GEC 3 1/2" Dogleg Jack

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Well said and described, Hal. :thumbup:
 
Could someone give me a couple of definitions, as it pertains to the knife discussion within the thread? Using the pics already submitted would be nice:

Run-Up -

Underbladed -

I kind of get it, but would like to be clear. Thanks.
 
thawk said:
Could someone give me a couple of definitions, as it pertains to the knife discussion within the thread? Using the pics already submitted would be nice:

Run-Up -

Underbladed -

I kind of get it, but would like to be clear. Thanks.
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Hal, have a look at this image and you'll see what is meant by "run-up". It's just the part of the tang projecting up above the liners/bolster when the blade is closed in the handle.

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As to under-bladed, it's when the spine of the blade (in the open position) does not mate up with the top of the backspring flushly but is seen as projecting from below at a downward angle.

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I'm a little late weighing in on the underbladed issue, but my impression has been that GEC is being held to a tougher standard in this discussion than most manufacturers. Well, it is always nice to see if I am correct (happens rarely) or just blowing smoke (frequently), so I pulled out a bunch of other production slipjoints to see how they stack up.

Before I list the results, I'd encourage anyone who is planning to put 2 dozen knives in his pockets at the same time to wear both a very strong belt and a pair of suspender, or plan on taking your pants off and carrying them to the computer, 'cuz they don't stay up very well.


A.G. Russell reverse congress - underbladed
Boker Congress Carver - underbladed
Boker Double Tree Whittler - underbladed
Buck large trapper - flush
Camillus stockman - underbladed
Canal Street Canittler - underbladed
Case humpback whittler - underbladed
Case Grandaddy Barlow - just slightly underbladed, but tang-to spring fit is poor.
Case stockman - underbladed
Case toothpick - underbladed
Case peanut - underbladed
Case yellow delrin penknife - underbladed
Case 6210 wharncliffe penknife - underbladed
GEC scout - underbladed
GEC toothpick - underbladed
Hen and Rooster whittler - underbladed
Henckels congress - underbladed
Henckels half whittler - underbladed
Kissing Crane 170th anniversary whittler - underbladed
Moore Maker stockman - underbladed
Oar Carver (based on Queen Canoe) - underbladed
Queen Dan Burke grandaddy barlow - underbladed
Queen Dan Burke small barlow - underbladed
Queen 2009 BFC barlow - underbladed
Queen folding hunter - underbladed
Queen jack (show knife) - underbladed
Queen QCCC teardrop jack - underbladed
Remington Moose by Camillus - underbladed
Rough Rider barlow - underbladed
Rough Rider canoe - unerbladed
Schatt & Morgan File & Wire gunstock - underbladed
Schatt & Morgan File & Wire english jack underbladed
Schatt & Morgan railsplitter moose - underbladed
Schatt & Morgan sowbelly - underbladed
Schrade tobacco leaf sowbelly - underbladed
Steel Warrior saddlehorn - flush

For what it's worth . . .

Dave
 
There's some great pics in this thread. I was going to get the Ivory Bone now I'm thinking about the Ebony.

As for mass producing the blades ahead of time, the blade configuration looks the same like that of #66. Perhaps this is a question for the other thread but are those underbladed as well? I agree it would look better if they were flush but its only a minor issue for me.
 
Nice image of the blade, Elliott.
I'd like to address the issue of three vs. four pins.
When a shield is pinned on, it acts as the fourth pin. The purpose of the fourth pin is to keep the edge of the handle material tight to the liner near the "open side" of the knife.
If pinned, the shield acts like a big washer. The fly in the ointment of course is there is no shield on the back or pile side.
Slim models are less prone to warpage, but obviously a toenail, and other wide patterns need the fourth pin.
A trick that cutleries use to keep the handle and liner tight, without extra pins, is to lightly stamp the liner into a concave configuration, to keep it "sprung" against the handle material.
My point is, a fourth pin is not universally needed.
 
Hi,

Very interesting reading on the smooth/under-blade discussion. A very educational thread for me.

While I would prefer all my knives to have smooth transitions, I don't think being under bladed would deter me from owning this knife. Certainly it is far better than being over bladed.

Dale
 
waynorth said:
Nice image of the blade, Elliott.
Click to expand...

If I recall correctly, Charlie, I think I copied that image (originally) from one of your posts a good while back. (Giving credit where credit is due. :thumbup:)
 
Blues said:
Looks like a classic example of history repeating itself. ;)
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Dang, did I say that before? I'm getting old enough that I probably forgot. LOL

On the underbladed issue, I got the impression from looking at my knives that a good many of them had been designed to be that way. Not perfect, but not all that far off. Although the only part of the concept-to-delivery process I've ever been in on is the "waiting for the big brown truck" part, I can imagine looking at things from a manufacturing standpoint, knowing that making everything perfect would add too much time/cost, and consequently designing the knife so that it was just a bid underbladed and you wouldn't have to worry about smoothing the transition out. It would also save the manufacturers from having to try to make that matchup between the blade and spring seamless.

Dang, now I'm feeling pretty good about all my flawed knives 'cuz I know someone smarter than me built them that way just to make me happy!
 
2Dead said:
There's some great pics in this thread. I was going to get the Ivory Bone now I'm thinking about the Ebony.

