Chad Williams aka Ranger288 is NO GOOD!

Wear, Flaw, Call it what you will. I am not really sticking up for anyone but I am saying it IS possible that the guy never even noticed that flaw. It was listed as LNIB meaning it was at least fondled. Not sure how it happened. I wish Ranger would comment when he logs on.
 
I wish he would too, as i hope this issue gets resolved favorably. This is undoubtedly the type of stuff that causes trading forums to get deleted.

From Alpha's posts, he did say he complained in a few emails and that Ranger basicly blew him off and told him *tough*

If it was me, at that point, after trying to resolve business privately and as gentleman, if i was told to bugger off basicly, i'd simply pursue compensation by whatever means available i.e. Paypal and credit card companies.

It's nice the offer to send the blade in for refinishing, but still, that does nothing to thwart Ranger or anyone else from misrepresenting merchandise in the future. Not to mention, if the knife was as advertised, re-finishing would not be warranted.

If this was sincerely an oversight on Ranger's part, i would think he'd have gone out of his way to make the deal right when confronted on it. This leaves him guilty as charged in my eyes.


edited to add:
if i was the one who bought the knife, i'd seek $50 refunded off the price i paid, then send it for refinishing. I'm not convinced a full refund would be in order here, and if i was the seller i'm pretty sure i'd prefer to just make everyone happy. This seems to me as a good compromise.
 
You not the only one waiting for a response. I have several emails from him telling me that he is not going to give me my money back, but I would be interested for him to offer some kind of excuse in public. He has stuff for sale as of the 18th of this month. My guess is "why respond?" if he never acknowledges anything here, then it just buys him time while everyone waits for him to come down from the mountain. Meanwhile, I have a knife I can't sell and $350 bucks I can't spend. If he has the money to go globe-trotting then he should have enough to refund my money.

To Gonzo_beyondo: I dealt with him because he was a regular here on the forums and was a gold member. I foolishly thought that meant something. I know that he has had some good transactions in the past, but when one went bad he showed his true color I guess.

This is not a case of give him some time and maybe he will make good, as some people have suggested. He has told me flat out that there will not be a refund, and that I will just have to sell it, but that he is sorry that I am disappointed. How nice. :rolleyes:
 
I have several emails from him telling me that he is not going to give me my money back
Click to expand...

There has been allot of debate about this, but straight from a moderator, it is acceptable to post "Business" e-mails. If you post an e-mail from Ranger saying that your not getting your money back. It's an open and shut case and I encourage you to post one.
 
Gimme a sec and I'll get some up. They are coming out of my sent folder so the top is actually my reply to what is on the bottom. Does that make sense?:confused: :)
 
The controversy always comes with the fact that e-mails can be altered. However I feel like I know alphamaniv pretty well and I know that he wouldn't so something like that, so I am eager to read this e-mail
 
-----Original Message-----
From: James Mason
Sent: Tuesday, June 17, 2003 8:22 PM
To: Chongnoi@aol.com
Subject: RE: Busse Air Rescue


Hello Chad,

I recieved the Ark Today. I would like a refund. The reason for this is that you said the item was carried, but in new condition. There is a pretty good size piece of coating gone on the back of one serration and what looks like rust there. Do you want me to return it to the address on the box? Since I paypaled you the money, you can just use paypal to return it. I am sorry that this did not work. Please advise on shipping. Thanks,

James Mason
 
-----Original Message-----
From: James Mason
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 1:09 PM
To: Chongnoi@aol.com
Subject: RE: Busse Air Rescue


Pictures wil be forthcoming. I cancelled the auction as soon as the knife arrived and saw th problem. I really didn't think that there would be any problems in returning it as an inspection peroid is usually allowed. I will send pics today, and the knife back to you as soon as you let me know where to send it. When can I expect my money to be returned?
-----Original Message-----
From: Chongnoi@aol.com [mailto:Chongnoi@aol.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 9:19 AM
To: [James Mason] James Mason
Subject: Re: Busse Air Rescue


