Chinese clones of Chinese brands

[SpySmasher]

Okay guys, what the heck is going on here?.

Cloneception.

 

[AtechReviews]

OK, a lot of speculation going on here, so I'll try to sort it out.
First of all some specification about the brands mentioned:
Rike are a manufacturing company owned by Richard Wu, produces under Rike Knives, but also does some OEM and other work (such as anodization) for other brands.
District 9 - not a manufacturer, but a stand-alone brand that has great designs (IMO) that are being manufactured by other companies including Rike and Reate.
Dicoria - a dealer of Chinese knives, operating on Ali.....ss and DH...e, have ordered some knives made for them in the past but generally not a manufacturer.
The District 9 knives that are sold at their Ali store are genuine District 9 knives and not a clones.
Not every knife sold on the Chinese platforms is a clone (for example my Rike 1701, which is an original Rike knife announced by Mr Wu that was sold exclusively on those platforms). Another example is Maxace Knives.
So turns out there is no mystery behind this after all.

BTW, I saw somebody mentioned that CKF knives are being made by Kevin John, so yeah, that is 100% true.
Nothing wrong with that IMO, their level of craftsmanship and QC is amazing and some other high end companies could learn a thing or two from them.

 

[PirateSeulb]

A AtechReviews your post mostly brings to mind one of the biggest issues I and I suspect others have with these companies is not so much where they are made but as much where we are told they or made or the high secrecy they sometimes have over where something is made. I know that transparency in a company helps me trust them and believe in the company and their product.

 

[SpySmasher]

A AtechReviews your post mostly brings to mind one of the biggest issues I and I suspect others have with these companies is not so much where they are made but as much where we are told they or made or the high secrecy they sometimes have over where something is made. I know that transparency in a company helps me trust them and believe in the company and their product.

And, probably, this is the future of Chinese cutlery.

However, we are currently in that weird twilight world of confusion as the Chinese knife industry transforms from craptastic rip-off artists into high-quality makers of original knives.

 

[kiemtruong]

loads of them on a website called dhgate all copycat clones.

 

[PURPLEDC]

loads of them on a website called dhgate all copycat clones.

Again. Just because its sold on that or any other chinese trading site does not mean its a clone or a rip off. Dhgate and ali are like the amazon and ebay of china. Anyone in china can make an account and sell goods. And to think that Chinese people dont have access to chinese made goods is a bit of an odd way to think. Now no, you are not going to get a genuine ZT or spyderco but that is a different situation altogether. Either way their is no such thing as a 100% fool proof purchase even if its a legit dealer as a number of scams can be had to defraud them unkowingly and that can accidentally spill to unsuspecting customers. But no, just because its on a chinese trading site doesnt make it a fake.

 

[Mo2]

Dicoria - a dealer of Chinese knives, operating on Ali.....ss and DH...e, have ordered some knives made for them in the past but generally not a manufacturer.

heres a funny thing... china knives on fb have these clones being made by Dicoria... at least they are being sold by dicoria and they are showing the making of the clones. so im positive either they are making them or have a factory they use specific for them to make the clones they are requested to make/sell.

 

[AtechReviews]

heres a funny thing... china knives on fb have these clones being made by Dicoria...

What's China Knives on FB? Haven't seen such a page.

im positive either they are making them or have a factory they use specific for them to make the clones they are requested to make/sell.

Yeah, they sell (and possibly order production of) clones of other knives as well. However, the District 9's that they sell are 100% genuine, no doubt about that.

 

[AtechReviews]

your post mostly brings to mind one of the biggest issues I and I suspect others have with these companies is not so much where they are made but as much where we are told they or made or the high secrecy they sometimes have over where something is made. I know that transparency in a company helps me trust them and believe in the company and their product.

Well, it's just a cultural thing, they don't give much info on the process, at least not just put it out in the open. They do trust their partners with info though and that is where most of these news are coming from.
I mean, you don't know where and by whom most of the Chinese knives made (in most cases you just know the face of the company), that's why the key is to judge them by the end result alone - the quality of the knife itself.
It's all about the reputation with these guys - if you make consistent good knives then you are on a roll, screw up once and you are back down.
Luckily, there still are folks who test those knives (including the clones) to make sure these guys won't pull off an S30V CRKT Hootenanny once again, thus preventing scams and dirty tricks.

 

[vanadium]

Rike are a manufacturing company owned by Richard Wu

Another thing I've heard repeated a lot, and maybe it's true, but how does anyone actually know? I'm of the opinion that "Richard Wu" is as real a person as "Kevin John". I think you're right, that we ultimately have to judge these knives on the basis of product, and not process or provenance.

 

[AtechReviews]

Another thing I've heard repeated a lot, and maybe it's true, but how does anyone actually know? I'm of the opinion that "Richard Wu" is as real a person as "Kevin John".

