emerson quality

Originally posted by Kampfjaeger
But in the final measure of things, Emerson knives are one of a select few who stand out as being good enough to be relied on in professional circles.
If that were true, some of these relatively minor complaints would be irrelevant, but there are many other companies who make very high quality knives that can be relied upon with fewer problems. I like a lot of Emerson's designs, I think the Wave is a stroke of genius, and I still want a Commander, but there's way too many complaints about Emerson's QC to ignore. And Emerson's prices are a bit high, considering that you could get a LCC MA, 710, Carnivour, Kershaw Boa, or Military for less than most of Emerson's knives. If they bumped their QC up to par and dropped their prices a bit, they'd do a lot better in this very competitive market.
 
I handled maybe 10 Emerson knives (it is quite difficult to see them here) and I would never buy anything from that company. The biggest disappontment was the Commander. The knife felt like all the screws were loose, the blade touched the liner... I thought the knife must fall apart any time...:( I know, you can get replacement screws, use loctite... but why? Why would you have to tune up a knife you just bought for let´s say 200.00 USD?

BTW the best Emerson knife I have handled (and I bought it later) is IMO the BM version of CQC7....

David

Edit: to change :) -> :(
 
Originally posted by rogue_spear
If you check this board you will find an alarming number of posts about bad QC on emerson knives. Emerson needs to realize that there are many great knives made by different manufacturers out on the market. The word is getting out that their QC sucks and their products are overpriced.

Well said Rogue Spear. They really do need to pay closer attention to their QC, and their knives are overpriced. I have found better quality on the Taiwan made Outdoor Edge Magna than on the standard Emerson Mach-1. Now ask yourself, how many Aluminum handled Magnas can you buy MSRP for the price of one Mach-1? Ernest Emerson has alot of pull in the knife community and it's well deserved, but his production pieces need a little more attention if he wants to compete with other production companies. By doing so, not only will he stay on top, but his customers will be happy and loyal to his products.
 
My only experience first hand with Emerson knives was a CQC7B that I ordered directly from them. After waiting two months I received what I thought would be the be all and end all of pocket sized edged weapons...what greated me from inside it's little cardboard box was a huge disappointment. The first thing I noticed when I removed it from the box was that the g-10 handle scales were coming apart!!!! The handle had numerous threads sticking out and I found out the hard way what happens when you try and pull them off. I ended up wet sanding the scales and making them smooth to give them the appearance of carbon fiber. After awhile I realized that the now smooth grip was too slippery so I got brave and tossed the scales in a sand blasting cabinet with a gentle media (not sure what it's called but it had the consistency of talc.) After blasting the scales looked factory new...except for the color (now a dull greyish) so I soaked them in Armorall overnight....problem solved.
I'm sure I could have contacted the factory and had them send me some new scales but after several phone calls to them while my knife was on order and being told over and over again...."you'll have it next week" I really wasn't in the mood to deal with them again.

ps: if anyone has some g10 scales that they want freshened up or blades they want re-blasted drop me a line.
 
Hi... I've heard a lot of things in response to my posting - some that I agree with and some I don't.

<b>Rogue Spear:</b> I agree that there is a significant number of complaints concerning QC at EKI. And yes, there are many great manufacturers of knives out there. (You'll never catch me badmouthing anyone else's work. Their tools may not be to my taste or suit my needs, but they are a d@mn sight better than anything <i>I</i> could ever hope to make.) However, I would have to say that that statistic is broadly applied here. There are two types of knife purchases. The first is one that is intended to be used whereas the second is intended for display or just to collect and enjoy owning the knife. Those who purchase a knife to be used are not going to be overly upset by having the finish wear off the screws with use. It isn't that big of a deal and it is easily remedied. And fixing the alignment of the blade is no big deal either. It took me all of 5 seconds to do mine when I first got it and I haven't had problems with it since. An imperfectly aligned blade is at worst, going to mar the finish on the blade if uncorrected. Otherwise it has no bearing on the performance of the knife. If you bought a knife as a show piece, well, I guess I can understand your less than enthusiastic response to having to tinker with your new toy. You want to keep it in as pristine condition as you can. For a collector, that would make perfect sense.

Having said all that, I too would prefer to not have my blade arrive out of alignment or have the finish wear off the screws so quickly, but they are minor issues to me. The whole product is what counts. And you know that the specwar guys are not worrying about the finish rubbing off their screws either. They like the knife as a whole. Not all of them, but a significant number of them do.

