Just saw this.....Bark River is no more?

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shinyedges said:
I'm not an expert, but I'm guessing they put in the elements that 3v normally has and set a number, the detected amount deviates from that number and is indicated in red? Steels have a range that the elements are allowed to be in, so there's variance.
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Ignore the colors, its just comparing it to the stored library to the nearest match. Its CPM 3V given the % results.
 
DavidZ said:
Not only would I want to know what the steel actually is, I'd also want to make sure the heat treat is correct as well. So now we're talking a Rockwell hardness tester as well. Then a paper certification that goes with the knife so you know it's been tested and it's genuine. Every aspect of the knife is now in question. The one reason we buy premium knives is so we can be assured that what were purchasing is genuine. That's part of what we pay for.
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Mk-211 said:
Next thing they'll need to purchase.

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Then everybody cries because there's a dent in the blade.
 
knarfeng said:
A $50 price increase would not be unreasonable.
Fully burdened labor rates include the business costs overall. Power, rent rent or other cost of the facility, liability insurance, benefits, secretarial support, the works. Fully burdened labor cost is often $150/ hr, even if the worker is only making $25/hr. So if carefully unboxing the kniife, measuring it, putting the knife back in the box properly and resealing the box takes 10 minutes you just spent $25. That's just the actual measurment and excludes the cost of the machine itself, the training, and any maintenance.

If I ever bought a $900 knife, maybe I'd be interested. Other than that, I buy from reputable knife manufacturers and let it go at that.
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Not for nothing but if I'm buying a $3-400 dollar knife, that knife should either have been inspected anyway at the time it was received from the maker or at the time its packed for shipping. I don't want to be a QC inspector for somebody else. Check the knife before it goes out and there won't be a lot of complaints. Let it take a few more minutes, thats what they get paid for.
 
I’m not really in the market for anything at the moment, haven’t been for a while. (Let alone something of questionable origin and materials…) But let’s say one of the more reputable dealers with misrepresented stock on hand ever chose to sell, and got down to rock bottom / yard sale prices…

If someone wanted a beater or glove box or yard or throwing knife, what would the money spent on that do? Just ease the financial burden of a DLT or whoever by a smidge?
 
Read the first 25 pages of this but just wanted to add some observations, not scientific or metallurgy based - valid as they are to all this.

In his 'confession' -if you want to read it like this- Stewart used one word I found to be very revealing . Apparently, he is 100% to blame, no other family members or dealers were privy to his decisions to use Chinese or other foreign steels (rigourously tested mark you...) masquerading as American made products. The word I fixed on was BLUNDER which he attempts to characterise as his actions. Talk about the worm off the hook...Blunder is an unintentional mistake or error based on wrong information or lack of knowledge about a subject. So this is it eh, a blunder by a well intentioned entrepreneur trying to serve the cusomer? Not very contrite is it ?:rolleyes:

Others may view this differently as an honest mistake made in the heat of the moment (that should have been seen to two years ago) but.....;)

My own experience with the company was not very rewarding. About 18 years ago I discovered Bark River Knives and immediately got intoxicated by their designs, over a couple of years bought about 9 knives of varying types and sizes. At that time there was 'another place' running, another knife forum which had a Bark River sub forum 'hosted' by Mike Stewart. It contained info of new releases and rather too much fanboy sycophancy for my taste, plus non knife related drivel, but some of the pictures were useful. I encounted build faults with 3 of the knives: blade chipping from VERY moderate use, scales peeling away from pins and tang, machining marks (vice grips??) on polished Micarta finishes and problems with holes appearing on 'stabilized' wood handles. I never thought much of the sheathes either, stiff and not retaining the knife well. Anyway, I asked about the concerns I had with stabilized wood developing holes (stuff falling out) first of all I was told it's not possible, ha ha! Then , if you must you can always send it in to the spa and the awesome warranty so stop bítching. When I pointed out I wasn't American and would have to send it back at my cost I was derided as being so picky and basically some xenophobic sneering added too. I returned it, got no acknowledgement , waited a month, e-mailed no reply, then it was returned with completely differnt scales on the knife not well finished and most of the jimping crudely ground off! After this I knew what sort of an outfit I was dealing with: aggressive, rude shysterism. Shocking ignorance and moronic sycophancy from fanboys, literal lickspittles hanging off his daily slime. Other knives had pins fall out and more chipping, yeah they looked very nice for a short while, but to use? Crap. They have stayed unloved in a box, bar one which is a decent knife.

