Inflated prices

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No one is forced to buy any knife. If a seller/reseller/flipper finds someone to pay an exorbitant price for a knife, so be it. If he can't find anyone willing to pay his price, so be it. A knife is worth what someone is willing to pay to purchase it. That's the market at work.
 
jbmonkey said:
I see two basic camps of flippers. one group are fans of the products and hobbies and use flipping to support their own buying. annoying but tolerable. at least they're supporting the hobby and participating in it.

then there is the second group. they have zero interest in the hobby or products. wont use them or even enjoy them. they just see it as a way to make money. they run it like a horse trading business. proud even of ripping people off. this group I despise as they contribute nothing to the hobby, they get in the way, and usually are like used car salesmen/horse traders. bs artists of the worst kind.

all that said. is what it is........
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How is anyone being ripped off? People only pay what they are willing to pay. No one has to pay a single cent.
 
Chris*33 said:
Every community has standards of behavior, even a community that claims it doesn't. That doesn't mean that every one should behave like a robot. Different personalities exist because each has something to offer. But boundaries are as important as tolerance.
For example, a site that sets a limit on the profit you can make on selling something, make it a percentage depending on the price point or something, draws some boundaries but still allowing the practice in a controlled manner. This would drive away a number of people with the sole purpose to make money of it. I am not saying i would support it, i am not saying that is flawless, but it's there. A possible solution that simultaneously draws boundaries and, also, allows for a practice/behavior to take place. You take away/minimize the profit incentive, so this leaves room for those who are interested in the community (...not the cult) for what it is.

By 'weasel' you mean sneaky or two-faced? If that's the case, everything has two sides, the truth usually lying in between.
You're last point i didn't get, English being a second language for me. You mean that there is nothing i can do?
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You are advocating price controls. Can't agree with that.
 
So, everybody bitching about paying inflated prices.. Ya'll better stay FAR away from machine guns and classic cars.

Grandpa has a 61 Catalina SD, aluminum nose factory drag car. It cost less than 5k brand new off the lot.

Bet your ASS you won't even get a spare fender for less than that from him these days.
He has 3 m60's. 2 of them are still in factory packaging. Last person to make an offer (in early 2k) was turned down at 60k for the shooter. Grandpa paid about 8k apiece for them in the early 80's.
Why did he turn down such an offer? Market says he could get more than offered, and even then the 'profit' from the 'inflated' price he was offered was definitely substantial but not enough to spark a sale.

Is he greedy, or just an enthusiastic collector who still enjoys having his stuff around and playing with it?

Market drives prices. Get over it.
I want to buy property off all you fellas whining about "flippers" and "inflated prices" corroding your "community", because clearly, I can get that land for less than what you paid for it because reasons, right?

What about the fella I bought my best SPAS 12 from? He included it's original sales receipt with a $325 price tag still on the end of the box... Should I have irately demanded to pay less than what he obviously paid for the piece instead of what he priced it at? Would any of you?

Stop whining. Make stacks. Be aware.

Or move on.
 
leghog said:
How is anyone being ripped off? People only pay what they are willing to pay. No one has to pay a single cent.
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fair point. ripped off a bad choice of words. should be they take advantage of hobbyists desire in collecting.
 
The funny thing about this topic is that on some level, I agree with even the posters I disagree with. In our system, no one should be forced to buy, sell, or limit amounts. It’s just wishful, Utopian thinking on my part. I also like the idea of the 1st Amendment. Expressing opinions is embedded in our system, too. The GBU is an ideal place for that expression. So stop whining about us whiners, lol.
 
