Is a Busse Worth it?

[ishiyumisan]

Many excellent points here on both sides---also a lot of crap.

Unfortunately, all of it taken together adds up to absolutely nothing. What you want or don't want will be the deciding factor at the end of the day.

Could you depend on a Busse in a survival situation? Well, if your survival depends on a knife and that's what you have...you'd better depend on it. Same goes for a SAK, or a steak knife, or the sharp piece you're able to pull off the crashed helicopter. Whatever you have, as others have said, it'll be worth little if you can't find water, build a fire, or are bleeding and don't know how to stop it. The skills count for far more than the tools. Oh and by the way...please check to see if the radio on the helicopter still works before you head off into the wild.

Now, to some of the other directions this thread has taken:

Yes, it's true that man got along for thousands of years, surviving in harsh climates against great odds, before Busse came into the picture. Hell, before iron or even bronze came into the picture. Unfortunately, sticking too strongly to this mentality makes you a jackass for spending $60 for your Becker or $40 for your Kabar right along those spending $400 for their Busse. I mean, for God's sake, club a shark to death and pull his tooth out if you need a knife you pussies!

The average annual income in Nepal this last year was, I believe, $210. I'm sure many if not most of the workers over there would look at my $30 Buck 110 and say, "Rich man's toy."

Yes, soldiers get by with cheap knives and manage to survive. You can use this for a model if you want. Soldiers also, for years and years, made do with boots that didn't really fit or support their feet. I was military, and I can tell you for absolute fact that you can get by with less than optimum gear. But I never got the impression that anybody was looking at the Danners I very rapidly shelled out the cash for was thinking, "wuss." Or, maybe they were---remarkable how it never mattered. The opinion of my feet was a whole lot more interesting to me.

All the whining about edge grinds----what kind of self respecting knife knut can't regrind an edge?! I can make a Battle Mistress whittle hair and turn a Dozer skinner into a cold chisel. Busse knives do come with edges thicker than my preference; but then, so do almost all knives regardless of maker, production or custom. Want the grind angle to be thinner? Thin it. Or, ask them to make it thinner at the factory when you order it, or send your secondary-market Busse in and they'll thin that down too. Want to have even more control? Spend $100 on a 1X42" belt sander and a bucket full of water to dunk your blade into every few passes.

As far as what experts say (survival or other) let me offer perspective... Ed Fowler is an ABS Master Smith and absolute expert on knife making. Other professional knife makers listen when he talks. He knows more about working and manipulating steel than probably everybody who has participated on this thread will ever understand, and he thinks 52100 is just about the ultimate blade steel. Kevin Cashen is an ABS Master Smith and absolute expert on knife making. Other professional knife makers listen when he talks. He knows more about working and manipulating steel than probably everybody who has participated on this thread will ever understand, and he thinks 52100's performance doesn't pay for the trouble of working with it, and that it's (to use his phrase) "a square peg in a round hole" alloy for making knives. Both of them have mountains of experience to support their opinions. Now, I'd never say to completely discount the opinions of experts in a given field, but don't latch onto what one says here or there and try to elevate that to being gospel.

Last but not least....yes, it's a pet peeve I return to again and again. The 'simple man hero' image some people like to project when they think a particular knife costs too much. Usually something along the lines of, "Well, if you've got the money and want a toy, I guess I can't stop you from buying it. I think it's silly as hell and makes you a fan boy, but go ahead. For me, a knife has always just been a tool--nothing to get all worked up about." Give me a break, you nitwits---you're on an internet forum, dedicated to knives, talking about knives. If you're here, posting and reading and arguing, then knives occupy a space in your mind that goes far beyond simple tools. When's the last time you jumped on a forum to opine about your favorite flat blade screwdriver or tape measure? If you've spent more than ten minutes here (let alone the hours/days/months/years that apply to many of us) you ARE a fan boy.

OP, try out different things and see what works for you, and accept that what works for you may not be what works for somebody else. I'll offer this, even though it's not exactly what you asked. Is a Busse knife a very high quality product from a reputable maker? Yes. Does it reach rarified heights that make all other knives obsolete? No. Am I happy with my Busses? Very. Did I do most of my hardcore bad-ass stuff at a younger age with a less expensive knife? Yep.

