I still like Benchmade, but I think I'm done with the axis lock.

jpm2 said:
Only with your specimens.
Like stated earlier, defects like nicks, corrosion, etc can come in many forms - from the factory, and self induced.

To CISTERIAN
I can completely relate. I've worked in the trouble-shoot and fixit field for over 30 years now.
There's always a demand for us. :thumbup:
Click to expand...

Amen Brother.People who can actually troubleshoot and correctly diagnose and repair grow rarer by the day!

I should also add it is a pleasure to meet you!

Thank you!
 
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cistercian said:
That's true Rev.I repaired a typewriter once that arrived in a basket in pieces.I gave them a break on the bench time so they could afford the repair!
I am very fortunate to have crazy high mechanical aptitude...I fix everything at home.Cars, appliances etc.I have rebuilt engines stripping them to the bare block etc.No problem.I forget others don't have this same ability.My poor brother can't change a sparkplug...

I always took stuff apart as a kid...and then made something new from the parts!Great fun and it has saved me thousands over the years.

Your point is well taken.Proper assembly of simple machines is an art.If you want it done correctly those practiced in the art are best able to help.
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Yep, you know exactly what I am talking about then. Just because it's simple to one, doesn't make it simple for all. I too got started taking things apart and making repairs early on and got pretty good at it over the years. Folks need to remember that people that have zero mechanical inclination/aptitude also have greenbacks and they buy "gear" too. Just like the guy that can't replace the stock and fore grip on a pump shotgun takes it to a gunsmith. Or the person that has no idea how to install a wireless router calls Geek Squad. NO shame in that though, that is why those services exist in the first place. :thumbup:

jpm2 said:
Can someone please put these back together for me? :)
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Funny as it may be, someone recently needed to send a knife in because they took it apart, stripped out several screws and couldn't put things back together. It was an Axis Assist knife if I remember correctly.
 
RevDevil said:
Yep, you know exactly what I am talking about then. Just because it's simple to one, doesn't make it simple for all. I too got started taking things apart and making repairs early on and got pretty good at it over the years. Folks need to remember that people that have zero mechanical inclination/aptitude also have greenbacks and they buy "gear" too. Just like the guy that can't replace the stock and fore grip on a pump shotgun takes it to a gunsmith. Or the person that has no idea how to install a wireless router calls Geek Squad. NO shame in that though, that is why those services exist in the first place. :thumbup:


Funny as it may be, someone recently needed to send a knife in because they took it apart, stripped out several screws and couldn't put things back together. It was an Axis Assist knife if I remember correctly.
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Had to chuckle there, Rev. Somewhere in America, a guy is standing next to his car with a flat tire, wondering just how the hell he's gonna get home. Never mind the spare and the jack in the trunk.

On the other hand, my little brother does all my computer stuff, because I'm just too old and stubborn to handle the simple PC troubleshooting stuff.

Still, I wish they'd make spare axis locks available to those of us who can replace the tire.
 
Velitrius said:
Had to chuckle there, Rev. Somewhere in America, a guy is standing next to his car with a flat tire, wondering just how the hell he's gonna get home. Never mind the spare and the jack in the trunk.

On the other hand, my little brother does all my computer stuff, because I'm just too old and stubborn to handle the simple PC troubleshooting stuff.

Still, I wish they'd make spare axis locks available to those of us who can replace the tire.
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LOL! That is right. You should have seen me trying to find the jack in my wife's car. It wasn't in the trunk next to the spare tire, nooo. It was under the driver's seat, that damn thing is wedged in there so no one can get it out. It would be nice to get some parts if necessary without having to send the whole thing in. They do send springs and stuff to guys that live overseas though.
 
Velitrius said:
Still, I wish they'd make spare axis locks available to those of us who can replace the tire.
Click to expand...

Actually a bit surprised that an after market modder on the forums hasn't made up his own for guys to buy.

Even though I've been lucky apparently by not breaking a spring, I'd buy spares. I just always prefer to have spares on hand for things that I can do myself easy enough.

I'm also aware of my limitations too and figure that's why the good Lord made people who like to work on cars. Lol. I can change a flat though. :)
 
LOL Rev, they do find some "inspired" spots to hide that stuff in our newer cars. Real fun if you are coming home from Costco and have to unload the car just to find all the gear.

CelticCross mentioned that it might be something within the knife itself that is stressing the spring on the OPs knife. I can't rule that out, and I wonder if Benchmade would replace the knife if this theory was presented to them.