I never used the knife and it was in mint condition when I sent it to you. I also noticed you have it for sale on Ebay. Could you send me a photo of the knife with the defect as you stated. Are you sure the coating did not come off from putting it in and out of the sheath. I am really suprised to hear your comments as there was nothing wrong at all when sent to you. There should not be any rust, as INFI is pretty rust resistant. If any minor rust developed it was after I sent it to you-maybe the humitity in the package and in the sheath caused this over the last two weeks. The knife was sent to you exactly as it appeared in the photo I sent you. Apologize if it did not meet your expectations or you have had second thoughts about it. Chad
 
-----Original Message-----
From: James Mason
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 7:58 PM
To: Chongnoi@aol.com
Subject: RE: Busse Air Rescue


That is not acceptable. I contacted you as soon as I recieved the knife and I am not happy with it and I expect a refund. If you spent the money that is not my problem.
i am going to report the no refund to paypal, Bladeforums and anywhere else that I can. I can't believe that you would act that way, espeically while being a member of blade forums and the military. It's a rip off and bad form all the way around. I can not sell that knife will a defect. I want the refund ASAP. Surly, there is a place that can recieve it for you. I can take credit cards through paypal.
-----Original Message-----
From: Chongnoi@aol.com [mailto:Chongnoi@aol.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 7:50 PM
To: [James Mason] James Mason
Subject: Re: Busse Air Rescue


Alphaman4, UNfortunately, I do not have the funds to refund as the money was spent. I am sorry you are dissapointed in the knife. I do not remember any defects and the way you recieved it is exactly as I recieved it from Busse Combat. The knife was never used. From the photos I can not see any defect, maybe the photos not clear. I also no longer have a address to send the knife to, even if I could afford a refund, as I am at a different location and leaving for Africa in a few days and do not know when or if I will have a mailing address. You hopefully should be able to sell the knife, as your other ARK, on Ebay or Bladeforums. Sorry for your inconvienence. I would never have sent or sold a knife with any defects that were not noted, so I am very suprised-or never realized myself any minor flaws which happen with custom knifes. Take care and good luck. Chad
 
-----Original Message-----
From: James Mason
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 8:32 PM
To: Chongnoi@aol.com
Subject: RE: Busse Air Rescue


No pissing contest as no threats were made. I simply stated my course of action since you are not going to refund the money for a knife that doesn't meet expectations.
You can see the defect very well when you have it in your hand. Give me an address to send it to and then you can see for yourself. Getting the knife fixed is not the issue. You said like new, it is not. I want a refund plain and simple. I will do what ever I can to see that I get it. If you are a man of your word as you claim, then do the right thing and give me my 350 bucks back.

James
-----Original Message-----
From: Chongnoi@aol.com [mailto:Chongnoi@aol.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 8:27 PM
To: [James Mason] James Mason
Subject: Re: Busse Air Rescue


Again, I do not want to get into a pissing contest with you and hope we can work things out. I sincerely do not remember any nicks or marks as you say on the knife. I am a man of my word. I do not like threats. I can not even see the nick. Can you send an enlarged photo? If there was a defect that is on the knife I am sure the BUsse warranty will cover it. But, the nick or mark or whatever it is you say, was not caused by me. The knife was sent as I recieved it. There was no useage to it, it was sent as is as I recieved it again. The knife was sold as is, and was a great deal as it is a collectors rare model and will be a good user for you. You will have to sell it elsewhere. Sincerely, Chad
 
Alpha, just to be a voice of reason,

I really don't know, so i'll ask.. Let's say you got the blade refinished, would you then be able to sell it for your money back? Or better yet, do you think it would fetch more than $350 on eBay?

If so, then i guess you could consider this a lesson learned, but yet not take a loss. It's just one way so as you are'nt 'stuck' with it as is.

Again, the paypal/credit card issue should work, but will cause Ranger problems most likely. That's another choice.

The selling of this knife, as long as it was'nt sold "As-Is" should definitely be the final decision of the buyer and if it isn't up to par, it's the seller who must make it right. This is bordering on fraud, if i'm not mistaken. (post office might also help in that case)

I feel action should be taken against Ranger, i just don't know to what extent as far as misrepresentation/fraud.
This isn't *new to me, as it seems many kids in the military feel they're *protected* and can freely shun responsibility without incurring any repurcussions from those actions. The best thing you could do is find his whereabouts in the military and discuss this matter with his supervisors and see how far that takes you. Company Commanders don't like to hear this **** ;)

edit:
he denies that it was damaged, but would make no effort to make the deal right. Your word vs. his, and i know neither of you.
I suggest the first option above, get it fixed, and sell it. And let Spark determine Ranger's fate. After reading the emails, i think that's the best course of action.
 
