Trying to reduce it to zero isn't the same as reducing it to zero. In practice, outside of a lab, I think you'll find that no steel is "carbon-free."
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It's listed as an undesirable element, meaning they strive to purify the steel of said element. A few parts per million is extremely low.
For all intents and purposes it's carbon free, just like how you, for all intents and purposes, are free of mercury/lead/sulfur/other undesirable elements, but still likely have trace amounts of it in your body.
 
Larrin said:
I need some of that placebo marketing for my website.
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While your at it you should sprinkle a little bit of that "Placebo Marketing" on your personality...(Sorry I know that was a cheap shot but I couldn't resist lol)

But let me quote some your article here "You can see the stark difference in carbide structure by comparing the white particles between 440C and O1. 440C and 154CM have relatively large carbides" There's people who don't need a microscope but can feel that difference with touch, and it's like that with wood, cloth, and endless other materials. I can't really describe it but higher the carbon the more "silky" it feels to me. The best way to describe it is take a antique nickle coin and take a modern one and they feel completely different.

You can call BS on it all you want. But I'm not the only person like this out there.
 
I know I’m in the very small minority when I say that I can still appreciate 440C in a knife, whether it’s in an old buck or a newer, small batch of fixed blades and folders.
 
With all the great new steels out there the gap has certainly closed

There was a time when stainless steel blades were known not to perform as well in certain applications such as swords etc that need differential heat treat

These days it comes down to what certain mediums makers of you choice are using

In the forged world carbon steel blades still are king but San Mai pieces certainly have their merits
 
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Great article, nowadays we're spoiled to have such a variety of steels available as well as the proper tools to take advantage of them. With diamond abrasives being easily and cheaply available the "hard to sharpen" debate is a moot point. While it's true you can't pick up a rock off the ground and sharpen your knives with it there are plenty of portable options available.
 
Oh you bunch of wussies, :D So why don't one of you educate the rest of us on why it's not considered iron then?
 
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