Joe58, you make a good point as well. There's lots of aftermarket upgrade equipment for sale to replace OEM equipment... just look at the 4WD truck stuff alone. Still, if it were a small defect inside the scale that was stressing the spring, it might do it to an aftermarket unit too.

And if there was a big enough market for a beefed-up axis lock spring that wouldn't break, I suspect Benchmade would already be all over this issue, as it would be a clear indication that there was an epidemic problem with the setup.

I like the axis lock just fine, but apparently there's a ghost in the machine that leaves some folks with a problematic piece... be it an abrasive scale, a bad batch of springs, or some other sound explanation. This might be a good thread for Benchmade folks to read... it's stuff like this that sparks good brainstorming sessions.
 
I'm thinking the breaking has more to do with centering. The 710 I have that has had the omega springs break twice since I got it about 3 years ago had the springs break on the same side that the blade is off center to.
 
fzla226 said:
I'm thinking the breaking has more to do with centering. The 710 I have that has had the omega springs break twice since I got it about 3 years ago had the springs break on the same side that the blade is off center to.
Click to expand...

I'd never say it's not possible, but I highly doubt it...
Even a blade that is off quite a bit at the tip, the actual amount it is off at the pivot is very minimal. The distance increases the further out you go towards the tip
 
jpm2 said:
Only with your specimens.
Like stated earlier, defects like nicks, corrosion, etc can come in many forms - from the factory, and self induced.

To CISTERIAN
I can completely relate. I've worked in the trouble-shoot and fixit field for over 30 years now.
There's always a demand for us. :thumbup:
Click to expand...

I guess my knives are exceptions. I'll defer to your great experience and expertise. :rolleyes:
 
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cistercian said:
Wire springs like the omega springs can be problematic.Whenever you have sharp bends in the wire you induce stresses...which can fail later.Stress relieving such springs is difficult.Coil compression springs are much more reliable.Gunmakers have had to deal with this issue.For best reliability they use coil springs.
Corrosion will cause rapid failure too...as well as abrasion.

I think an axis lock incorporating coil springs would be bullet-proof.

As a actual apprenticed into the trade master typewriter repairman I have huge experience with small spring fabrication as well as their failure modes.
I have 3 benchmades a 530 and 2 griptillians and I really like the action of the axis.But breakage of springs like they use is to be expected.Any burrs or corrosives will only exacerbate the problem.

PS.I don't work on typewriters anymore.The PC made them obsolete overnight.But the experience gained making parts has proven worth it's weight in gold!
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Were you in the military? My pop was a master typewriter repair man in the Marines. It definitely transferred to life afterward becoming a maintenance factory worker, then leader, on to plant manager and a very good salary.

I've cycled a couple of axis locks about a bazillion times and have had no issues. The lock is as close to perfect as I've had. Sorry to hear of your troubles, but it wouldn't put me off permanently.
 
Functionality has been replaced by convenience. Maybe I'm of the generation that knows how to sharpen a knife, and unless it's really bad weather (thanks AAA) I know how to change a tire. This is a great post, very enjoyable to read in my off hours! :thumbup:
 
The Axis seems to be Benchmade's bread and butter. I doubt they'd let any consistent and obvious flaws with it ruin they're reputation and alienate they're customer base.
 
I have four Axis Benchmades, including an old 710D2 (when did they come out?), and have never had a spring break (Somehow, I wish I hadn't said that...). My work EDC, a Mini-Barrage, get used daily and has been soaked in sweat every summer for several years.

It seems very unusual for the OP to have had so many spring failures. There must be some underlying cause.

Stay sharp,
Bob
 
Omega Leather Works said:
Were you in the military? My pop was a master typewriter repair man in the Marines. It definitely transferred to life afterward becoming a maintenance factory worker, then leader, on to plant manager and a very good salary.

I've cycled a couple of axis locks about a bazillion times and have had no issues. The lock is as close to perfect as I've had. Sorry to hear of your troubles, but it wouldn't put me off permanently.
Click to expand...

I have never had one fail either...and I like the design's ability to operate perfectly even with a big piece of lint in the lock.The action is superior and I can open my grips faster than a switchblade.Epic.
I have noticed some users have had bad luck and I can't think of a way of manipulating the lock to cause it.I wonder if they have particularly corrosive sweat?