<b>Medusaoblongata:</b> The minor complaints <i>are</i> irrelevant in one circle and relevant to another. It all depends on what you want. If and when you get a Commander, you'll love it. It really is a solid, well designed knife. I've been nothing but pleased with mine. As for prices... Yeah, I'd rather see them lower too. But then the market is what defines price rather than my personal desires (unfortunately ;) ) However, the price can be seen as somewhat of an indicator as well. Basic economics states that as the demand for a non-ubiquitous commodity increases, it drives the price up commensurately. It seems to me that there are a few folks out there that see Mr. Emerson's knives the same way I do. At any rate, EKI is still a relatively small company and still experiencing its growing pains. The more it grows the more consistant the QC will get. That's just the nature of the beast.

<b>David1967:</b> I too owned the BM/E CQC7 and carried it everywhere for a number of years. I think the world of that knife. It is built like a tank! When I retired it and started carrying a Commander, I gave my old BM/E-CQC7 to my girlfriend. I did so because she needed a good knife and I felt confident in her having that one. It had and kept a great edge. It was hardened a little too much for my taste, but it never gave me reason to complain. As for thinking your knife was going to fall apart anytime... grab a screwdriver. Problem solved. Now your knife is ready for use. And why would you want to tune it up in the first place after spending $200? To set the action to the way you prefer it. You are going to have to do it anyway at some point later on. You do take care of your gear don't you?

<b>El Cid:</b> I am not familiar with the Magna or the Outdoor Edge line of knives. Perhaps they are very fine tools. However, in my experience, I have handled a lot of knock offs from Taiwan, Pakistan, and several other places. And while they will cut (They are knives after all) I could not say that they were anywhere close to the quality of an Emerson. If I was going to spend a good chunk of my hard-earned money on a knife, I would much rather drop it all on one great knife than on a bunch of lesser quality ones.

<b>DanEHunter:</b> That's a LOT more work than I ever would have done. I think I would have just called EKI or emailed them a complaint and sent the blade back for repair/replacement or a refund. I'm impressed.:cool:
 
Alot more work than you would have done eh?....oh well, guess I'm funny like that. You should see the Para-Ord P-14 I built.
 
Sorry, I just read the Moderator's notice that we now have to pay to post pics and sell now, etc. I guess the free lunch is over (sigh). *G*
 
I just can not pass this post up ... i know i will never bother with emerson again i wanted a commander pretty bad a few months back i finally found one in a trade when i got it i was empressed at first the blade was awsome !! nice and heavy i love g10 scales after flicking it out a few times the pivot screw came loose i didn,t notice this untill the blade got scratched well i adjust it and put some loctite in there but that really doesn,t fix the problem does it cause now you can,t adjust it that easy the liners are way to thin to much flex i didn,t care about the black on the screws comming of that a norm i really didn,t like the wave some times it would just pop the blade out a little and i got cut twice i traded it last month i had a specwar and thought that was about the worst knife i have ever had the blade would never line up in the same position i adjusted it so many times my hand hurt i almost ran it over with my tractor i was so fustrated way to expencive and no quality at all i'll never buy or trade for one again

Tim
 
Originally posted by Kampfjaeger
Sorry, I just read the Moderator's notice that we now have to pay to post pics and sell now, etc. I guess the free lunch is over (sigh). *G*

That's a misunderstanding. If you buy a premium or gold membership you will have a new option of uploading pix directly from your hard drive and won't have to put them on a website before you can post them (which is very convenient, by the way; I've been using it). Everybody can still post pictures the old way whether you pay for a premium membership or not; that hasn't changed a bit.

-Cougar :{)
 
I've owned three Emerson's. The latest one, a CQC7B just arrived from Emerson warrant repair. They repainted all the screws, etc. but the lockup still sucks. You can barely apply pressure on the blade and the linerlock disengages. The other two also had lock problems. What a dissapointment. You are buying the name with these guys, IMHO.
 
Redratsnake... It sounds like your problems were born out of neglect and unfamiliarity with your gear. Personally, I like the wave. It provides you with a fast way of deploying the blade without having to "John Wayne" it open. However it isn't for everybody. There are some great knives by other makers out there that I'm not partial to. Just for example, I'm not fond of Microtech. And they are supposedly GREAT knives. I have yet to hear anybody say anything negative about them. As a matter of fact every post I have read about them gave them phenomenal reviews. Now please, don't take the aforementioned statements as a backhanded slur about Microtech. I know nothing about them other than the good things I have read about them. I'm just saying that there are great knives out there that are reliable and sturdy and appealing to everyones differing tastes. There is a chair for every butt. I just honestly think that it is a mistake to pan Emerson knives simply because they are designed to be taken apart and have maintenance performed on them. If you can take it apart, it can and will loosen. Pay attention to your gear. This sort of thing reminds me of when the M16 first saw service in Vietnam. It was billed as a rifle that didn't require maintenance and cleaning. You know what happened? They got to be known as being unreliable and problematic. They jammed all the time and got the wrong people killed. It wasn't long before the Army started issuing cleaning kits to the troops. After that, the malfunctions dramatically reduced in frequency. The same goes for your knife. Whatever you choose, pay attention to it and maintain it. Otherwise you may be sorry.