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I'll add this in to the discussion
Knife buying is usually a very poor way to make money. Sure these guys are making a profit off the original price, but how much time have they put in to do it-sitting there refreshing screens waiting for that moment. Even then they have to be somewhat lucky. Seems some return is reasonable over the guy that did nothing. Add in PP fees and shipping and it is likely a very poor wage, and there still is the risk it is a bad investment. OP himself related it didn't work out well for him.
I am hardly their biggest fan, but I can work with or around them.
Many seem to have the allusion if this guy didn't buy it they would get it. Demand is so high that odds are still very much against that happening.
 
dkb45 said:
The issue is I've seen quite a few 20CV PMs going for over $200, and the SNK PM3 is the worst one I've seen yet, almost all I've seen resold at a near or over $100 mark-up. That's super scummy.
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I was curious what the original retail price on the SNK PM3 was.

I think the 20CV PM2 market price right now is more like $160-180. The people selling for more than $200 are probably benchmarking off of what the market rate was for the M390 runs, but honestly I think the market may be drying up some as supply rises to meet demand. There are a lot of exclusive runs in the works. People bought the original BBS blue M390 PM2s at BBS's higher-than-MAP pricing because no one was sure whether we'd ever have a chance to get a PM2 in M390 ever again. Then DLT came out with the red M390 PM2 exclusive for only about ten dollars more than the standard PM2. People bought and sold those at the same prices, but I think we've had enough M390 PM2 runs now that people are starting to realize that there's not actually a need to pay double retail to get one if you missed it.

I don't think it's scummy at all, to be honest, but that's mostly a matter of definitions. At what dollar amount does it become scummy or not scummy? Is someone making a net profit of $20 scummy? $50? $100? If making $100 in profit is scummy, is making $99 in profit magically not scummy?
 
It is interesting that we can have such long discussion about a non criminal activity, like reselling limited edition knives for a profit. It is very educational to listen to every member's opinion, and everyone has the right to their point of view.
When I think about all of the criminal enterprises for money, that are harmful to society, this business of flipping knives is just another honest way to make a few dollars, and no more harmful to the public, than children selling lemonade in front of their house, on a hot summers day.
 
A lot of folks say that they sell knives they've bought at a loss, or at best for little profit. That seems to be acceptable behavior.

Fewer folks have admitted that they sell for a high markup, if the price is right, but further proclaim that they really do have an interest in knives. They say that their sale of the knife in question is simply dictated by a change in tastes or life's circumstances force the sale. I have the sense that also seems to be acceptable behavior to most folks here...I think (though I may be wrong).

I don't think most folks here would object to admitting to be a part of one of these two groups. But what about the few--and we all know they are here--who have no interest in knives and are here for the sole purpose of making a profit? Who here will stand up and identify themselves as a member of this group? Anyone? And if not, then why not? Some have defended the folks in this group as being not much different than those in the other two groups. And this behavior certainly does occur with other things outside of knives. So what's the problem? I'd love to see input here from someone who readily admits they are part of this group. Somehow, I doubt it will happen though.
 
AndreLinoge said:
So, everybody bitching about paying inflated prices.. Ya'll better stay FAR away from machine guns and classic cars.

Grandpa has a 61 Catalina SD, aluminum nose factory drag car. It cost less than 5k brand new off the lot.

Bet your ASS you won't even get a spare fender for less than that from him these days.
He has 3 m60's. 2 of them are still in factory packaging. Last person to make an offer (in early 2k) was turned down at 60k for the shooter. Grandpa paid about 8k apiece for them in the early 80's.
Why did he turn down such an offer? Market says he could get more than offered, and even then the 'profit' from the 'inflated' price he was offered was definitely substantial but not enough to spark a sale.

Is he greedy, or just an enthusiastic collector who still enjoys having his stuff around and playing with it?

Market drives prices. Get over it.
I want to buy property off all you fellas whining about "flippers" and "inflated prices" corroding your "community", because clearly, I can get that land for less than what you paid for it because reasons, right?

What about the fella I bought my best SPAS 12 from? He included it's original sales receipt with a $325 price tag still on the end of the box... Should I have irately demanded to pay less than what he obviously paid for the piece instead of what he priced it at? Would any of you?

Stop whining. Make stacks. Be aware.

