Ok then. Lets assume for a second that I dont have 25years experience in the bush. Or lets also assume that all of the mesquite I processed successfully and without issue during that time with other knives, including cheap machetes, was just dumb luck. Should the metal bend? This is an honest question, not being sarcastic.
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I'm done with Bark River
- Thread starter PharaohX3
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I just wanted to add in some experiences I have personally had with Kiawe wood. I can't be sure that it is similar to your native species of mesquite.
The trees I was dealing with grew in the sand, and were the last living plants before the sand met the ocean (sometimes the ocean waters even washed up to the trunks of these trees). It is a very tough tree when it reaches a certain age/ size.
Like others have said, the specific circumstances you were dealing with are paramount. I just wanted to throw in that there is at least one species that is a bear to deal with, and especially to chop.
As to the retailer/ manufacturer / consumer warranty, that is another story.
The trees I was dealing with grew in the sand, and were the last living plants before the sand met the ocean (sometimes the ocean waters even washed up to the trunks of these trees). It is a very tough tree when it reaches a certain age/ size.
Like others have said, the specific circumstances you were dealing with are paramount. I just wanted to throw in that there is at least one species that is a bear to deal with, and especially to chop.
As to the retailer/ manufacturer / consumer warranty, that is another story.
I can understand all of your concerns with this thread guys, Lord knows, I've had the same concerns about Bark River-hate threads many times in the past. But I think, regardless of the actual warranty issue(which I WILL have pics for I promise), the real problem here is Mike Stewarts response to it. If you want to mistakenly assume I was chopping at something I shouldnt have chopped at thats fine. What are your opinions on MS's response? Keep in mind the BRKT warranty and and the fact that he never even saw the knife. Also keep in mind my long time loyalty to the brand, was being a pompus jerk the correct way for him to handle it?
I'm off for the night, I'll get pics up asap, hopefully by morning.
I'm off for the night, I'll get pics up asap, hopefully by morning.
The fact is that there are MANY cases of customers claiming to be talked down to or treated poorly by Mr. Stewart. Many of us have seen the threads on other forums of him throwing fits and then deleting comments. If you do any research at all you know what you are getting into when you bring a warranty problem to him.
On a seperate note, if someone advertises a "chopper" and they only want you chopping certain types of wood, maybe in the future they should lay out what kinds of wood should or shouldnt be chopped.
On a seperate note, if someone advertises a "chopper" and they only want you chopping certain types of wood, maybe in the future they should lay out what kinds of wood should or shouldnt be chopped.
On a side note...I deal with a ton of knife makers. They all have quirks when someone says there is a problem with one of their blades--especially heat treat.
That being said, I wish Mike would have just taken it back to check it.
These knife makers know their stuff. I suspect he is right, but I understand your frustration.
That being said, I wish Mike would have just taken it back to check it.
These knife makers know their stuff. I suspect he is right, but I understand your frustration.
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Here we go again. I have personally seen a BRKT golok get a dime size chip out of it form chopping a pine branch. That seems like a reasonable task by any woodsman's standard.
"This Type of Tool has been used for Centuries and has proven to be one of the most useful for Bushcraft. The Golok is Light and Compact and is easy fo carry for a large knife. It Excels at Trail Clearing, Chopping, Shelter Building, Notching and Spliting Firewood.
The large knife will take Batoning without a Complaint and it great for use as a Draw Knife for Stripping Bark or Creating a Flat Area of a log. We feel it is one of the Best Bushcraft Tools avalible on Today's Market.
This run of Goloks is the best one so far--it is made out of A2 tool steel. A2 will make this Golok hold an edge better than any previous without giving up any of the toughness Bark River Knives are famous for."
The description claims it's supposed to be tough, and excel at chopping and splitting. And it costs $230+. I don't see a list of woods not to use it on in the description. I do see performance claims about its toughness and how it excels at chopping and splitting firewood. Maybe Bark River should have been more specific instead of trying to market how tough it is?
Don't get me wrong, i'm not saying there is no possibility that there could be a problem with the knife. That won't be known unless it is sent in for inspection. Mr. Stewart possibly should've withheld assessment until that was done. In the end though, as I stated, the end user does bear some responsibility for knowing when and when not to use his tool and have some knowledge about what he is using his blade upon despite what any marketing copy says. Most mesquite is very tough and fiberous, often containing silicate particulates embedded in it's fibers as it's a desert plant. A user is also responsible for knowing the knifes edge geometry and sharpness for the task at hand.
