Folder design with best lateral/prying strength

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Thick, wide blade with big pivot, solid handle scales and blade-stops that contact the frame will pry as well as is possible with a folding knife.

The Medford Praetorian pries about as well as a folder design can.
It you made it any more "pry-worthy" it would cease being a knife that could cut things.
 
Mikarta said:
Listen to Knife Nuts Podcast where he is a pretty regular guest (also a great podcast). He is a Navy veteran himself and used to make knives and sharpen knives for everyone on the ships.
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Not a citation that the guy who designed the knife said it was to pry open doors, but that Navy SEALs use them to breach doors. But nevermind, it was a rhetorical question.
 
Thereisnocowlevel said:
How would a change lock design to better resist lateral force decrease the blades cutting performance?

Most of the design features we discussed so far you could add that to any blade shape you want
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Locks aren't what experience lateral force during prying, the blade does or the pivot joint does. The weakest point in the structure. If you make it a thick slab stock blade to resist prying forces, that already impedes cutting ability.
 
Steely_Gunz said:
But what if you did? Now give me several empirical fixes for this hypothetical failure.
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So none of you have ever seen a folder develop side to side blade play?

Half the posters here are arguing against the idea of having good design elements in a folder to resist lateral forces.
 
Thereisnocowlevel said:
So none of you have ever seen a folder develop side to side blade play?

Half the posters here are arguing against the idea of having good design elements in a folder to resist lateral forces.
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In order to design for "lateral forces", you negatively affect features which make a knife useful for its primary function of cutting and still fitting discreetly in a pocket. That's why people are arguing against you.
 
lieferung said:
Locks aren't what experience lateral force during prying, the blade does or the pivot joint does. The weakest point in the structure. If you make it a thick slab stock blade to resist prying forces, that already impedes cutting ability.
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The current lock designs focus on vertical forces but once lateral force is applied it can cause the pivot/scales/liners to be pried apart and compromise that lock. Having a thick slab doesn’t really solve this issue, it’s still going to push the frame apart. I don’t see how those seal team pry bar folders can really withstand prying without frame failure
 
knarfeng said:
In order to design for "lateral forces", you negatively affect features which make a knife useful for its primary function of cutting and still fitting discreetly in a pocket. That's why people are arguing against you.
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One element which I have been mentioning is the external hinderer stop pins that brace against the front of the scales. It doesn’t affect blade geometry or pocketability. The other features brought up where one piece frames of rolled steel, larger washers, larger pivots. None of those affect blade geometry or pocketability. The whole point of the thread is to see which current folders have design elements that better resist lateral forces and to brainstorm new designs

I mentioned this earlier but manufacturers somehow managed to have everyone think all that makes a hard use folder is resistance to vertical force. And as this thread proves a bunch of folks are in near denial that it is important for a folder to have lateral strength.

Not trying to make a folding prybar, rather elements that make the common folding knife more resistant to lateral forces
 
Thereisnocowlevel said:
So none of you have ever seen a folder develop side to side blade play?

Half the posters here are arguing against the idea of having good design elements in a folder to resist lateral forces.
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Everyone is directly answering your OP, which asked, 'WHAT design elements would enhance a folding knife's ability to pry things,' and 'WHY don't manufacturers do it.'
 
Thereisnocowlevel said:
The current lock designs focus on vertical forces but once lateral force is applied it can cause the pivot/scales/liners to be pried apart and compromise that lock. Having a thick slab doesn’t really solve this issue, it’s still going to push the frame apart. I don’t see how those seal team pry bar folders can really withstand prying without frame failure
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Oh, I see what you're saying. I'll get to that after I solve the problem folding knives have with celestial impact. I really want to make sure they don't develop blade play after a direct meteor strike. :rolleyes:
 
Thereisnocowlevel said:
The current lock designs focus on vertical forces but once lateral force is applied it can cause the pivot/scales/liners to be pried apart and compromise that lock. Having a thick slab doesn’t really solve this issue, it’s still going to push the frame apart. I don’t see how those seal team pry bar folders can really withstand prying without frame failure
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Thick slab will prevent the blade from snapping or bending, as you would presumably be prying with the pointy end of the knife. The force then transfers to the pivot, which will fail as you said.

Nobody is brainwashed, except maybe the guy seeking to defy physics, practicality, common sense, etc.
 
Bad example with the Seals prying doors open with those knives.
Cause when they break , they use their team mate’s to finish the operation and just go get another one from the Quarter master when they’re back on ship or base. It only has to last maybe one prying session. —————-Us Regular folk can’t afford to wreck a knife in our daily use. And those grinds won’t cut well ether.
 
Rhinoknives1 said:
Bad example with the Seals prying doors open with those knives.
Cause when they break , they use their team mate’s to finish the operation and just go get another one from the Quarter master when they’re back on ship or base. It only has to last maybe one prying session. —————-Us Regular folk can’t afford to wreck a knife in our daily use. And those grinds won’t cut well ether.
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Tactical sandwich maker/peanut butter spreader, for prying open those stubborn condiment jars and SPAM cans.
 
Thereisnocowlevel said:
Well when I stab, am I prying or am I exerting vertical force??
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If the answer is either of those things then you're doing it wrong. Sure, you're never going to have a perfectly perpendicular impact and it'll experience some form of vertical or lateral force at the pivot or tang, but once again, making those things more resistant to that force also makes the knife less pleasant to carry and use.

Also, what are you stabbing with such force that it causes you worry? If it's a person in a self defense situation then who cares if the blade develops play? If I successfully fend off an attacker with a folder then that knife can retire in dignity. I'll buy another.

If you're stabbing trees or something like a weirdo then just use a fixed blade.
 
T.L.E. Sharp said:
It's better than you'd expect. (I lost a bet.)
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Well, I have about 2/3rds of a Cam in the freg, from Rey’s thread about slicing with our new Forum knife. :D I fried some and remembered why I leave those cans of Spam for Earthquake/disaster rations. Our dog won’t eat it........... Hmmm? Maybe. Get the wifey to think I’ve got a great idea for breakfast ??:D
 
Rhinoknives1 said:
Well, I have about 2/3rds of a Cam in the freg, from Rey’s thread about slicing with our new Forum knife. :D I fried some and remembered why I live those cans of Spam for Earthquake/disaster rations. Our dog won’t eat it so maybe a Fried Spam & Peanut Butter sandwiches for breakfast ?? Hmmm? Maybe. Get the wifey to think I’ve got a great idea for breakfast ??:D
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Go for it. Be careful which knife you choose though. Spreading is definitely lateral force and there's a manufacturing conspiracy preventing most knives from effectively dealing with it.
 
Most knives are marketed for hard use, touting the strongest locks in the business. Why should they expect the consumer use it daintily? Stop making excuses for them.

And TLE Sharp this whole thing in how you ridicule new forum member is in really poor taste for someone who provides knife services.
 
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Thereisnocowlevel said:
Most knives are marketed for hard use, touting the strongest locks in the business. Why should they expect the consumer use it daintily? Stop making excuses for them.
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But a couple of those folders that are marketed for strong locks. Attempt to pry open some doors , electrical boxes etc. when the blades snap & or bend & the locks fail. Send them in for warranty service & let us know how it works out!
 
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