Is One Blade Enough?

[cramsey3006]

Alright man you enjoy your heavy shit, next summer at this time ill be in northern Oregon banging out the whole PCT, 2600 miles of goodness. Enjoy your heavy stuff. I would like to see you do high mileage days for 90-120 days in a row... Oh wait i would only see you for about 4 minutes as i pass you on the trail and finished before the rains hit Washington.

See I think you are hung up on things. Try to break away from what you are use to thinking.



Spoken like someone that is truly clueless... My shelter is 12ounces, compared to your knife and the amount effort and calories you are going to spend and the food you will be carrying to repletion them...

I get the feeling from how you are talking like you have never hiked 20+ miles a day for 14+ days in a row.

I'm really not trying to be a dick but come on you started it with the whole needing to loss weight thing.

I'm in the middle of the road, I'd guess. My gear, with a Gerber Multi-tool, Kabar Potbelly, and a Kershaw folder, weighs in at 15lbs. It includes 4 water bottles, an anodized aluminum cook set (4 pots) and most of the stuff that the "bushcraft" set carries. It doesn't include water, food, shelter. Most times, I'm going to use a small tarp (or similar) and a blanket, or I'm going to make something. Is it overkill for what I REALLY need or use? Yeah, probably, but if the shit hits the fan while I'm on the trail, I'm prepared for it.

I've only hiked in the east, but I've banged out 15-20 miles a day several times in the Smokies. Of course, I usually walk around 10 miles a day for work (delivery service) and I do strength training every day for 30 minutes when I get home. No, I have never done more than 5 days straight, and that's solely due to the fact that I have more to life than hiking... wife, kids, work, and all the other stuff that takes up my time.

Your argument about burning calories building structure is silly when you're talking about doing 20-30 miles a day or more. You burn (and have to replenish) many more calories pounding the trail like that as compared to what it takes to build a shelter.

I'm not trying to convince anyone that ultralight isn't the way to go, if they choose too. Doesn't matter to me, but I think that people whining about the difference between a 7" bladed knife (Kabar Potbelly) at 17.6 ounces for the package, compared to a SAK that is what, 4 ounces?, is just goofy. If the extra weight is that much of a problem , then how do you do have the fortitude to do 20 miles a day, if you can't stand to hoof an extra 11 ounces?

If you really want to ultralight, leave all the fancy gear at home and just do it all with a knife.

I'll carry a few more pounds of gear so be that much safer and secure when I'm out of touch and there's no one but myself to depend on.

And don't worry about me thinking you're being a dick, I don't at all. I admire your passion for ultralight. I'd love to get on the trails you have access to. :thumbup:

 

[cramsey3006]

I think this is awfully simplistic, and terrain dependant
sure the folks in the northern forests carried axes, and the folks in jungle areas carried machetes

what sort of cutting tool did the aborigines in australia carry?
how about the plains indians in the american west?
how about the bedouin peoples of the middle east?

Not to say in the areas that required them larger blades were not used, but to make a broad statement like that is misleading

I'm by NO means a historical knife expert, but most of the blades I'm familiar with from the plains era were Green River butcher knives or skinners, or the European trade knives. Most of the ones I've seen were 6" blades or longer. If they had stone knives, I'm sure they were smaller, but then they also carried axes or tomahawks to handle any chopping duty, so they didn't need a big knife.

If you've seen any Arab or Bedouin blades, they also are all larger blades. No 3" fixed blades that I've seen. Hey Jarod! What size of native blades are you seeing over there?

One of the few Aborigine blades I've found on online listed the length at 25.5cm overall, which is just under 12". Most of them are stone blades.

 

[cramsey3006]

Things got...side tracked. Atleast the tension is gone. lol

Yeah, penile talk tends to have that effect......

 

[Flexxx]

Is the 7 the best one knife Becker considering size\weight etc. ?

IMO yes it is....

Its the most versatile Becker blade me thinks......

 

[Haze240]

.......Something that I picked up in this thread was Becker choice for your style\type of outdoor activity. No one Becker can do it all for some, but Flexx made a good case for the 7. Lighter than some but still big\strong enough for general use.....Interesting. The 7 seems to get bypassed because of the 9. Is the 7 the best one knife Becker considering size\weight etc. ?

Thats why I picked up a 7. Had to wait a couple months for Knifecenter to get it in stock, but I see the 7 as the wild-west bowie. A do anything knife, you can use it to hack down branches for your shelter, whittle and carve traps, and still skin a grizz, without carrying a ton of weight on your hip. I know the 7 gets alot of love for the variety of tasks it can accomplish, but I think it gets forgotten a bit, because it doesnt chop as well at the 9 does, and it doesnt bushcraft as well as the 2, but it's sure alot lighter than carrying both of those knives together.