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In the contest between Wood and Knife, the knife doesn't always prevail. Some folks act like it's a game of rock-paper-scissors and knife always beats wood. Hard, tough woods, and even knots in softer woods can annihilate thin cutting tools like knives or machetes, I don't care who made them or how they're heat treated. If I had a nickel for every time someone chopped / batoned a piece of hardwood with their knife/machete and wound up totally destroying their tools...
I am in agreement with you there. Don't take the above statements as bashing you or blaming you for the problems you've run into, because that's not what I'm saying - I'm just pointing out that certain woods can obliterate any knife, whether that knife is well made, poorly made, well heat treated, etc. I do think that if Bark River sold you a knife that they designed for chopping and it failed while you were chopping with it, you have every right to expect them to make it right. Furthermore, if you felt like you were mistreated by their customer service, you have every right to tell folks about it.
I am in agreement with you there. Don't take the above statements as bashing you or blaming you for the problems you've run into, because that's not what I'm saying - I'm just pointing out that certain woods can obliterate any knife, whether that knife is well made, poorly made, well heat treated, etc. I do think that if Bark River sold you a knife that they designed for chopping and it failed while you were chopping with it, you have every right to expect them to make it right. Furthermore, if you felt like you were mistreated by their customer service, you have every right to tell folks about it.
Metal Made Fox
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Glad to see I'm not the only person who thinks BRKT sucks!
Mike Stewart has always seemed like an arrogant and pompous tool who gives off that "I'm smarter and better than you" attitude. I have seen some of his posts on jerzeedevil (he is a mod there) and he always acts like a rude jerk to everyone who disagrees with him. He is one of those egotistical guys that will never accept the fact that he can be in the wrong at times and when someone tries to correct him, he snaps back at them.
I don't like him, nor do I like his knives at all either. :barf:
Mike Stewart has always seemed like an arrogant and pompous tool who gives off that "I'm smarter and better than you" attitude. I have seen some of his posts on jerzeedevil (he is a mod there) and he always acts like a rude jerk to everyone who disagrees with him. He is one of those egotistical guys that will never accept the fact that he can be in the wrong at times and when someone tries to correct him, he snaps back at them.
I don't like him, nor do I like his knives at all either. :barf:
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It's the customer's fault for a knife being damaged while using it in a manner consistent with what the company outlined as acceptable use? But it's not the company's fault for promoting fantasy claims instead of claims grounded in testing and actual performance data?
Any company should stand up to whatever description they put out for their products. They put that description on their website. It didn't just magically appear there. Why put it there if the product can't stand up to that kind of use? Is it because they are trying to sell based on fantasy rather than actual performance? Why not hold them accountable for the words they wrote in describing their product? If a product won't stand up to what they claimed then the customer has every right to a full refund and not to be berated.
Like others here, I know just how hard mesquite can be.
The BRK Golok is not the tool I would choose to chop seasoned mesquite.
That said, I bet if you let them set that edge a little thicker it would work just fine for you.
I think that if there's a common theme in the Bark River complaints, it's that Bark River sets there edges more geared toward slicing geometry then axe like chopper geometry.
I have had a few of their choppers that where set a little thin for the tasks I had in mind, and in every case a little tweak to the terminal geometry was all that was needed to take the abuse I was dishing out.
Send it in and let them tweak it, make sure you include a note about your problem and the adjustment you want made.
Flying off the handle because your positive it's a heat treatment problem does not make it a heat treatment problem.
Have it fixed and then put it to the test, and see how it holds up.
Just one knife user's opinion.
Big Mike
The BRK Golok is not the tool I would choose to chop seasoned mesquite.
That said, I bet if you let them set that edge a little thicker it would work just fine for you.
I think that if there's a common theme in the Bark River complaints, it's that Bark River sets there edges more geared toward slicing geometry then axe like chopper geometry.
I have had a few of their choppers that where set a little thin for the tasks I had in mind, and in every case a little tweak to the terminal geometry was all that was needed to take the abuse I was dishing out.
Send it in and let them tweak it, make sure you include a note about your problem and the adjustment you want made.
Flying off the handle because your positive it's a heat treatment problem does not make it a heat treatment problem.
Have it fixed and then put it to the test, and see how it holds up.
Just one knife user's opinion.
Big Mike
One can either think for themselves and be smarter than the situation, or believe everything they read or hear and go thru life miserable, complaining and blaming others..... just sayin'.
[video=youtube_share;bufTna0WArc]http://youtu.be/bufTna0WArc[/video]
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