Best of luck and tell us what you decide.

Rock and Roll

 

[silenthunterstudios]

I've had a Leaner Meaner Street, and a fat Game Warden. I'd like to trade for a Game Warden, but a thinner version. The Leaner Meaner was not me. I've had numerous Swamp Rats, including the small neck knife whose name escapes me now; the Camp Tramp, several Howling Rats and a Battle Rat, and my favorite the Bog Dog with textured handles, all SR101. I'd like to have all of them back, but I would just trade them for something else after a while. I really don't like the coatings used on SRKW or Busses, and have had them removed on my SRKW's.

Busses are like Chris Reeves. They are great knives, and you won't have any trouble reselling or trading them. They are a lot like potato chips, you can't have just one. I've seen some of those big choppers, and while my fixed blade tastes have gotten a lot more traditional, I still like those big choppers.

SR101 was supposedly D2, and INFI is similar to 5160, or so I have heard. I know the difference between stainless and tool/carbon steels, and that is pushing it for me.

Yeah, they're a little thick . Ain't nothin' wrong with big girls .

 

[555]

IMHO The best piece of gear that you will ever carry is your mind. What you put in it and how you use it will save your life whether you are carrying a Buck 119 or Busse.

I think Busse makes some of the coolest knives around.
The way I look at it, Many people survived without a Busse before they were even made and Many will survive in the wilderness long after the company is gone.
The bottom line, Buy what you like and learn how to use it. IMHO
Live and be happy.

Busse Knife Co Business Information
Busse Knife Co is a private company categorized under Cutlery and located in Wauseon, OH. Our records show it was established in 1984 and incorporated in Ohio. Current estimates show this company has an annual revenue of $3,200,000 and employs a staff of approximately 30.

http://www.manta.com/coms2/dnbcompany_8xysvk

 

[philwar]

I dont know Jim, seems to me there are a lot of people who got to work or otherwise every day in survival situations that trust high quality gear to get them home. Military, police, firefighters, hospital patients etc etc etc etc. I dont want any of those situations to use what they have "in the moment"

By the best you can afford, and while you are at it try and figure out what your life is worth in dollars as it could and does come to that.


Skam

I think you are both correct. It would be silly to rely on gear only for survival. It would be equally silly not to prepare as best you can beforehand.

I served in two different countries, one was SF in a country that never saw action while I served, the other was a combat unit in a country that has been at war since forever. I found that all well-trained experienced soldiers know how to survive, naked if necessary. And a topgrade knife will not be #1 priority.
I also found that given a choice, all of them will get the best gear they know and can afford. So the two PoV's actually complement one another.

 

[baldtaco-II]

SR101 was supposedly D2, and INFI is similar to 5160, or so I have heard.

I think you'll find that SR101 is a marketing name for something like the regular 52100 bearing steel. That stable has used D2, and from the bits I've seem did a great job at bringing out the toughness as that is not a property D2 is especially well known for. Applause for that. 52100 is a very different can of worms from D2 though. Approximately speaking I think the stuff marketed as INFI is a nitrogen steel with characteristics not a millions miles away from A8.

...

Few of them are worth the money to me. I'm only interested in design materials and construction. I'm not convinced there is anything at all special about the construction. That said, I think the Camp Tramp and the Bog Dog and a few others have great designs and materials. Personally, a good scrutiny of the marketing has turned me cold to them. But that's another story.

 

[t1mpani]

SR-101 is indeed 52100.

 

[Thalestin]

I have 1 busse that my brother helped my buy. The BATAC. Its a cool knife but way too heavy for me to ever use in th field. I love it though and is special to me. For users I much prefer my Rat cutlery knives.

 

[KEmSAT-Survival]

Apparently so, they get what they ask and have a cult following.

I don't own one, because I'm a cheap bastard...

But they're worth it.