These next few were sent before the trouble started after I found out that I had some more ARKs so I was going to try to sell this one

-----Original Message-----
From: James Mason
Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2003 12:10 PM
To: Chongnoi@aol.com
Subject: RE: Busse Air Rescue


Did you have any other offers on the Air rescue? I ask because I did get in on the original offer and I didn't know it, so I got two in the mail today. Three is more than even a hog like me needs, so I am loking to sale the one I got from you because it's not here yet anyway ;) Thanks for any help and sorry to be so much trouble.

James

alphamaniv

-----Original Message-----
From: Chongnoi@aol.com [mailto:Chongnoi@aol.com]
Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2003 1:03 AM
To: "James Mason"
Subject: RE: Busse Air Rescue


Still for sale. You can have it. Just send via paypal to this email address. Thanks. It is a very nice knife and very practical, kind of like a Groove Master, a Killer B, Public Defender and a serrated rescue knife all rolled into one. The sheath is very rugged and really hold the knife in there tight. I am only selling it because I have several other simliar custom busses and I need the cash. Thanks again. Chad



edited to remove my home email addy. Trying to avoid spam
 
-----Original Message-----
From: James Mason
Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2003 2:50 PM
To: Chongnoi@aol.com
Subject: RE: Busse Air Rescue


Ok thanks. If you don'tind I will use your picture, and put it up for sale. I am really psyched about the desert model!
Thanks,
James

-----Original Message-----
From: Chongnoi@aol.com [mailto:Chongnoi@aol.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2003 2:34 PM
To: "James Mason"
Subject: RE: Busse Air Rescue


You must be pretty excited about getting both the regular and desert ARK!!!!!!!! Lucky you. I did get several other offers after you, but I deleted their emails, so I do not remember who it was or their address. I am sure it should be easy for you to sell it. Chad
 
Sorry that I can't figure out how to get the his original message on the top of my reply, but I don't know how too.
 
Well from what I read, he has no plans of sending you a refund. Best advice I can say is to send it to Jerry for a refinishing and stay clear of Ranger, Everyone that ever does a search for his name here will come across this thread and be aware that he doesn't offer a three day inspection period. :(
 
Gonzo, the reason that I bought the knife from Ranger288 in the first place is because I do want a knife like this. When I found out that I had indeed got in on the original sale offer(the knives just showed up) I just figured I would try to make a buck for the knife fund and sell two. I figured that the one from Ranger288 might sell better because that really is a sweet leather sheath. Of course, when I saw it's condition, I stopped the auction ASAP and was glad that it didn't sell. I have since put the other two up for sale and one has sold and one has not. In the end, if he never makes good then I will indeed send it to Jerry and take him up on his kind offer. That does make me kinda bad though, because I think there is something like a $70 refinishing charge and it doesn't seem fair that he should have to eat it. Then I will have this knife as I originally planned. It's the right and wrong of the thing to me. He screwed me and is going to get away with it. I have paypal doing an investigation, but that is no guarantee of my money back, and I am not sure if I can charge off or whatever on the credit card because it went through paypal. Then it would screw my account up, and I have had it for a couple of years. I am waiting for information back from the Postal Inspectors Office, and I believe that Ranger288 term of duty is either up or ending so I don't think the CO route would do much either. I figure that it is a hard and expensive lesson learned, but who knows? It might workout, but I am not holding my breath.
 
well, i'm going to be blunt...

now this is my expectation, and opinion, and it probably matters little, but... his email defines said knife as "Carried"

the term "carried" to me means the following:
It's cut the occasional envelope, FedEx box, it's been launched from my pocket 7-12 times, and it fell in the pool with me just about every time i got drunk... and aside from that, it's never been used.

Now when i look at your pics, if that knife had been carried, it's *like* new. Not New, but pretty close. That chip, or wear, call it what you will (TBG) could easily have come from the sheath i imagine.

