Creationish Vs Evolutionism? BE POLITE!

[jac8610]

Now we're talking about if everyone followed Christian beliefs? Your post doesn't make much sense.
And accusations of racism are uncalled for.

I meant if everyone followed a belief structure similar to the one you profess to follow. It would be rather easy if if everyone on this planet had the same values as their neighbor.

 

[JCavSD]

Europeans of indistinguishable religious beliefs treated each other like cattle for slaughter...

Indistinguishable at this point or not, the vast majority were still people who held religious beliefs.

I don't blame the belief in religion/creationism as the catalyst for all the worlds ills, but faith based reasoning has clearly contributed to some horrific events throughout time.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

How do you not see this?!

Because the religions didn't do it. The peoples did. Even when they shared religion, language, and customs.

 

[Dan57]

All religions throughout history did the same thing to each other. Christians in the Crusades put babies on spits (their lances) and roasted them. Viking raiders put monks and
their monasteries to the flame. Romans put christians against wild beasts in the arena. Every religion ever has persecuted the ones before it and after it. So yes, I do believe the world would would be a better place without religion. Maybe we wouldn't slaughter each other, upon the insistence that one side was right. How do you not see this?!

Would the world be a better place? Yes, at least IMO.
Would it be that much of a better place? No.
Would world peace be achieved, as you were implying previously? No frikkin' way.

 

[jac8610]

Ok, now this is just getting wierd. You know nothing of my beliefs and you do not know my race nor my thoughts on race relations. I suppose this would be a good place for me to bow out of this conversation as it is going downhill fast.

I mean if you were a "Christian" of any sort "race relations" would mean nothing to you. We are all humans, any difference is all cultural. Your race does not matter to me, you are a human being.

 

[jac8610]

Would the world be a better place? Yes, at least IMO.
Would it be that much of a better place? No.
Would world peace be achieved, as you were implying previously? No frikkin' way.

World peace would not be assured, as humans are a warlike species. We are just unable to work together to achieve a goal, without a significant impetus. What I am saying is that if people were to agree upon a set of values, we would be much more unlikely to engage in genocide. Genocide being a behavior our species has been engaged in multiple times in our past.

 

[jac8610]

Because the religions didn't do it. The peoples did. Even when they shared religion, language, and customs.

Even when Christians invaded other christians (see fall of constantiople) a difference in religion was used.

 

[jac8610]

The point is, people are shitty. I wish that any one religion would help solve this problem, but no one will. The reality is, we are lucky to be alive and religious authorities demean this. Rejoice in life, treat people fairly and life is good.

Remember Marcus Aurelius:
“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.”

 

[Dan57]

World peace would not be assured, as humans are a warlike species. We are just unable to work together to achieve a goal, without a significant impetus. What I am saying is that if people were to agree upon a set of values, we would be much more unlikely to engage in genocide. Genocide being a behavior our species has been engaged in multiple times in our past.

No disagreement here! I suggest we compromise by agreeing to follow all of my rules.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

Even when Christians invaded other christians (see fall of constantiople) a difference in religion was used.

Somalia. All Somalis are the same, except for the power structure ignoring common faith, language, and culture, and going for personal power.

Even worse, in the henotheistic ancient world, where peoples accepted that each others gods were essentially their own under different names, this had minimal effect on the wars they fought.

Power, wealth, authority. In religious or secular terms, or both mixed together.

 

[gkpfingsten]

I chose inexplicable. So here's the explanation. The only thing I know is true is that people believe what they want to. Personally, I can reconcile the two, but only because I choose to. Honestly, I don't know what happened. I think a lot of people choose to ignore one thing. Unless we've actually observed it ourselves, it's all second hand knowledge that requires some level of faith (trust, belief, whatever). Even if it comes from an expert, or group of experts, we are trusting they know what they are talking about. Heck, even in the face of observation, you'd be surprised how many people would deny an event to protect their ego because they might have to admit to being wrong. However, I'm not about to claim I've been around since the creation of the universe. If anyone has, please come forward, and set us straight.