Or move on.
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Using the thinking process this thread started with, your dad must sell me that Catalina for a little less than $5k because it’s wting to make a profit from me!!!;) Oh and while we’re at it throw in one of those machine guns for $8k because I collect t firearms to and desire one but shouldn’t have to pay more than you did!!:cool:
 
on_the_edge said:
A lot of folks say that they sell knives they've bought at a loss, or at best for little profit. That seems to be acceptable behavior.

Fewer folks have admitted that they sell for a high markup, if the price is right, but further proclaim that they really do have an interest in knives. They say that their sale of the knife in question is simply dictated by a change in tastes or life's circumstances force the sale. I have the sense that also seems to be acceptable behavior to most folks here...I think (though I may be wrong).

I don't think most folks here would object to admitting to be a part of one of these two groups. But what about the few--and we all know they are here--who have no interest in knives and are here for the sole purpose of making a profit? Who here will stand up and identify themselves as a member of this group? Anyone? And if not, then why not? Some have defended the folks in this group as being not much different than those in the other two groups. And this behavior certainly does occur with other things outside of knives. So what's the problem? I'd love to see input here from someone who readily admits they are part of this group. Somehow, I doubt it will happen though.
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Admitting such would require them to then pony up for a dealer membership. Crickets is all you'll get.
 
stonesell said:
It is interesting that we can have such long discussion about a non criminal activity, like reselling limited edition knives for a profit. It is very educational to listen to every member's opinion, and everyone has the right to their point of view.
When I think about all of the criminal enterprises for money, that are harmful to society, this business of flipping knives is just another honest way to make a few dollars, and no more harmful to the public, than children selling lemonade in front of their house, on a hot summers day.
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Ha ha . I was actually thinking about the lemonade thing myself. There nerve of those greedy little kids, selling that lemonade at inflated prices . It probably only costs them 10 cents to make with material and they are selling it for 25 cents!!!!!
Better call the HOA. :eek:
 
benchwarmer380 said:
Admitting such would require them to then pony up for a dealer membership. Crickets is all you'll get.
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I suppose that may be right. That said though, you bring up a point that I don't think anyone here considers to be ok, which is depriving Spark of the $ he chooses to charge for a given level of membership. There is nothing criminal there, but to act like you are in one membership when you know or think you really should be in a different level membership is akin to stealing.
 
If you don't like the price, don't buy it. I don't like professional flippers but they have been around since markets were created and there is no way to stop the practice.
 
I agree with the premise of what both BenchWarmer and OnTheEdge are expressing. The powers-that-be may ultimately decide to change the membership level privileges on this Site to set some reasonable limits on items being offered for sale by an individual who carries either Gold or Platinum level memberships. But whichever you think about it, stop limits will come across as nickel / diming which will not bode too well.

Another problem with a dealer level membership is that in reality, the individuals who are milking the system on here to sell an excessive number of knives, mostly for the purpose of flipping for a quick buck, are not truly authorized or factory sanctioned dealers! You can not send bad units back to them for warranty repair / exchange and these quasi "dealers" do not obtain their wares at a discounted / negotiated prices like licensed dealers do. Licensed dealers are supposed to be paying / collecting their local sales taxes and also have books / records like any legitimate business is supposed to have.

I am quite certain that the owner of this Site, being an actual brick / mortar business owner has thought about the various angles and the trepidations but ultimately perhaps decided that it wasn't worth the headache, so left it to the Community's own devices for self policing and reporting the egregious violators to the Supers or the HPIC.
 
Chris*33 said:
Don't ask me, but ask yourself...what do you think would work?
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I think that everything is working just fine now. I always default to more freedom not less... and I guess I had better step out of this thread now since I'm liable to get all political and there is a forum for that... :)
 
jbmonkey said:
fair point. ripped off a bad choice of words. should be they take advantage of hobbyists desire in collecting.
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Again, no one is required to pay more than they are willing for any pocket knife. Potential purchasers can simply walk away. I've done so often and remain no worse off for doing so.
 
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