 

[orrey45]

Your question is what is the best survival knife. I won't answer that because you need to decide what you want the knife to do in order to decide what is best for you. Factors would include: blade length, blade thickness, blade profile, edge profile, handle ergos, steel type, etc.

What I will tell you is that between RAT Cutlery and Busse family knife you will not find a better guarantee anywhere for a commercially produced knife. I own a few of each and they are dead solid knives. To be honest the cost between the two brands can be large but they both are great knives. I think which you go with is personal preference. FOr differences, the Busse handles are typically larger then RAT's and the steel reacts differently. If you would like to talk about sharpness, I have received blades from many makers that were razor sharp and others that were quite dull with no more from one then the other. The sharpest knives I have ever received are from custom makers.

The custom makers are defiantly something to look at as well. I have knives from many of the makers on the forum and I wholeheartedly wish to continue to support them. They make absolutely beautiful knives with razor sharp blades to your specifications and at a good price point to boot. In the end if you are a true knife nut you shouldn't be asking which knife to get but rather which knife to get first.

 

[Shotgun]

I've come full circle in my thinking of knives and sharp things. At first I just thought a knife was a knife until I did research on a good survival knife. Then I became kind of a knife snob and only the high end super steel knives were the way to go. I've since come back to a knife is a knife, within reason. Survival knowledge is indeed the most important thing but knowledge of the type of knife you have is also important. I go into the woods with different knives and it's not a matter of "can I survive with this knife" it's a matter of using each knife the way it should be used. I'm not going to baton with my SAK but my SRKW Howling Rat I'd baton through anything without worrying about edge problems or breakage. I think it was Oldjimbo that said it isn't the tool that's important, it's the tool and user dynamic that's important.

Now although I wouldn't classify myself as a knife snob I do own/carry expensive knives but it's because I like them. If I pass a guy on the trail and all he has is a Mora, I'm cool with that. You can do a lot with a Mora. So in the end, buy what you like and learn how to use it. The SAR4 is a good looking knife, if you can afford it go for it.

 

[1kimo4u]

to the op- if you want a specific busse, i'll let you have it for retail plus shipping to you. (if i got one) i'll eat the original shipping to me. not all busse owners are out to make a profit. feel free to pm or email me.

the secondary market is a big turn off even for some of us little piggies!

 

[silenthunterstudios]

I think you'll find that SR101 is a marketing name for something like the regular 52100 bearing steel. That stable has used D2, and from the bits I've seem did a great job at bringing out the toughness as that is not a property D2 is especially well known for. Applause for that. 52100 is a very different can of worms from D2 though. Approximately speaking I think the stuff marketed as INFI is a nitrogen steel with characteristics not a millions miles away from A8.

...

Few of them are worth the money to me. I'm only interested in design materials and construction. I'm not convinced there is anything at all special about the construction. That said, I think the Camp Tramp and the Bog Dog and a few others have great designs and materials. Personally, a good scrutiny of the marketing has turned me cold to them. But that's another story.

SR-101 is indeed 52100.

Thank you for the clarification. :thumbup:

 

[Rat Finkenstein]

They are worth it. It is like buying a nice gun instead of a Hi-point. It all depends on what you want. All the people poo-pooing the idea just choose to spend their money on something else. Many people spend way more money accumulating hundreds of cheaper knives, it is all up to the individual to decide what he wants. Look how many people spend $30,000+ on a car that will be worth next to nothing in a few years. Buy what you want, they are great knives and have the best warranty going. Then there are Swamp Rat and Scrap Yard also in the Busse family with lower price points. I have some of all 3 and they are great knives.

 

[Dantor]

to the op- if you want a specific busse, i'll let you have it for retail plus shipping to you. (if i got one) i'll eat the original shipping to me. not all busse owners are out to make a profit. feel free to pm or email me.

the secondary market is a big turn off even for some of us little piggies!

one generous offer brother :thumbup:

(in a year Merost will be a Hog, pictures with him and Jerry laughing...)

 

[RoyalM]

If I was you I'd probably go for a Scrapper 5 LE. I think when you take handle length into account it'll be about the same size as the SAR4.