 

[jac8610]

No disagreement here! I suggest we compromise by agreeing to follow all of my rules.

By insisting on your rules, you are no worse than genocidal freaks that have populated history. Respect men, and women, and most importantly women's right to choice, you are being a just human. After all, most mammals have the ability to control reproduction and it is on the female side of things that they are done. I don't care what you label it as, what I have laid out is is a simple rule for a good humanity. Respect humans, and life among each other will be good. Everything else is an economic error that can be adjusted.

 

[jac8610]

No disagreement here! I suggest we compromise by agreeing to follow all of my rules.

By insisting on your rules, you are no worse than genocidal freaks that have populated history. Respect men, and women, and most importantly women's right to choice, you are being a just human. After all, most mammals have the ability to control reproduction and it is on the female side of things that they are done. I don't care what you label it as, what I have laid out is is a simple rule for a good humanity. Respect humans, and life among each other will be good. Everything else is an economic error that can be adjusted.

 

[Dan57]

By insisting on your rules, you are no worse than genocidal freaks that have populated history. Respect men, and women, and most importantly women's right to choice, you are being a just human. After all, most mammals have the ability to control reproduction and it is on the female side of things that they are done. I don't care what you label it as, what I have laid out is is a simple rule for a good humanity. Respect humans, and life among each other will be good. Everything else is an economic error that can be adjusted.

That was my point. People, in general, don't like to compromise.

 

[jac8610]

Somalia. All Somalis are the same, except for the power structure ignoring common faith, language, and culture, and going for personal power.

Even worse, in the henotheistic ancient world, where peoples accepted that each others gods were essentially their own under different names, this had minimal effect on the wars they fought.

Power, wealth, authority. In religious or secular terms, or both mixed together.

Religious authorities hold most of the power, wealth and authority. I submit that they are the problem.

 

[Dan57]

Name some examples.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

Religious authorities hold most of the power, wealth and authority where?

Certainly not in the Americas. Europe is all but atheist. Muslims? Lots of religious talk but secular authoritarian leaders. East Asia? No.

 

[jac8610]

People can comprise, when it extermination. You can choose when it is you figure it to be your life or someone else's. See the Pakistani Muslims who burned a Christian neighborhood, or the Christians who burned planned parenthood centers. Or even Waco. (Though I must say the people at Waco were wacko in my opinion). The point is people hurt each other daily. Most often they use differences as an excuse. The most obvious difference is religion. If religion were not an issue, we would have one less major difference to persecute each other with. I do not like organized religion; I feel it accomplised it's purpose during the dark ages saving humanities knowledge (and doing a piss-poor job at that). I feel it is time we shrugged off this ancient burden and become better people for it. I have not seen any benefits in the modern age that make up for it's errors. Feel free to attempt to correct me, but I do believe we have grown past it and that anyone holding onto it is merely afraid of what life really is.

 

[Dan57]

So, what you're saying is that you don't have any examples.

 

[Raymond1000]

Religion of some sort is a human universal. Anything that widespread must have its roots deep in our evolutionary history. We can certainly see signs of religion as part of the shift that lead to behaviorally modern humans. Anything that has persisted that long, and that broadly, must serve some human purpose. If religion were really a spandrel, all pain and no gain, it would have been selected against over the millennia.

There’s an old saying about babies and bathwater. The new crop of scientific atheists see nothing but the bad of religion. They see nothing but the good of science. Shrinks call this kind of thinking idealization and devaluation. They try and help its practitioners to think more realistically.

It is the power of science and technology that has allowed humanity to commit mass murder in unprecedented numbers. Science and technology taught us to eradicate a city in an eye blink. Science and technology gave us the ability to wreck our biosphere. It isn’t religion that has brought humanity to the brink of catastrophe.

There’s another old saying about eyes and motes and beams.