Crazy these cost about the same

EChoil said:
Both Emerson and ZT seem over-priced when viewed one-on-one. Emersons are crazy-tough knives and ZT's are no doubt fancier in appearance.

Back off for the bigger picture, however: two Emersons for the price of one Sebenza. Suddenly those Emersons are very reasonably priced.
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You must be the Anti-ChrisReeve of whom the prophecies foretold... :D I'd take the Seb, myself.
 
I think all three of those models cost too much for a pocket knife. It IS a knife , not who you are. Just my opinion for FWIW.
 
Sikael said:
You must be the Anti-ChrisReeve of whom the prophecies foretold... :D I'd take the Seb, myself.
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Nope. Still have one Sebenza in a drawer. They're probably the best pocket knives in the world.

Frankly, I'll take two Emersons to one Sebenza any time.

We're talking crazy costs. Keep it in perspective....
 
Collecting "anything" is more of a personal obsession than trying to impress anybody. Knives, guns, cars, watches. I see the Sebenza as being a work of precision engineering and metal-art. Chris Reeve has won the annual BLADE award for Engineering Excellence on numerous occasions...that award voted to him by his custom knife-maker peers.

p.s. ...and a Rolex probably shouldn't cost $10,000, but it does.
 
The Rolex throws a light on the crazy expensive titanium/steel $7k blade someone posted last week! I know which I'd have.

A friend of mine collects Rolex. Picks them up cheap and fixes them, sells one occasionally, & bores everyone rigid any time he sees someone with one on their wrist!

Back to the OP though.

Those are two very different knives. One is a fancy knife, one is a using knife. I'd hope the ZT could take every day wear and tear and still look great after a year, but the other one gives the impression it wouldn't look a lot different if you put it through the dishwasher or washing machine or, indeed, rock tumbler!

I may be wrong of course, as I don't have an Emerson or a ZT to handle.
 
I don't own either, But I will never buy a chisel grind knife.

Regarding the OP's lack of guidance, I thought the bottom knife may have been a fake he had bought for the same price as the top knife.
 
Sonnydaze said:
Me, too.

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:thumbup: Very nice! I still like the older, over-sized pivot on the zaan. The new ones are cool as well, I just like the rare bit of decorative flourish that crept into the original design. I also appreciate that he went with the Hinderer-style thumb-stud blade-stops. It's pretty unlikely they could ever fail, particularly with the shock-absorbing washers; they also help reinforce it against side-to-side blade-play... not that the huge stop-pin on the Sebenza is too delicate. :D The Chavez Redencion 228 has a detent that makes it impossible to do anything but fire the super-thick blade out like an auto, and the stop-pin is half the size of a CRK (or Spyderco PM2) stop-pin.

EChoil said:
Nope. Still have one Sebenza in a drawer. They're probably the best pocket knives in the world.

Frankly, I'll take two Emersons to one Sebenza any time.

We're talking crazy costs. Keep it in perspective....
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I can't believe I'd have to say it when you just suggested I 'keep it in perspective', but it's all a matter of perspective.

The price-tag on the Emerson may seem like a 'crazy cost' to someone who can buy a couple Manix 2's instead. For me, even comparing an Emerson and a large Sebenza without the names of their almost legendary creators, there's just nothing about the G-10, liner-lock, tanto or chisel-ground 154CM, and reports of sometimes lax quality-control, that would make me want two production Emersons when I could pick up another large Sebenza or Umnumzaan instead.

It's another case of individual preference, but I usually like knives that have a more even blade to handle ratio... though IIRC, that might be related to Emerson's martial bladecraft philosophy. His larger models, like the 'Super Commander' and 'Super CQC8' are pretty cool... but they're also @300$. They have titanium liners, but contrasted with the ZT 0620CF, selling for 240$, the extra 60$ is hard to spot. The ZT has a full, nicely stonewashed titanium frame-lock with steel insert, carbon fiber instead of G-10, and a much nicer blade of CTS-204P. If you favor G-10, you can go with the 0620 and get it for just 200$. Both are designed by Emerson, both are US-made. It's an easy decision, for me.