As regards Busse being worth it. I think they are but then that's just my opinion. I'm basing this on my use of knives and where I place value on objects in my life. I for one don't have expensive taste in audio equipment, clothing, restaurants, cars etc. So knives i'm prepared to spend a little money on. Then it comes to my knife use. To say i'm heavy handed and negligent in my use of knives is to put it politely. I beat the hell out of my knives. I don't even think about it. When I was younger I had a few break on me or lose their edges quickly through my 'style' of use. I don't get this problem with Busse family knives.

Are there other knives out there that could take my style of use and cost less than a Busse? Yes but i'm not in the mood to begin searching. I do take part in passarounds and if I come across a better knife for me then sure i'll get one. Until then Busse reigns supreme for my knife needs.

I feel I need to add that the Bark River Bravo 1 is a hell of a knife and I enjoyed testing it. Just didn't quite edge out my Busse's. Damn close though.

 

[GrinderMcgee]

The knives are amazing, the warranty is the best, and the community is very hospitable. A knife user will have a fine knife in a RAT. A knife enthusiast and true nut job can enjoy a Busse to full potential. I do not regret investing the money on my CGFBM and I am not a rich man.

In the end it is everyone's own choice to make.

 

[skammer]

Seems quite foolish to trust gear to get you home, even "high-quality" gear.

The next time a firefighter goes into a burning building lets hope they dont have bargain basement SCBA's, flashlight, rescue ropes or bunker gear. Fact is people rely on quality gear every day including top notch medical gear to save your life if need be. To think your brain is the only factor is foolish and not thinking this through.

Personally its why I do not carry the cheapest GPS or compass or wear the cheap boots and is why my SAR gear is worth $1000's and not $100's because I do rely on it. Of course its not the ONLY thing I rely on but by having gear you are 100% confident about, that allows me to concentrate at the task at hand without worry.

No Jim I am not saying Busse is the only maker that will do the job but if you have $ why not buy that kind of quality or similar.

Skam

 

[Mentor]

It seems as though this is going in circles. Most people seem to be an agreement on a few general points: Busses are great knives, known for their toughness, durability, and excellent warranty. They are high-end knives geared towards a hard-use market. And they are expensive. I think there is a general consensus that if you invest in a Busse, you will be getting a high quality product.

There seems to be disagreement as to whether these knives are worth their price tags. That's a personal and subjective question, and everyone has the right to make his or her own decision. The OP asked for opinions on this, and people have weighed in. There you have it.

All the best,

- Mike

 

[Kaizen1]

I don't understand the thinking of many of those that talk down on "spending so much" on a blade. Rat Finkenstein brings up a great point. This is not about a "want" versus a "need". These are all wants once you get past about $20. And what you don't spend on the extra dough on a Busse, I would bet money you're spending it on some other non-essential elsewhere. A guy talks bad about someone spending $200 more than what he would spend on a knife and doesn't think twice about the fact that he spends $1,000/yr more on designer jeans or his beenie baby collection or some other random item that has nothing to do with what's necessary for survival.

Most of us live in countries where we're spoiled enough to buy a bunch of crap that's not necessary. This is evidenced by the fact that we can spend any time whatsoever on a knife forum and have access to the internet. To judge others by what they spend they're earned money on for non-essentials while you go out and buy your own crap without blinking is hypocritical at least.

I think the Busse thing has been shown over the years:
-The blades can do things that other blades cannot do
-It's arguable whether that matters
-It's perfectly fine if you do like them and have the extra dough

If you ONLY need absolute essentials, then get yourself a $20 truck spring blade and learn some survival techniques. Above that it's a matter of personal preference and resources.

 

[udtjim]

Skammer. It sounds like there is nothing else of high enough quality to qualify. Personally, I don't carry anything that has not proven to be up to whatever task that I expect it to perform.

In the gun Comparison, there are a lot of quality guns between the Hi-Point and a custom Kimber or Brown. Many of them will serve one well. In my first response I added that if a Busse is a priority to you then by all means, it's your money.