Custom Knife Collectors Association – Any in

ptgdvc said:
I have been pondering the notion of makers and purveyors as full members of a Collector's Association. I think the temptation for them to try to influence the objectivity of the organization may simply be too great. It would be better for the Collector's Association to be controlled by the collectors. Perhaps an associate membership could be offered to the makers and purveyors.

P
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That is an excellent point.

Bill
 
ptgdvc said:
I have been pondering the notion of makers and purveyors as full members of a Collector's Association. I think the temptation for them to try to influence the objectivity of the organization may simply be too great. It would be better for the Collector's Association to be controlled by the collectors. Perhaps an associate membership could be offered to the makers and purveyors.

P
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I can see your concern as it's a valid one. And was also my though, however I know the makers and dealers that have offered support have much to offer and will work to make the association a success.

And I must wonder that if the ABS recognized collectors as "full" members and collectors served on the board how much need would there be for a collectors association?

Earlier in this thread someone mentioned mistakes the ABS made; would we be making the same mistake by not allowing makers and dealers to be full members? :confused:

IMO, the association will need "get it done" people whether it be collectors, makers or dealers.

I'm open here, just making points for discussion.

Collectors? Makers? Dealers?
 
Kevin Jones said:
As the result of soring legal cost and the lengthy time to settle litigation, mediation has become a very acceptable practice in many areas to settle disputes. It's becoming fairly common practice where parties on opposite sides of issues will agree in advance to abide by an expert's (mediator's) decision after hearing both sides. This is very common in the construction, real estate and development fields and others. Many times both the winners and losers benefit from mediation rather that going through the courts system.

And, unless I'm mistaken at times the ABS will mediate a solution when complaints are brought against ABS makers.
Please correct me if I'm wrong.
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Neither side in labor disputes or mediation that is used to try to settle disputes before they become lawsuits has to abide by what the mediator works out. However, it is frowned upon to enter into mediation without an open mind towards working something out.
 
Keith Montgomery said:
Neither side in labor disputes or mediation that is used to try to settle disputes before they become lawsuits has to abide by what the mediator works out. However, it is frowned upon to enter into mediation without an open mind towards working something out.
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Keith, notice I did not mention labor disputes in my post.

As I said, this practice is becoming fairly common in the US for certain disputes where both parties AGREE IN ADVANCE.

Originally Posted by Kevin Jones
As the result of soring legal cost and the lengthy time to settle litigation, mediation has become a very acceptable practice in many areas to settle disputes. It's becoming fairly common practice where parties on opposite sides of issues will agree in advance to abide by an expert's (mediator's) decision after hearing both sides. This is very common in the construction, real estate and development fields and others. Many times both the winners and losers benefit from mediation rather that going through the courts system.
 
ptgdvc said:
I have been pondering the notion of makers and purveyors as full members of a Collector's Association. I think the temptation for them to try to influence the objectivity of the organization may simply be too great. It would be better for the Collector's Association to be controlled by the collectors. Perhaps an associate membership could be offered to the makers and purveyors.

P
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Salient Point indeed.
 
Would any maker or dealer be able to be a full member? Would any maker or dealer be able to get on the Board of Directors? If not, what would the restrictions be? Who would be the voting members that would choose the members of the Board? What would be the cost of membership?
 
It's imperative that some makers and dealers be involved in some capacity.

I would especially like to hear from makers as to what their opinions are as to that capacity.
 
Kevin Jones said:
And I must wonder that if the ABS recognized collectors as "full" members and members served on the board how much need would there be for a collectors association?

That is a very interesting question, for another time and place.

Earlier in this thread someone mentioned mistakes the ABS made; would we be making the same mistake by not allowing makers and dealers to be full members? :confused:

The simple fact is that the interests of collectors, purveyors and makers are not identical. A Collector's Association should be, first and foremost, for the benefit of the collectors. If you want to call the organization something else, that is another matter.
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I hope this clarifies my perspective.

P
 
Peter although certainly not identical, I believe the interest of collectors, makers and dealers are more similar than some may think. ;)
 
ptgdvc said:
I have been pondering the notion of makers and purveyors as full members of a Collector's Association. I think the temptation for them to try to influence the objectivity of the organization may simply be too great. It would be better for the Collector's Association to be controlled by the collectors. Perhaps an associate membership could be offered to the makers and purveyors.

P
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Who said anything about this organization or any other like it being objective? The very nature of collecting kind of precludes true objectivity. Reading posts on this very forum should make that imminently clear. What you are talking about is exclusion. The types of problems that you may be anticipating are best dealt with by enacting rules that prevent them, not by excluding people. Furthermore, how would you define a "collector"? Would I be excluded because I make knives, irregardless of the fact that I have bought somewhere in the neighborhood of 20 custom knives in the last couple of years? Where will that line be drawn? Will people who spend a LOT of money on knives have more voting power than the casual collector? Perhaps you could give some examples of how makers or purveyors might improperly influence such an organization, particularly in light of the fact that there are HOPEFULLY significantly more collectors/buyers in the pool of potential members than makers or purveyors combined. I do not mean to sound confrontive, but you seem to be suggesting that this new organization do some of the same things that bother people about some other organizations.
 
jdm61 said:
Who said anything about this organization or any other like it being objective? The very nature of collecting kind of precludes true objectivity. Reading posts on this very forum should make that imminently clear. What you are talking about is exclusion. The types of problems that you may be anticipating are best dealt with by enacting rules that prevent them, not by excluding people. Perhaps you could give some examples of how makers or purveyors might improperly influence such an organization, particularly in light of the fact that there are HOPEFULLY significantly more collectors/buyers in the pool of potential members than makers or purveyors combined:D
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Good point Joe, because if collectors don't overwhelmingly outnumber maker's and dealers then that's precisely why we seriously need a collector's association. ;):D To enlist more collectors. :eek: ;)

How do we specify who's a collector?
I can't think of a single dealer that's not a collector and MANY makers collect custom knives.

Kind of looks like we are coming up with more issues than solutions. :eek:

However identifying the issues and discussing them is part of being productive. :thumbup:
 
jdm61 said:
Perhaps you could give some examples of how makers or purveyors might improperly influence such an organization...

...I do not mean to sound confrontive, but you seem to be suggesting that this new organization do some of the same things that bother people about some other organizations.
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1. Do I really have to paint you a picture? I think not.

2. Exactly correct. A Collector's Association FOR the benefit of the Collectors. If it is not, lets not pretend that it is a Collector's Association.

P
 
ptgdvc said:
1. Do I really have to paint you a picture? I think not.

2. Exactly correct. A Collector's Association FOR the benefit of the Collectors. If it is not, lets not pretend that it is a Collector's Association.

P
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Call me dim, but yes, you do have to paint a picture, because I'm not seeing the problem.
 
So sorry for not reading all the prev postings .. anyhow I have a rather silly question ;)

Can a knife collector be a full member of ABS or Guild?
 
Well boys, I have been a knife collector for 70 years and a perveyor/dealeer for 43 and you have just run me off this thread.

When you form an club or group that can include the dealer trash as well as you wonderful collectors let me know
 
A. G. Russell said:
Well boys, I have been a knife collector for 70 years and a perveyor/dealeer for 43 and you have just run me off this thread.

When you form an club or group that can include the dealer trash as well as you wonderful collectors let me know
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Mr. Russell.........are you trying to improperly influence this fine, upstanding new organization through the use of your long established position in the knife community, your inumerable contributions to said community and maybe a little guilt? You truly are "dealer trash" (insert FTC/FDA approved silly sarcasm warning label here) ;):D
 
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