And 410$ isn't such a 'crazy' amount, IMO, for the craftsmanship, precision and excellent customer service. That said, I'd take the 900$ Shirogorov Model 95T over two Sebenzas... but it's a tough call. I prefer Shirogorov to CRK, mostly because I like flippers, but they're also flawlessly designed and amazingly effective slicers. And yet, there's plenty of folks on BF who wouldn't take two Shirogorov's for one custom Rassenti, or Begg, or Peter Carey. I thought this shit would be fairly self-evident, but whatever. Some people can argue blue vs. red for days, constantly mistaking personal preference for fact. And the correct answer is 'blue', obviously. ;)

Sonnydaze said:
Collecting "anything" is more of a personal obsession than trying to impress anybody. Knives, guns, cars, watches. I see the Sebenza as being a work of precision engineering and metal-art. Chris Reeve has won the annual BLADE award for Engineering Excellence on numerous occasions...that award voted to him by his custom knife-maker peers.

p.s. ...and a Rolex probably shouldn't cost $10,000, but it does.
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:thumbup: CRK has won that award 13 out of the last 15 years -- that's a powerful statement of the respect he's earned as a knifemaker, because these aren't just CRK 'fanboys' voting for him. Pretty soon they'll have to just rename it 'The Chris Reeve Award for Manufacturing Excellence' and give everyone else a chance. :)
 
As for my lack of guidance in the original post, I think I made it clear later on after inquiry it was deliberate. It has been weird to see the complaints over it. To me if I see something that doesn't interest me, or I don't agree with the presentation, I move on.

Now back to the original open ended topic

Yes it all boils down to what we like, as to what we will buy.


Give me the machining capabilities(and skill set for those who will point that out) to produce a typical Emerson, ZT, and Sebenza and I can turn out knives with the only cost variant being materials, and machining steps. In that scenario it is quite possible for the ZT to be the higher priced knife of the three.

and to me that really makes things more interesting. Throw in a frame lock Emerson into the mix, and that adds to the craziness of it and what we will pay for comparatively

There have been some great posts in this thread.
 
bobnery said:
and to me that really makes things more interesting. Throw in a frame lock Emerson into the mix, and that adds to the craziness of it and what we will pay for comparatively
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If you want to talk about framelocks and crazy,

An Emerson HD-7 costs the same as a Small Sebenza.

Try to wrap your head around that one..
 
marcinek said:
I'd elaborate on MY feelings about the OP and the thread, but this isn't W&C.
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I have learned to stay away, I had the unfortunate pleasure of reading the past threads.....

It's like watching someone fish in a dead lake.
 
This thread seems to have taken a turn in a hurry...

In response to the OP; I don't think it's all that crazy. I didn't bother to look up the ZT, but due to the unique color I assumed it's a limited run. Sprints always sell for a lot more than they ought to.

The Emerson is a relatively simple knife without much in the way of material cost, but labor's much higher and of course it says Emerson on it.

I think it basically boils down to paying for labor and a name on the Emerson and materials and exclusivity on the ZT. Makes sense to me that they'd come close to meeting in the middle.
 
ATwistedStaple said:
This thread seems to have taken a turn in a hurry...

In response to the OP; I don't think it's all that crazy. I didn't bother to look up the ZT, but due to the unique color I assumed it's a limited run. Sprints always sell for a lot more than they ought to.

The Emerson is a relatively simple knife without much in the way of material cost, but labor's much higher and of course it says Emerson on it.

I think it basically boils down to paying for labor and a name on the Emerson and materials and exclusivity on the ZT. Makes sense to me that they'd come close to meeting in the middle.
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Can you explain the labor costs being higher on the Emerson?
 
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