As for mass producing the blades ahead of time, the blade configuration looks the same like that of #66. Perhaps this is a question for the other thread but are those underbladed as well? I agree it would look better if they were flush but its only a minor issue for me.
Click to expand...

I'm really loving the ebony on mine. As to the to underbladed issue that I originally described as a "gripe," it in no way impacts the functionality of my knife. I've been carrying this knife since I got it and really am enjoying it.

The reason I described it as a gripe is almost every GEC I have is underbladed. I pulled out a bunch of other slip joints from a wide variety of manufacturers both past and present and did indeed find examples of underbladed knives. I will say none of the examples I found from other manufacturers were even close to being as underbladed as my GEC knives.

Knowing this gripe is simply about looks, I don't put much weight behind it I will certainly keep buying more GEC knives. This dog leg sitting in front of me right now is a solid and well built knife and worth every dollar spent on it. :thumbup:
 
morrowj_98 said:
I'm really loving the ebony on mine. As to the to underbladed issue that I originally described as a "gripe," it in no way impacts the functionality of my knife. I've been carrying this knife since I got it and really am enjoying it.

The reason I described it as a gripe is almost every GEC I have is underbladed. I pulled out a bunch of other slip joints from a wide variety of manufacturers both past and present and did indeed find examples of underbladed knives. I will say none of the examples I found from other manufacturers were even close to being as underbladed as my GEC knives.

Knowing this gripe is simply about looks, I don't put much weight behind it I will certainly keep buying more GEC knives. This dog leg sitting in front of me right now is a solid and well built knife and worth every dollar spent on it. :thumbup:
Click to expand...

Right on!! I ordered one in Ebony along with some of its relatives just a little while ago :D
 
morrowj_98 said:
I'm really loving the ebony on mine. As to the to underbladed issue that I originally described as a "gripe," it in no way impacts the functionality of my knife. I've been carrying this knife since I got it and really am enjoying it.

The reason I described it as a gripe is almost every GEC I have is underbladed. I pulled out a bunch of other slip joints from a wide variety of manufacturers both past and present and did indeed find examples of underbladed knives. I will say none of the examples I found from other manufacturers were even close to being as underbladed as my GEC knives.

Knowing this gripe is simply about looks, I don't put much weight behind it I will certainly keep buying more GEC knives. This dog leg sitting in front of me right now is a solid and well built knife and worth every dollar spent on it. :thumbup:
Click to expand...

After reading this thread, I too had to go pull out a few knives and look at them.
The knives I am using for examples range from vintage Schrade Waldens, Tested era and 60's era Case knives, and my most recent, a Remington 1178 made in 1990 by Camillus. I have never seen a knife with the blades mating as poorly as the GEC in question. We all know production knives aren't going to be perfect, but the minute imperfections I have noted on knives I have now or had in the past, were just that, imperfections.

IMHO, the GEC looks like they put the knife together with the wrong blades.
Maybe it was addressed and I missed it, but to me it looks like they were just trying to cut corners and save money.

Had I received a new GEC and noticed the blades, I would have been very unhappy. It wouldn't matter how nice the rest of the knife is.
Granted, it is mostly an aesthetic issue, and won't impact the functionality of the knife, unless the leading edges of the springs are sharp. Even then, a few minutes with a stone or file would eliminate that, but for knives that are in the 100 dollar + range, that shouldn't be necessary.
I would be disappointed if I received a 20 dollar knife that had the blades this grossly under matched, but these aren't 20 dollar knives.

Maybe I'm just being to critical. Are all the GEC knives this way, or is it mostly the Dogleg pattern ?

If they are all this way, I guess I can eliminate the thought of ever buying one. Maybe I haven't gotten as far away from being a "perfectionist" as I thought I had :D It could be, I may be missing out on owning an otherwise very nice knife by thinking this way too....
YMMV
 
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waynorth said:
Nice image of the blade, Elliott.
I'd like to address the issue of three vs. four pins.
When a shield is pinned on, it acts as the fourth pin. The purpose of the fourth pin is to keep the edge of the handle material tight to the liner near the "open side" of the knife.
If pinned, the shield acts like a big washer. The fly in the ointment of course is there is no shield on the back or pile side.
Slim models are less prone to warpage, but obviously a toenail, and other wide patterns need the fourth pin.
A trick that cutleries use to keep the handle and liner tight, without extra pins, is to lightly stamp the liner into a concave configuration, to keep it "sprung" against the handle material.
My point is, a fourth pin is not universally needed.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that information and your insight Charlie.

I know that a 4th pin is nor necessary in many cases but I have been glad to see that GEC has made the extra effort and taken the time to include a 4th pin on the majority of their knives. To me it shows strength in the knife build and as an added benefit, it is eye appealing.
 
(I can feel it in my bones...;))


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(...just trying to keep it light...)
 
I don't think we have a fight going here. Just some friendly discussion! :)

And as soon as everyone realizes I am completely right, we can move on!!:eek:
:D:D


JK, JK!!!:D:D
 
Howdy folks. I have been reading topics on these forums for some time but I just signed up today.

This topic has been very interesting. I really like that Smooth Ivory Bone.

I was wondering if one of you GEC #56 owners would mind posting a pic of each side of the knife with the blades closed?

Thanks!
 
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