I know that sounds weird but different people have different PH and diet.The springs are in a place that is exposed.Maybe?? I have known several watch killers in my time too.No electronic watch would last on one of them more than 2 weeks...bizarre but true.

One of my masters was in the army under Patton.He took over supervision of an Adler typewriter factory they seized.My other Master and also dear friend was captured in the Philippines and endured the Bataan Death march as well as a hell ship ride to Japan.Neither of these men tolerated any slack.They were good Masters and the last shop in the area to apprentice anyone into the trade.I took 5 years to master the trade and was complimented on being such a quick study.I did all the critical adjustments for them after a time because unlike them I had young eyes!
I almost joined the Navy since my old man was in it but stopped at the last minute when I got a serious raise.So no, I was not in the military.

I miss those guys.They were serious men and superior craftsmen.
 
Definitely something about that generation. My grandfather shot down two Zeros in the Pacific, he was one of the best people I've ever met.

I believe I'm one of those people with weird blood. Most biting insects steer clear and I tarnish anything besides SS and gold. No problem with watches, but I've met people like that as well.

As for the springs, I'm really leaning toward there being some difference internally, whether it be rough g10 or something else, but I guess none of us can say for sure. Mine don't get exposed to sweat much. They don't ride in my pocket at all.
 
I have never experienced a broken omega spring myself.
I do believe what we see here on the forum when it comes to what causes spring failure; is a combination of all the reasons stated so far, along with a small percentage of springs that have simply received improper tempering.

In addition, all springs are not created equal.
A 940 spring is = to a Adamas spring?
I dont think so.
 
Keyman said:
I have never experienced a broken omega spring myself.
I do believe what we see here on the forum when it comes to what causes spring failure; is a combination of all the reasons stated so far, along with a small percentage of springs that have simply received improper tempering.

In addition, all springs are not created equal.
A 940 spring is = to a Adamas spring?
I dont think so.
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So different knives have different spring rates ? That's a good point. I never thought about that.
 
This info has been related before, but it may bear repeating here. I went on a two week summertime bicycle trip. Average temp 90: average humidity 90. I carried a Carbon fiber Benchmade 940 with a 943 clip point, S-30-V blade in the placket of my polo shirts (a perfect accelerated environmental corrosion test). When I got back, the action was sticky. I took the knife apart. The innards were solid red rust. The lock plates, the Omega springs, the lock bar, the stop pins, the pivot, the blade inside the handle were coated with rust. I was appalled. Why can't they use a better grade of stainless?
It took 2 hours to clean it up. The Omega springs were a particular pain in the XSS to clean because it's hard to wire brush a wire that small in diameter. I had to wire brush the rust off the inside of the C/F handles. I had to polish the blade in the pivot area. The springs never broke, but I would have preferred to replace them because cleaning them was such a PITA.
I still love the AXIS lock, but I wish they would use a 300 series stainless for the lock plates and make Omega springs available to DIYers. I have dozens of AXIS lock knives, and I have never broken an Omega spring, but I wish the package was lower maintenance.
 
Ickythump said:
"Serious experience", aye?

Forget the fact that if indeed you found yourself w/ an Axis mech, w/ both O springs failed and had access to twigs, you could make the knife function, in dire need. To explain how, I feel would be an exercise in futility.

I submit, that if a "Guy" found himself "Stuck in the woods" w/ a "Flopping knife blade", that this said guy, has made multiple poor decisions that lead him there, least of which would be the type of folding knife he was carrying. And if he was to perish because of it, then so be it,...stupid hurts. Chalk it up to natural selection and be glad he could not further contaminate any gene pools.
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I didn't mention anyone dying, only that a folding knife with a broken lock is lame. Go ahead and replace "woods" with "office" or "factory" or "garage".

BM makes a few Axis models with the "safety" that allows the blade to be locked open or close, that's enough of a backup to make me comfortable.

I still wish that they would make more liner and frame lock folders :)
 
MatthewSB said:
I didn't mention anyone dying, only that a folding knife with a broken lock is lame. Go ahead and replace "woods" with "office" or "factory" or "garage".

BM makes a few Axis models with the "safety" that allows the blade to be locked open or close, that's enough of a backup to make me comfortable.

I still wish that they would make more liner and frame lock folders :)
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I do like that safety plunger, pretty friggin awesome. Benchmade does know how to make really good liner lock and Frame lock though. No doubt about it.
 
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