Then I began to hear all the stories here and elswewhere and many of them unpleasant/disturbing.....and now this the termination of a saga, a serial rapist you could say. As for criticisms of employees who did as they were told, well another poster mentioned it was a close knit local community, this can muzzle the boldest of people. Also, if you are having to provide for a family and then discover wrongdoing, it's not so easy to resign and take the high ground particularly if you are not well off. I suspect that there must have been a high degree of overt intimidation going on from above as well. I hope the workers can get another job and one that doesn't compromise them. I don't think there is going to be too much nostalgia about disappearance of BR Knife in the Back , unlike other illustrious cutlers that have vanished over the last 50 years.
 
Kind of makes me wonder about the JX6 I broke the tip off of skinning a deer skull. When I called in about a warranty claim they talked to me like I was insane that I expected them to take care of it. Oh well.
 
Ebbtide said:
I don’t get all the pearl clutching about the dealers.
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Would you prefer they go out of business? What about the possibly hundreds of ‘poor saps’ working for them losing their jobs?

Ebbtide said:
1. They work for you. There’s always going to be some one else to sell you a knife.
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Yes, that’s true. Nonetheless, see my previous response.

Ebbtide said:
2. Only the dealer knows his business model.
Is all the stock paid for up front?
Half on delivery & half when sold?
Or delivered with an agreement to pay in 3 or 6 months?
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In DLT’s case, the materials for blanks were bought up front, because Stewart’s credit was shit, he was cash only with his suppliers, and apparently he had no cash for supplies. Apparently DLT made the decision to work with BR in this way to protect a big chunk (possibly as much as 20%) of their annual sales. Beyond that I don’t know what the arrangement is/was for the finished products. If they were smart, under these unusual circumstances, they’d pay the remainder as the units are sold. But who knows. They’re still left holding a crapload of product, which is never a good situation for any business, and at the very least are out what they paid for the blanks.

Ebbtide said:
3. How many of these “5000” knives are in fugly handle materials that would never sell anyway?
(lol)
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Somewhere I read that it’s more like 13,000 BR knives that DLT has in stock. No idea how many of those are too fugly to sell, but that’s a risk dealers themselves take even on a good day.

Ebbtide said:
If you all going to feel sorry for anyone, feel sorry for the poor saps that have thousands invested in their br collections.
Collections that have been massively devalued.
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Actually I don’t feel all that sorry for those collectors. It’ll be unfortunate if the value of their collections goes down the toilet, but that’s always a risk in the world of collecting anything. The integrity of this company’s owners has been in question for decades along with evidence of his crooked practices. Serious collectors should be making themselves aware of these situations before they start dumping big bucks on any company’s goods. The information has been out there on Mr. Stewart; if they chose to ignore it, that’s on them. I’m more concerned about the hundreds of employees of the retailers who had no say in their companies’ involvement with this or any other maker, nor knowledge of the shenanigans going on, who will be out of jobs if these retailers go under. With the volume of sales they’re going to be losing, that’s now a very real possibility. Again, I don't care so much about the managers who decided to get into bed with the Stewart’s, but I do care about the poor grunts working for them who are scraping by from paycheck to paycheck.

Nothing personal taken. Everybody’s entitled to their own opinion, and you’ve stated yours quite civilly.
 
I had a bark river knife a long time ago, the adventurer Persian in "cpm154" when attempting to baton with it I caused a rainbow ripple in the blade that is similar looking to the water drop touching still water and causing the ripple effect.
That was the last BR I bought
Again this was years ago, im not metallurgist or anything but im going to assume it was either overheated or not probably HTed
 
Based off everything that has come to light, is coming to light and will transpire in time I just dont see how any dealer can sell a BR with a straight face, even with a hefty discount, i understand the concern of bankruptcy, they will either have to get every knife in stock tested or sell it "as-is" with a disclaimer that it may or may not be what its advertised as, but even then..
 
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I had a Bark River Edwin Forrest Bowie come into the shop. It was there to be repaired, because the factory grind resulted in an extremely unsightly wavy edge, and the point was also veering very far off to one side. It was clear the worker who ground the blade was more heavy handed on one side than the other, and I had my work cut out for me. I received praise for my efforts when the knife returned to its owner, who said it was much better after I had reground it for him. I won't cry if I never handle another BRK.


Of course, I also won't leave anyone high and dry if they need work done on one, and I will treat it well out of respect for the owner of the knife, not the brand itself. That is if I can't talk them into burying it in the back yard.
 
DMG said:
I am even more amazed that someone came to the defense of blue haired libs.
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I know we were told to move on, and I don’t know if this was supposed to be a joke or not, but I can’t let this one go. I have no love for any of today’s liberals. I have a few bleeding ass progressives in my immediate family with whom I cannot discuss anything political. In fact it makes me physically ill thinking too much about where their heads are at. Nonetheless, they’re still people. This particular ‘blue haired lib’ is a victim. Doesn’t matter what her political leanings are, nobody deserves the kind of harassment and abuse she’s had to deal with. It just speaks volumes about the character of the scumbags we’re dealing with here.
 
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