Wow, that is just on a whole new level of speculation and skepticism.
How do you prove a human being exists?
Well luckily I have a freaking picture of him:

His name isn't really Richard (just as Kevin John's name isn't really Kevin John), but if you knew a bit about Chinese culture, you would know that Chinese people who communicate with western people a lot, usually take a simple western name in order to communicate more easily.
For example the man behind Carson Tech Labs (great designs and awesome knives BTW) isn't really called Carson Huang, but Huang Liang Zhi. Yeah, Carson is def easier to pronounce. And yes, he also truly exists.

 

[Mo2]

For example the man behind Carson Tech Labs (great designs and awesome knives BTW) isn't really called Carson Huang, but Huang Liang Zhi. Yeah, Carson is def easier to pronounce. And yes, he also truly exists.

he designed the real steel megalodon 2017 knife.

What's China Knives on FB? Haven't seen such a page.

i ment Samier knives my bad. in any case Samier actively is making clones based on peoples input on facebook. really makes me sick that they think its is okay. even that wavester64 guy is on those pages asking if when they are releasing these clones so that he can promote them on his youtube channel. sickening.

heres some photos of the Samier clone factory where they supply Dicora and other stores clones. again makes me sick.


also doesnt help that AtechReviews is actively promoting clones all over the web.
this hurts everyone that makes the originals. it hurts people that sell clones as the real thing also. also hurts people that convince others that they are good when they really are not good. at least not in comparison to the real thing.

this is what these chinese clone companies say
"I am viewing your Youtube channel, there are many excellent videos on your channel. So I want to collaborate with you. Can you make video for our product and give me a good review on amazon? We can provide the best service for you and refund to you by paypal. If you are interested in our product please contact me as soon as possible. I am waiting your messages. Thank you!"

and thats how they get known. free products to spread the clones. sickening.

 

[AtechReviews]

he designed the real steel megalodon 2017 knife.

That's true, he also produced it among his other knives (it was known as the Carson Boiling Flipper - also sold on Ali BTW).

heres some photos of the Samier clone factory where they supply Dicora and other stores clones.

Samier don't make knives for Dicoria, they are 2 totally separate organisations with different stores, etc.

this hurts everyone that makes the originals. it hurts people that sell clones as the real thing also. also hurts people that convince others that they are good when they really are not good. at least not in comparison to the real thing.

Does it really hurt though? The companies that have been cloned the most (ZT, Spyderco, Hinderer, CRK) are doing better than ever. Microtech were hurt more by allegedly making their own clone than by clones of their knives.

I've never supported scams and selling fakes as genuine knives. If you have been following me you would know that I've been giving free advice on how to tell the fake from the original. Clones don't have logos, so couldn't be sold as genuine knives.
About the overall quality of clones - can't objectively say those are all not good. Some are good, some exceptional and some are bad, that's where I come in handy.

this is what these chinese clone companies say
"I am viewing your Youtube channel, there are many excellent videos on your channel. So I want to collaborate with you. Can you make video for our product and give me a good review on amazon? We can provide the best service for you and refund to you by paypal. If you are interested in our product please contact me as soon as possible. I am waiting your messages. Thank you!"

and thats how they get known. free products to spread the clones.

I know exactly who you are talking about - Kubey Knives on Amazon.
They have approached me as well, turned them down and even wrote an article about them and their shady business practices.

makes me sick.

Maybe you should take a pill. But not a generic drug, those are clones of the genuine pills and not as good as the original

 

[PURPLEDC]

That's true, he also produced it among his other knives (it was known as the Carson Boiling Flipper - also sold on Ali BTW).


Samier don't make knives for Dicoria, they are 2 totally separate organisations with different stores, etc.


Does it really hurt though? The companies that have been cloned the most (ZT, Spyderco, Hinderer, CRK) are doing better than ever. Microtech were hurt more by allegedly making their own clone than by clones of their knives.

I've never supported scams and selling fakes as genuine knives. If you have been following me you would know that I've been giving free advice on how to tell the fake from the original. Clones don't have logos, so couldn't be sold as genuine knives.
About the overall quality of clones - can't objectively say those are all not good. Some are good, some exceptional and some are bad, that's where I come in handy.



I know exactly who you are talking about - Kubey Knives on Amazon.
They have approached me as well, turned them down and even wrote an article about them and their shady business practices.


Maybe you should take a pill. But not a generic drug, those are clones of the genuine pills and not as good as the original

As much as i agree with 90% of what you said i dont think the drug comparison is valid. Drugs are patented and when the patent runs out (usually 10 years) they become fair game. And you can always vet where a drug was made and who made it. Not so much with clones. Either way, the rest of it i think your spot on about.

 

[ThePeacent]

Well I was thinking of starting a thread on this thing that I've found but I guess this place is appropriate due to the extensive knowledge of Chinese brands that some members have here.
I stumbled upon what looked like a Kershaw OSO Sweet for $7 retail, new, with many in stock available at different places (Chinese dealers)
A pic of it:

Now I was expecting a poorly built, crappy folder like Tac Forces or MTechs, the thing is that this knife is just as good as the real Kershaw Oso Sweet. Same feel, weight, shape, assisted opening, materials, steel, everything. Even the Kershaw name in the blade.
I'd like to know what the original OEM is.
Same with this CRKT Ripple, which I bought under the name of "SR0059A", from the company "ShuangRong Knives", and after searching on all forums (this included) I haven't found anything about it. Knife below (sorry for bad pic, got it not long ago)

All my Google-fu leads to is CRKT and some of this brand's models pop up, as well as the history and name of the CEO of CRKT, but nothing, nothing at all about Shuangrong.