On another note, I think alot of people scoff at the idea of saving 2-3 ounces here and there. I thought so too, but then looked back to my time as a grease monkey working on 240SX's. While not high-horsepower cars, saving a bit of weight by using carbon fiber parts, coupled with adding a few extra ponies with, say, an intake/exhaust combo adds up. Before you know it, you've got a 250hp car that weighs 1800lbs, all by adding up all the little tweaks and mods. By the same token, saving 2-3 ounces here and there really adds up. Before you know it, you've made room and cleared weight to carry more water, better shelter, or... a bigger knife.

Ounces turn into pounds, pounds turn into fatigue, fatigue turns into shorter trips, more stops, , and less distance traveled in the same amount of time. If you're going camping, thats fine, but comparing an ultralighter, to a knife nut with a rucksack is like comparing a Ducatti motorcycle with a Ram pickup truck. Two different purposes to being in the bush, one is all about travelling far and fast, the other is about getting work done and hauling heavy loads.

 

[jarodmichael]

Hey Jarod! What size of native blades are you seeing over there?

The "antique" knives that I have seen in the shops over here are a weird sort of metal, not sure if its steel, but they set it into a hollowed out wooden tube-like handle. Then they fill the hollow area with cement or some sort of adhesive type stuff... its weird and not very sturdy, but the sole purpose of their knives are for protection and minor cutting. They dont chop wood, the dont baton, that ones I've seen would take about a full minute to cut through 550 cord. the are for poking mostly. Oh, size, size has been mostly 4-5inches. I saw one that was 6-7.

 

[BushOgre]

I'm an ultra light hiker for sure. My baseweight is 11lbs and I can do 25 miles days without thinking about because of it. As for a knife when hiking I use a Victorinox Swiss Army Classic Edelweiss Pocket Knife.

Ive done hundred's of miles with that as my only knife.

Whats more impressive is my buddy Lint has done 14,000 hiking miles on long distance trails and with a 7lb pack!

Any man than can use just a pocket knife with flowers is a man. Tip...don't screw.with a man with a flower knife, this means he doesn't care about anything but performance and will skin you for a blankie to stay warm.

 

[Magnaminous_G]

I think when it comes down to it, packing "ultra light" is great as long as you have everything you need. My question for people who pack ultra light is.... do you REALLY have everything you need?

That's a fair question. I can only speak for myself, but I find that I am actually more likely to carry the things I really need as an ultralight backpacker because I scrutinize everything that goes in my bag, whether it's doing a mountain trail or an overseas backpacking trip. I spend a lot of time thinking about what goes in my bag. Nothing is compromised; I always have the gear I need. Ultralight backpacking does not mean leaving important stuff behind and hoping for the best… that is a misperception. Ultralighters are the pinnacle of travel. They just try to make sure it's as light as possible. Quality is of the essence. Ultralight gear is usually more expensive, but worth it… and often stronger than other gear by design, as well as being lighter. My tourism pack, for example, weighs 2 lbs. It is stronger than packs that weigh 6 times more because it is made of superior components.

On the flip side, I sometimes find myself traveling with novice companions whose packs weigh triple what my pack weighs (my pack never weighs more than 25 lbs—and is usually in the 15-20 lbs range—whether hiking or backpacking)... but strangely enough, they often don't have really important stuff. The reason why is because they don't scrutinize what goes in their bags, don’t buy top-grade stuff, and they often don't have a plan. I have been on three-week treks across Europe with people who brought items like tabletop dictionaries (not kidding), framed pictures (not kidding), plug-in alarm clocks, winter coats (in the middle of Spring), salon-type hair dryers... but didn't have simple necessities like a compass, rain gear… or an adapter to use that hair dryer in Europe, etc.

The poster above (not you, the other guy) mystifies me… he keeps saying that he feels manly and feels like he has a big penis because he doesn't weigh his bag before going on a trip. I just shake my head. Well, I know the type. I've travelled with them. And to be honest… they don't look very manly when they can't even enjoy the scenery because they’re uncomfortable.
Read my lips: experienced backpackers and hikers ALWAYS go as light as possible. Someone who doesn’t care about his pack weight is a novice. always. Example: if I have to pick companions to go on a trail where we have designated rest points and will be roughing it over multiple days, I ask everyone a question: “how much does your pack weigh?”
Candidate 1 says, “25 lbs.”
Candidate 2 says, “I don’t know or care. I have a big penis.”
… guess who’s not coming with me?

The way I see it is, you can't pack light without compromising something. Also depending on a person's age and level of fitness. If you're 50+ and not exactly in the best shape, you SHOULD pack light, but if you're not senior citizen status, you just need to suck it up and just see it as strength training and a challenge.

You're right and wrong there, I feel. Yes, I agree with you that the more stuff you bring, the better prepared you will be. But there's a balance to be struck between having the gear you need and having a light, comfortable pack. That's the art of ultralight travel. What’s the tipping point? That’s the art of it!

There are extremists, though. I admit that. I admire them, but they’re insane. I know insane ultralighters who use a coke-can stove to cook and use a tarp lean to as shelter. They cut the handles off of their toothbrushes and cut the edges off of their maps to shave grams. Their packs are sub 10 lbs. That’s just crazy. I won’t sacrifice comfort to that degree. 20 – 25 lbs is more my style.

