just received poor example of custom 110

I cannot believe some of the things you have said. Do you read what you write before you post it. This part," The fact is in every instance someone at Buck didn't do their job AND they knew it when they didn't do it" is to say to that is impossible to read and comprehend that someone can make that statement. putting socialism in any form and using it in a knife forum is being totally ignorant of it's meaning. Picking this apart the next thing I cannot believe you said " If you try and inspect quality into a product " which is what quality control inspectors jobs are, " then you will get people to an inspection standard" yes that is correct and what a company pays inspectors to do is find parts that are out of spec. and the cause of out of tolerance parts. The product standard is to conform to a drawing or blueprint dimensionally. I think you just have not worked in an assembly or manufacturing capacity.

And you would be wrong. The fact you don't understand what I wrote is obvious. The person who made the knife that was shipped with issues knew it wasn't up to spec when they "finished" it but passed it on any way. I'm not the one who suggested Buck and others have a tough time because they lack universal healthcare or family leave, (socialist ideals), go read the posts again and then come back once you have the facts correct.
 
I wish thread would close. Move on to better things.
 
Well, This is a interesting thread. As stated It may in fact have taken a life of its own away from a OP who hasn't commented in on it in a spell. But, part of the purpose of Blade Forums and consequently the Buck Factory Supported - "Buck Forum" is to discuss Buck knives. That has been occurring with only a small amount of "personal conflict' posting. But, I must state in almost all posts it has been handled decently. Lets continue to be decent in the future also. Some social discussion and human behavior talk is fine as long as we are talking about how it applies to knives and their construction. By factory or individual customizers.

Both positive discussion and stating negative opinions is allowed but you should not attack the poster other than pointing out your disagreement and giving reasons and hopefully facts for your beliefs. Always remember that every post, even here in the Buck forum, is shown in the new post forum and sometimes our home grown
heated discussions will attract folks looking to argue for recreation. They especially like to attack moderators, go figure.....

It was suggested we (I) close down this thread as having run the course, but in the Blade Forum purpose statement I would be heavy handed to do so at this time.
I would suggest instead that commenters decide they have said there piece and the Buck Forum world move on of it's own accord.

I just ordered a Custom 112, nickel bolsters, mirror polished blade, buffalo horn scales at my wife's request to give as a gift to her brother who accompanied her to a family funeral several states away. He is a cowman who is horrible to his knives. My hope is the Custom shop makes a nice knife, his ranch name is nicely engraved on the blade and he will wear it on special occasions. But, as a purchase I can be critical and seek relief from the factory, as a gift it will be given even if it ends up broken and bent from improper use. I quit getting him knives long ago because they were just tools to him. the $2.00 feed store big box of knives on the counter were better suited to his uses.

300Bucks
 
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Badhammer I am not going to argue with you and your statement but the way you put things are very obtuse.


300 Bucks maybe think about him being a cowman he may like a pitchfork instead of a custom 112. Cowmen are always up to their knees in hay.
 
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That is a little saddening to hear about the quality of a custom shop knife being sent out like that. I am in the same boat except I can't justify sending mine back with the misc costs I had to pay on top of the initial cost from Buck. I could have done a charge back because of the quality craftsmanship what I received. I would of felt bad getting a free sub-par knife.

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Wallace Mutt--I notice you are from Canada. I went to look up what the tariff is and found there are other taxes you are required to pay. That is laying it on thick when you receive a Buck that requires a send back. I don't know if I would feel so bad. Maybe Jeff Hubbard can help you call him at 208-262-0500 ex.137. He is Buck's Quality Manager. It won't hurt. He is a very nice person, I message him often.
 
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Wallace Mutt--I notice you are from Canada. I went to look up what the tariff is and found there are other taxes you are required to pay. That is laying it on thick when you receive a Buck that requires a send back. I don't know if I would feel so bad. Maybe Jeff Hubbard can help you call him at 208-262-0500 ex.137. He is Buck's Quality Manager. It won't hurt. He is a very nice person, I message him often.

I'm sure he looks forward to everyone of those messages:D:D:D Have you asked him to send you a copy of their most up to date ISO certification???
 
Yes I Did and he said he knows about ISO 9001:2008 ( the most up to date one there is) they do not participate. They do use Just In Time. He says they align themselves with Warranty and QA. :thumbup: Is that what you needed to find out.
 
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I have never heard of Just In Time before so I Looked it up on Wiki. From what I read Just in Time is a Lean Manufacturing program aimed at holding less building material onsite with faster turn around on orders ( Less lead time). I saw nothing that addresses quality control, only Manufacturing processes. I am sure Buck uses a program but I don't see how JIT would help quality. They possibly follow Six Sigma or some other Root cause program. I have worked with an OE Quality team for the last 6 years and would be interested in Bucks processes.
 
