Emersons Sales vs ZT Emersons

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JOELSM said:
Just to add a visual to what many here have mentioned with regard to build and materials. This is the liner lock on a CQC11 compared to a ZT0200:

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This is a pic of the CQC11 blade center (or lack of) compared to the blade center of a ZT0200:

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I chose to compare the two because both have the same blade steel, both have liner locks, both have similar blade lengths. I bought both around the same time (within a couple years). The Emerson cost me $179. The ZT0200 cost me $129. The pictures speak for themselves as to build quality. Needless to say, I'm very much looking forward to the ZT / Emerson collaberation.
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Centering a Emerson is real easy, there are tutorials out there showing it if you need visual aid. Newer Emerson's also have thicker liners, though I never had issue with my '05 Commander that had the thinner ones.
 
Emerson guys buy them on mystique, that won't change....this may actually introduce more users to emerson and will give them a try

I personally believe that it should eat into their sales, similar design and much better construction/qc/materials, but in reality it probably won't
 
I don't think it will hurt sales. ZT is much higher quality in my opinion. $200 knives should not need to have the blade centered, they should come that way. Cold Steel knives are always centered at one third the price point. I think ZT will give those that like Emerson's designs but want better execution something they can pull the trigger on. This may in turn drive quality and sales at Emerson. And can someone please explain why EE did not just do a production version of the CQC6? If he would have Ernest could've had other hobbies like buying NFL teams! I never understood why his most famous and desired design was never manufactured.
 
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tricker said:
Emerson guys buy them on mystique, that won't change....this may actually introduce more users to emerson and will give them a try

I personally believe that it should eat into their sales, similar design and much better construction/qc/materials, but in reality it probably won't
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I really love how people in this thread presume to know as to why people purchase Emerson products. Again, I buy Emersons because they melt into your hand.
 
precisionshootist said:
I don't think it will hurt sales. ZT is much higher quality in my opinion. $200 knives should not need to have the bade centered, they should come that way. Cold Steel steel knives are always centered at one third the price point. I think ZT will give those that like Emerson's designs but want better execution something they can pull the trigger on. This may in turn drive quality and sales at Emerson. And can someone please explain why EE did not just do a production version of the CQC6? If he would have Ernest could've had other hobbies like buying NFL teams! I never understood why his most famous and desired design was never manufactured.
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To answer your question....
In 1994, the president of Benchmade Knives, Les DeAsis, approached Emerson to manufacture the CQC6 on a larger scale as a factory production model.[16] Preferring to keep the CQC6 as a custom-only knife, Emerson instead licensed a similar design of his, the CQC-7.[25] Even though it did not have the craftsmanship of a handmade piece of cutlery, it satisfied customers with their own version of Emerson's work, at an affordable price and without the five-year wait.
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Yes I know he decided not to do a production version, but why? I was into knives back then and still to this day I don't own a CQC7. It's not the same knife. I could have ordered a custom but not long after he stopped taking orders. I think there are many many knife enthusiasts like myself that would have jumped at the chance for a production 6. Now I'm afraid most have moved on and the knife would not sell well today
 
precisionshootist said:
Yes I know he decided not to do a production version, but why? I was into knives back then and still to this day I don't own a CQC7. It's not the same knife. I could have ordered a custom but not long after he stopped taking orders. I think there are many many knife enthusiasts like myself that would have jumped at the chance for a production 6. Now I'm afraid most have moved on and the knife would not sell well today
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I must have missed that part were the 6 lost it's appeal:rolleyes: If they introduce a production 6, something more fancy then the 7, but not quite a custom 6, they wouldn't be able to make them fast enough, and the secondary marking would be worst then sprint run spydies:D
 
And you may well be correct. I'm certain I would purchase one if it indeed was a CQC6, as in same handle design, scales with titanium bolsters, satin finished blade and slotted screws. That being said, the design has now lost a great deal of appeal and today's hard use folders make the original CQC6 seem light duty. For example, in my opinion the liner lock appears to be problematic to say the least and chisel ground blades have shown to be more of a disadvantage than anything. In my experience chisel grinds are only effective if they are done as a Zero Bevel. Anything other than a zero bevel on a chisel grind defeats the purpose of the the blade design. Anyway, I think I'm guilty of some serious thread drift here and for that I apologize.
 
sh00ter01 said:
Centering a Emerson is real easy, there are tutorials out there showing it if you need visual aid. Newer Emerson's also have thicker liners, though I never had issue with my '05 Commander that had the thinner ones.
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Maybe I could monkey with the Emerson and get it to center. I have tightened the pivot screw which helped, but then deployment suffered. My Emerson has some obnoxious blade play as well. That wasn't really the point of the post. I really like the wave feature and to date the best wave knives have been Emerson knives (IMO), but I personally wasn't impressed with the quality - especially at the price point. The Spyderco wave knives just never appealed to me, so the CQC11 is the only wave feature knife in my collection. I have high hopes that the ZT / Emerson collaboration will produce a high quality knife with the very desirable wave feature.

But to get back to the original point: I don't think the collaboration will hurt Emerson in any way. I personally would never have bought another Emerson based on my experience with the CQC11. I plan on buying the ZT collaboration - all of the ZT knives I have are rock solid. Emerson gets a taste of the sale, ZT gets to produce a wave knife, and I get a wave knife with the ZT build and quality. Win, win, win.
 