And with 25 lbs, I’m prepared for any situation, just about.

 

[BRL]

Pfft, the idea that you get to choose which and how many Beckers to bring makes me laugh.

The Beckers choose you.

 

[Magnaminous_G]

I'm by NO means a historical knife expert, but most of the blades I'm familiar with from the plains era were Green River butcher knives or skinners, or the European trade knives. Most of the ones I've seen were 6" blades or longer. If they had stone knives, I'm sure they were smaller, but then they also carried axes or tomahawks to handle any chopping duty, so they didn't need a big knife.

If you've seen any Arab or Bedouin blades, they also are all larger blades. No 3" fixed blades that I've seen. Hey Jarod! What size of native blades are you seeing over there?

One of the few Aborigine blades I've found on online listed the length at 25.5cm overall, which is just under 12". Most of them are stone blades.

One thing to keep in mind about the traditional knives you've mentioned is that these knives were made with a heavy emphasis on fighting. The Bowie knife, the Arkansas Toothpick, the Bedouin blades, the tomahawk, etc. These are primarily weapons used to kill enemies. In a pinch, they can be used to skin animals, whittle wood, etc.

These days, here in America at least, you probably aren't going to be challenged to a duel by a hillbilly wielding a 12" arkansas toothpick when you're out on the trail. I hope not, anyway... ==cue "dueling banjos"==

 

[timbit]

Without entering in to the proverbial pissing match...

A folder and a medium sized good quality FB should be able to process just about anything you want, with a bit of creativity. If you are in the PacNW like I am, and hiking in a boreal forest there should be plenty of good fire sized dead fall all over the place. You shouldn't have to chop up tree's for firewood. I've gone on 5 day hikes with just a tenacious, and that worked for me. I didn't do fires though, as at the end of the day I ate high calorie cold meals and went right to bed to start early again. I now carry about 20 lbs, a tenacious (and my new mora) as well as a folding saw. Most of the rest of my weight comes from shelter and clothes. Works for me, I bring what I need.

Calling ultralighters pansies is like calling bushcrafters pansies. They are different skill sets, require different training, and generally consist of different schools of thoughts. Apples and Oranges my friends.

Why can't we all get along?

 

[TwinStick]

Answer to the OP question. NO, not in my opinion. But if i was forced to only carry one, it would be the 7 or 9.

 

[UCPOPO]

One blade is NEVER enough....then again, neither is one...two....three....or four

 

[Flexxx]

5 is 2, 2 is 1 and 1 is none......right

 

[Quarter Tank]

is One knife enough, never

is One gun enough, never

 

[tradewater]

If we want to do miles on trails, I carry a mora and/or a SAK farmer. Never got into extreme ultralight, but it's all good. This right here is about as light as I ever go. This was 22 pounds.

I always enjoy the camping as much as the hiking. My all time favorite is to hike in, set up a base camp and go exploring from there. That's multiple blade fun right there. Part of the reason to go is the enjoyment of using the different blades.

But when it's jeepin' in and setting up for a week in BFE with some buddies, I'm bringing a duffel bag full of steel. You have to admit, there isn't much better than camp cooking, sipping a few and trying out some new knives.

 

[Murphnuge]

For me, Trade hit it right on the mark!

 

[TwinStick]

[QUOTEI always enjoy the camping as much as the hiking. Part of the reason to go is the enjoyment of using the different blades.

But when it's jeepin' in and setting up for a week in BFE with some buddies, I'm bringing a duffel bag full of steel. You have to admit, there isn't much better than camp cooking, sipping a few and trying out some new knives.[/QUOTE]


He sure did, hit the nail on the head.

 

[cramsey3006]

I have to agree with the guys above...

 

[Flexxx]

Here is the truth.....accept it

I could survive without a knife but it would suck, sure having a few takes up alot of weight and thats why I like to carry one small blade and one bigger blade, but both are light weight blades.
Shit somtimes when I know I'm going 12-15 miles I will only pack a Izula II.
Just chilling in the moutains doing some camping, why not bring a butt load of knives, hiking up mountains and tuff terrain is a totally different story.

To much weight and packing to many knives will become pointless, it will slow you down and there are more things you need in a survival situation then a extra knife, trade in one or two of those knives for some extra water or food, more first aid gear.

I see guys packing these giant 5-6000 CU IN packs up these mountains to stay one night, I really don't understand it, I buzz right past these guys and could have my gear set-up, fire going and relaxing while there still crawling up the mountain.

The more weight of your pack means it will take that much more energy to carry, it will burn more calories and be less efficient, it requires more food more water and less land coverage.

There is a leaning curve to hiking and trekking. Once you start going almost daily you figure out a few things.

Here is the question I want everyone to answer.
What is your knife going to do for you when your a lost hiker?