I've even gone to their website (written in the knife's box) but it doesn't exist, adress is long gone.

TLDR: I'd like to know what are the names of the original OEM of Kershaw Chinese folders, as well as the relationship between Shuangrong knives and CRKT. Thanks much.

 

[PURPLEDC]

Well I was thinking of starting a thread on this thing that I've found but I guess this place is appropriate due to the extensive knowledge of Chinese brands that some members have here.
I stumbled upon what looked like a Kershaw OSO Sweet for $7 retail, new, with many in stock available at different places (Chinese dealers)
A pic of it:

Now I was expecting a poorly built, crappy folder like Tac Forces or MTechs, the thing is that this knife is just as good as the real Kershaw Oso Sweet. Same feel, weight, shape, assisted opening, materials, steel, everything. Even the Kershaw name in the blade.
I'd like to know what the original OEM is.
Same with this CRKT Ripple, which I bought under the name of "SR0059A", from the company "ShuangRong Knives", and after searching on all forums (this included) I haven't found anything about it. Knife below (sorry for bad pic, got it not long ago)

All my Google-fu leads to is CRKT and some of this brand's models pop up, as well as the history and name of the CEO of CRKT, but nothing, nothing at all about Shuangrong.

I've even gone to their website (written in the knife's box) but it doesn't exist, adress is long gone.

TLDR: I'd like to know what are the names of the original OEM of Kershaw Chinese folders, as well as the relationship between Shuangrong knives and CRKT. Thanks much.

Now I have no idea if its true. So let me be clear that I am not saying this is what I believe or that I know anything anyone else doesn't. But some of those knives may be legit. Or at least backdoored out of the factory that the legit knives are made. Kinda like how a couple years ago a bunch of unauthorized microtech handmades hit the streets with no logos or serials and that was because an employee was stealing parts, assembling frankentechs and selling them as marfione customs. Its possible someone either raided a garbage can, took off with blem stock or any number of scenarios. Usually with the cheaper knives the differences are pretty apparent when someone clones them. Simple stupid stuff. I actually find it harder to spot the differences in the higher quality clones. Not saying that there are no differences and that the quality is the same. I'm just saying you have to dig deeper to spot them.

 

[AtechReviews]

TLDR: I'd like to know what are the names of the original OEM of Kershaw Chinese folders, as well as the relationship between Shuangrong knives and CRKT. Thanks much.

The cheaper Chinese clone scene is a real sh!tshow, because no one takes the time to find out what truly goes on there, so most of the info is based on rumors.
I'll tell what I did heard and know.

ShuangRong (or SR Knives) make cheap clones of knives with 3-5Cr steels and a very low price tag, so that Ripple is probably just a clone and not an OEM produced knife.

The Kershaw on the other hand might be a clone (made from stolen blueprints), or like Purple said - knife stolen from the production/a blem that didn't pass QC/Frankershaw made from parts left from the original production by the "Third Shift". It's all about the luck with these - sometimes you could get a knife that is similar to the original, and sometimes faulty knife with major defects.
Either way, the most important part is that you like them and use them.

 

[ThePeacent]

The cheaper Chinese clone scene is a real sh!tshow, because no one takes the time to find out what truly goes on there, so most of the info is based on rumors.
I'll tell what I did heard and know.

ShuangRong (or SR Knives) make cheap clones of knives with 3-5Cr steels and a very low price tag, so that Ripple is probably just a clone and not an OEM produced knife.

The Kershaw on the other hand might be a clone (made from stolen blueprints), or like Purple said - knife stolen from the production/a blem that didn't pass QC/Frankershaw made from parts left from the original production by the "Third Shift". It's all about the luck with these - sometimes you could get a knife that is similar to the original, and sometimes faulty knife with major defects.
Either way, the most important part is that you like them and use them.

I sure do! The Kershaw OSO Sweet is around $60 shipped here in Europe, or bought from local stores, and I got this one for 1/8th of the price and works flawlessly, takes a wicked edge and looks like the real deal

The reason why we Europeans buy so many SRM, Enlan, HARNDS, etc. They cost $15 shipped tops, while a RAT, KaBar Dozier or Chinese Kershaw is usually over $50 here.

 

[AtechReviews]

The Kershaw OSO Sweet is around $60 shipped here in Europe

European knife prices are ridiculous, no wonder many are turning towards Chinese made knives with free shipping.
I wonder why major knife companies do nothing to subsidize this market, so that people could buy their knives at prices similar to the US ones.

 

[marcinek]

Luckily, there still are folks who test those knives (including the clones) to make sure these guys won't pull off an S30V CRKT Hootenanny once again, thus preventing scams and dirty tricks.

Well that's good, because you wouldn't want to buy a clone that had bogus steel.