I have been in contact with Jeff Hubbard Buck's quality manager. I personally have been out of the work force for a time and ISO was in it's infancy along with Just In Time. JIT is a way to keep material a customer reorders continuously in the suppliers storage and frees up space in the producers space that is all that is. ISO 9001:2000 was the first Quality Control and Conform. I don't know about Six Sigma or Root cause programs Buck has taken pieces of ISO 9001 :2008 and implemented that into their QC. without being certified. They have confidence in their employees and using QA to keep there knives to the best quality possible. Which Jeff admits has been a couple of rough months to getting things straightened out starting this year. This is the best of my knowledge of Bucks process that was relayed to me.
 
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Look at JIT manufacturing this way. Storing inventory whether material or finished product costs money. A company buys the material, pays the manufacturing and lob or costs to produce the product them pays to store the inventory. The cost to store is provides no return on investment. With JIT you bring in the material when you need it based on your orders and production time, build the product and ship the order.

You have to know your lead times and suppliers as well as your process to make it work. If there is no return on your investment you want to eliminate that aspect of your process.
http://it4b.icsti.su/1000ventures_e/business_guide/im_jit_main.html



Total Quality Control

http://it4b.icsti.su/1000ventures_e/business_guide/mgmt_kaizen_tqc_main.html


TQC as applied by the Japanese focuses on the people for quality and not in the inspection process like in many western manufacturing companies.
 
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I would imagine there are more defects when Just In Time is not on time and they become rushed to get an order out.
 
I would imagine there are more defects when Just In Time is not on time and they become rushed to get an order out.

That could be said about any system. Store enough product for every possible rush order and you become a warehousing company and cease to be a manufacturer.

You have to follow your process. If you can't build the product properly in the time requested then turn down the order. You may loose the order but shipping substandard product isn't going to win you a customer either.
 
Another thing about JIT the manufacturer has to produce faster than the customer consumes. I personally had to make a second set of tools because the customer wanted more than we were able to produce on one machine per week. Another customer wanted so much per week that it had to be tooled for three machines and a 2nd shift had to be put on just to keep that vendor happy and in supply. Hoping nothing breaks down tooling wears out ect. The space taken up for stocking customers who want product JIT was massive and it did look like a warehouse. Space which could be more productive with production machines.
 
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I would imagine there are more defects when Just In Time is not on time and they become rushed to get an order out.

Buckshack, in my experience you hit the nail right on the head. Time constraints and understaffing have reaked havoc on Quality, The Bottom line is the product has to get out the door and delivered. Just in Time may provide more of a saving to offset the returns of unacceptable product and help Bucks bottom line.
 
I have been away from the forum for awhile. I kind of want to let this thread die but feel like I need to add my two cents. #1 I agree with OP in the sense that should be nothing wrong with his knife .... period end of story. I have my own knives that have been limited editions or customs that came through that have been full of wax or the scale material is less then eye pleasing and they get the " natural markings " tag.
I just think it comes across as bigger kick in the pants when this happens with custom shop knives and the limited editions because of the anticipation of this beautiful knife you are about to receive and you have flaws. To be honest one of the reasons I stop buying knives in the past year. I just bought some of the limited edition offerings this week so we will see how it goes. The only thing that i would asked of a poster in a knife specific forum is to post pictures of a defect you are complaining about.
As far as workforce issues .
From my own personal everday experience. Pride in in workmanship is just not there like is used to be. I was a flat rate diesel tech in a dealership enviroment for almost 20 years. Now I work behind the Service desk. I get lambasted just about everyday by customer's about issue with their vehicles that are either the manufacturer's fault or my own technician's fault. It always leaves me scratching my head when someone doesn't fix something 100% and they just let it out the door.
 
You have to follow your process. If you can't build the product properly in the time requested then turn down the order. You may loose the order but shipping substandard product isn't going to win you a customer either.

BH, I agree, Processes must be followed from the start of the Shift to the end of the shift. No matter what the volume is. Sadly where I work with large volume shifts the Proceeses are not followed and Quality and End users suffer for it.
 
I have been away from the forum for awhile. I kind of want to let this thread die but feel like I need to add my two cents. #1 I agree with OP in the sense that should be nothing wrong with his knife .... period end of story. I have my own knives that have been limited editions or customs that came through that have been full of wax or the scale material is less then eye pleasing and they get the " natural markings " tag.
I just think it comes across as bigger kick in the pants when this happens with custom shop knives and the limited editions because of the anticipation of this beautiful knife you are about to receive and you have flaws. To be honest one of the reasons I stop buying knives in the past year. I just bought some of the limited edition offerings this week so we will see how it goes. The only thing that i would asked of a poster in a knife specific forum is to post pictures of a defect you are complaining about.
As far as workforce issues .
From my own personal everday experience. Pride in in workmanship is just not there like is used to be. I was a flat rate diesel tech in a dealership enviroment for almost 20 years. Now I work behind the Service desk. I get lambasted just about everyday by customer's about issue with their vehicles that are either the manufacturer's fault or my own technician's fault. It always leaves me scratching my head when someone doesn't fix something 100% and they just let it out the door.

Wouldn't everyone learn a lesson by stepping in those shoes for a day!
 
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