Couger Allen... Thanks for the clarification! That's good to know. Sorry to have spouted off misinformation.
 
Kampfjaeger, you need to stop making excuses for Emerson's sorry ass QC! If a knife buyer buys a NEW knife it should be in NEW condition and function correctly. If I wanted a USED (paint off the screws, loose pivot, blade play) knife, I would buy a USED knife at a much lower price instead of a new knife at a high price. Do you get it?
 
Originally posted by Kampfjaeger
<b>David1967:</b> As for thinking your knife was going to fall apart anytime... grab a screwdriver. Problem solved. Now your knife is ready for use. And why would you want to tune it up in the first place after spending $200? To set the action to the way you prefer it.
No problem, I can do it once - I even tuned up my 360.00 USD folder but it was just a pivot pin - nothing else. And when I use it I do not want to carry a small screwdriver all the time with me.

You are going to have to do it anyway at some point later on. You do take care of your gear don't you?

With Emerson, you are going to do it sooner (not later) and quite often and you will never reach the optimum - like with other knives. Sorry, I am not going to repeat the mistakes of others who bought the knives. You will get better quality products from other companies - that is for sure.


David
 
Again, I have to agree with both CH and Rogue Spear on this one. I've bought various G-10 handled folders from Benchmade, Spyderco, EDI and Boker and I have handled them equally, but none has looked as crappy as my Emersons only after handling them for a few days! I also think that they are overpriced when you look at the overall quality. I really have come to believe you're only paying for a name when you buy a production Emerson knife. :mad:
 
Rogue_spear,

In communicating via this medium, it is sometimes difficult to ascertain the "tone" of someone's post. However, it seemed pretty apparent to me that you feel argumentative and mouthy. It is awfully easy to be impolite when it is not face to face. Seeing as neither of us have any personal axes to grind with each other I suggest we keep things civil.

I am certainly NOT apologising for poor QC issues. It is something that happens in every company - and are more apparent in smaller companies that are in the middle of the growing process. Some of the instances I have read about here are absolutely unacceptable. I agree. And they should be remedied. However, some of the complaints are generated from people who probably would find something to complain about whatever the case. Or maybe they just don't like Emersons to begin with (a simple taste issue) and any additional instances of a negative nature are just nails in the coffin as far as they are concerned. I happen to be that way about SCUBA gear. Perhaps I am unusual in that I got a really nice production Commander and had no problems despite hard use and carrying it through some rather harsh conditions. It has held up very well. I have no problems resharpening it, the screw finish has worn off, and the blade stays pretty well in "perfect" alignment. I check it every day first thing when I put it on with my wallet, etc. and adjust the screw tension if necessary. Usually it doesn't need it, but it <i><u>always</u></i> bears checking.

El Cid... Back to your previous post, I agree that production QC could use a little "Tweaking";). But I think you are mistaken when you imply that there is a serious problem in their system and that they are passing out sub-standard knives. I can only speak from personal experience in that I received a top quality tool.
 
The problem with Emersion knives is that they look "hard used" straight from the factory! and it only gets worse...

Does the quality need to improve? Sure, if they want me buying another one. Evidently though, there are enough people who think Emerson knives are great to keep them in business, no matter how poort the quality is.

It is a shame though, because I really like the design on some of the knives. The biggest letdown I've had yet was the Commanders I have made the mistake of buying or trading for, and thinking each time that this time it will be a quality knife...wrong.....
 
Obviously some stinkers have gotten through QC and made their way to consumers. That happens. I don't know what else to say. My Commander arrived looking brand new, in great shape and has proven itself in the field to be a knife I'd want to have with me. I sympathise with those of you who had that happened to you. I was fortunate and received a great knife. Good luck to you guys.
 
Kampfjaeger, too bad if you don't like my tone. I am not going to pull my punches when it comes to knife companies screwing people over with poor QC. I know personally with having to ship back a Rekat Sifu. The knife companies don't pay us back for the shipping and and insurance to ship the knife back to them and we are without knife for a while. This ruins the knife buying experience and we all work real hard to pay for our knife hobby.
 
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