So on one hand, i'd have expected slight wear. On the other hand, i woulda liked a full disclosure cuz this is a far cry from a $20 knife. LNIB also does to some extent mean slight scuff or wear, again, see price tag. This stuff would matter not one bit if i was to use this knife, but if i was collecting it, i'd expect collector's grade condition and that chip is equivelent to a crease in a baseball card.

It's a fine line, my friend.
Take Jerry up on his kind offer, and either sell, or keep. It sounds like a fine blade to hold on to, and i'm sure it'll be good as new, if not better than, when you get it back. I don't really see you as losing anything here, aside from some time. You've gained a lesson and next trade will be sure on the terms of contract in advance.
 
I never used the knife and it was in mint condition when I sent it to you. This was taken directly from one of the emails above


Gonzo says - could easily have come from the sheath i imagine.

No way on earth did a leather sheath do that to the crinkle coat of a Busse knife.

I feel like I have made my case, and I really see no more point of me adding anything else to the thread. The point was only to report a bad transaction and I did that. We have strayed around the subject, myself included, discussing this and that, and if anyone else wants to add then by all means do so. As for me, I don't see what else I could possibly contribute other than to drag a guy over the coals over and over and that is not the point of this forum or even my style. I wish that I could get my money back or some sort of price adjustment, but I don't see it happening. As far as banning from the forums, that is not my decision. I will not deal with Ranger288 again. If you choose to and it goes bad, then remeber that you were warned. If it is smooth, then all the better. Maybe we can all learn a little something here for use in the future. It's best to lay out the terms very clearly in advance of a knife purchase, regardless of member status or impression. I really don't think that will protect anyone from someone who intends to rip them off. After all, saying that "we agreed on an inspection period" really means nothing if the person keeps your money and sends you a bad knife or none at all. Bottom line, most folks are good and honest. I also want to say that one bad deal does not a criminal make. I am in no position to judge anyone here. Yes, I feel screwed, but maybe there is a sitution that I don't know about, or maybe I just caught him having an off week. This whole thing has made me sick. Real world sick, so in my own best interest it's over for me. I am not going to worry about it anymore. It was a bad deal but the deal is done nontheless and I am moving on. :D See you all around the forums
 
Have been gone for several days, so this is the first chance I have had at responding to the emails. I do not have any bad intentions towards Alphaman and do not accuse him of anything shady. In all honesty the knife was sent in unused condition and there was no mark on the blade as Alphaman states or the photos are slightly showing. SO I am quite suprised. As for offering a refund, the question, I wrestle with, is if there is a defect and I did not casue it or see it, was it caused after the knife was recieved by Alphaman? I am again not saying there is no wrong doing by Alphaman. It is just a dilemna in that I say there was no mark on the knife when sent and now also Alphaman says there was a mark on the knife when recieved. I do not know if Alphaman is suffering from "buyers remorse" and trying to get a refund or if there was sincerely some mark on the knife that somehow I had a severe brain defect and did not see or happenend in shipping or unsheathing the blade. Right after I sold it to Alphaman I recieved email from him asking if I had mailed it out as he wanted to cancel the order as he had also recieved two additional ARKs from Busse (One bought and the other a gift from BUsse that he has sold). I explained that I had already sent the knife out and spent the funds. THen as soon as he recieves it he claims a problem. I have emailed Alphaman and offered a remedy of possible suggestion for reconcilliation. He can send the knife to Busse for repair and I will pay the charges myself and take a hit out of good intentions; or he can resell the knife to myself minus the paypal, shipping, handeleing, resell fees; or he can resell it himself and probably get all his money back or try make a profit as in the future this knife will become more rare if he holds on to it. I can probabably arrange to have one of my relatives handle the situation in my abscence. As soon as I received the funds from Alphaman for the knife, I transfered them to pay off some bills so the funds were not available for a refund-and again why should I refund when the knife as I sold it did not have that mark. I could never have forseen any problems, except buyers remorse, as the knife was in unused perfect condition when sent. And I have sold serveral other Busse/knives to other forum member and have received nothing but positive results and comments from the buyers. I do greatly thank Jerry BUsse for intervening and offering to recoat the knife where Alphaman had the krinkle coat chip off. As for being sold with a 3 day waiting period-that was never mentioned. Hope this will all work out. Chad My email is chongnoi@aol and if anyone has ony questions and/or coments they are free to contact myself.
 
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