I really like the Emerson A-100 design but the weird grinds keeps me from buying one. I'll probably buy one of the ZT/Emerson collaborations though, or maybe a Kershaw/Emerson.
 
Don't worry about EKI, as they will continue to sell out of their knives due to the demand. I think it is wonderful that KAI is producing some models as is ZT. It will give more people a chance to own a great knife.

lol @ jstn
 
precisionshootist said:
Yes I know he decided not to do a production version, but why? I was into knives back then and still to this day I don't own a CQC7. It's not the same knife. I could have ordered a custom but not long after he stopped taking orders. I think there are many many knife enthusiasts like myself that would have jumped at the chance for a production 6. Now I'm afraid most have moved on and the knife would not sell well today
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This is only a guess, because I truly don't know why, but maybe he decided to keep the CQC 6 as unique and special as the men he designed and named it for. Seal Team 6.

Folks are so fast to criticize Emerson for not providing them with the latest greatest materials and top notch fit n finish but fail to realize that we aren't his niche market.
Most of his designs are made for and used by men and women in harms way who are more concerned about actually being able to trust their lives to their gear and less about blade centering and chisel grinds and add infinitum.....
 
cncpro11 said:
Folks are so fast to criticize Emerson for not providing them with the latest greatest materials and top notch fit n finish but fail to realize that we aren't his niche market...
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I think this makes more sense than anything else regarding why EKI sticks with the materials and finishing techniques that they are known for.
A lot of different kinds of people buy Emersons, but they seem to be designed for a specific type of user and with certain priorities in mind for blade steel performance, grind, edge type, F&F, etc. And they continue to sell, at their price point, with their performance priorities and specs, year after year, because the people Emerson designs them for like what he does.

As for who buys Emersons, the only two I've seen carried and used by people other than me (I work in a warehouse and live out in the county) were carried by shooting instructors and hunters who taught some of the SD firearms classes I took. Hardly the traditional "white collar" guys. Painting a whole group of people with the same broad brush is almost always a mistake.
 
This is the first and only Emerson that I'm interested in currently. Should turn out to be a great collaboration.
 
Murdamook said:
I really love how people in this thread presume to know as to why people purchase Emerson products. Again, I buy Emersons because they melt into your hand.
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Being ergonomic is very subjective and therefore hard to argue; but un-presumably for 200$ there are much better value knives out there

But I must agree, it is very hard to figure out exactly why their products are bought, given the competition
 
tricker said:
Being ergonomic is very subjective and therefore hard to argue; but un-presumably for 200$ there are much better value knives out there

But I must agree, it is very hard to figure out exactly why their products are bought, given the competition
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You're completely missing my point. Let me state it again: purchasing an Emerson does not make one "a wannabe high-speed operator". Taste is entirely subjective. My point was regarding the people who like to come into threads and make insulting, belittling blanket statements about people because they purchase a product.
 
cncpro11 said:
This is only a guess, because I truly don't know why, but maybe he decided to keep the CQC 6 as unique and special as the men he designed and named it for. Seal Team 6.

Folks are so fast to criticize Emerson for not providing them with the latest greatest materials and top notch fit n finish but fail to realize that we aren't his niche market.
Most of his designs are made for and used by men and women in harms way who are more concerned about actually being able to trust their lives to their gear and less about blade centering and chisel grinds and add infinitum.....
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As if quality materials/fit and finish and reliability were mutually exclusive conditions. It's a ridiculous excuse to cover shoddy quality control just to say "we don't care about the actual quality of our product. Our products get used." Certainly they do. And so do lots and lots of other companies that know how to innovate and built a knife with pride and a proper finish. Think about how great the knives would be if he took some of those designs and added steel that was heat treated harder than Velveeta, a treated lockbar that doesn't wear so fast, and had a normal edge grind.

How anyone takes the company seriously after their whole "chisel grinds are better" excuses, I will never know. I get it, that is their thing, but if they were actually superior in any way, my guess is that some other companies might have jumped on that bandwagon, and lots of knives would have chisel ground edges... not just Emerson and the bucketfull of knives on the gas station counter.


I would have been MUCH more inclined to try more with Emersons if it not for that stupid edge, and the lack of warranty when it is fixed. That being said, I preordered a ZT620CF this morning.
 
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Yeah I like the wave, don't care for the Emersons grinds or steels or liner lock. So a waved zt? I'm on it like a fat kid on fudge.
 
Can anyone here tell me the last time they carried their Emerson CQC-# on a spec-ops black bag job? Anybody here using their CQC whatever to Colombian Necktie an enemy guard that's standing between you and your exfil?

For the price, there are plenty of better options in just about every single way, so given how hard Emerson pushes their whole "OMG designed for super high speed spec-ops SWATSEAL DELTA" thing, it is absolutely cracking me up that people are getting pissy that others are calling Emersons as what they are: knives that are sold primarily by association with special forces soldiers.

Or, it just "melts in the hand", I guess. You know, whatever. It's almost as amusing as all the posts of "Emerson designs done by ZT! Finally, a knife that'll be worth the money and well built!"

That tells me that most of the people buying Emersons do so because of the marketing angle. But hey, that's cool, man.
 
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