Just saw this.....Bark River is no more?

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1066vik said:
as an example of doing it the right way by a knife company: a while back, the US foundry producing 1095 cro-van steel shut down. That's the primary steel for most of KaBar's knives that are actually produced in the USA. As a result, they had to start ordering their steel from a German supplier. Due to a tightening of the laws concerning "USA made", they had to remove the USA marking off their knives in 2019 or 2020, because foreign steel was the main component of their product and NO amount of processes done in country was enough for them to label the knives as a USA product under those laws.
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I can't speak as to the laws as I'm not well versed in that. And Im assuming what you say is accurate.

Its also unfortunate because that would mean a LOT (maybe most?......nearly all?) knives wouldn't meet the "Made In USA" standard.

That may be the law but it isn't a realistic standard to judge makers by.

Much of the steel isn't made in the US. And almost all of us use titanium not from the US.

But bars of steel and titanium sheet aren't very practical for cut and carry. The blades and liners/frames are made here. That's made in the US as far as I'm concerned.

Im going to keep saying my knives are made in the US. Im not 100% sure where the washers and a few screw types are made and frankly, I don't care. My knives are still made in the US.
 
collecter said:
Putting the origin on the retailer feels like a stretch unless they're in the same town.

This brand had serious criticism 20 years ago and this forum made me question if it was funded or owned by brkt because of how strong the opposition against any negative reviews was.

BRKT employees knew down to the lowest paid guy that throws the cardboard boxes in the recycle bin.
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True! I’m not suggesting retailers should be held responsible for discovering despicable business practices that we’re discussing here. But there are simple ways to prove a product is made in your own shop or by an oem located in the US.

Sharp & Fiery said:
And how do you suppose this would work? Putting the blame on retailers? Ummm…so would you have walmart go through all their stuff and confirm providence?

Retailers have to trust the makers word.
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Easy, as a retailer if you want me to advertise your product as made in the US then prove it to me. Send me pics of your shop and product in the process of production. If you’re outsourcing to an oem then that should be easily done with them as well.

This takes relatively no time at all much less money. There’s one retailer already doing this, usamadeblade. Other retailers also notes country of origin. And yes if they’re going to sell a product as made in the USA they should confirm that’s the case. As a wise man once said “trust but verify”!

And I’m not suggesting retailers should be held responsible as in face any penalties. Just that they could easily do so.

Well I don’t buy my knives at Walmart as most here don’t and I’m pretty sure you don’t as well so I could careless what they do.
 
Blues said:
A lot of these American companies weasel word the connection to the USA with a variety of methods.

You can have words to the effect of "Proudly Built in the USA", which leaves room for "with parts sourced globally" and such, which are not always stated but might be inferred. (Assembled in the USA is another.)

I'm not at all against quality knives which are built abroad, (by reputable people in countries which are not our enemies), but I do find it offensive when a company tries to weasel word a patriotic theme by implying something which is not, in fact, true. Just be straight with the customers.
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Like Benchmade! They claim their products are Made in the USA but use European steels on some of their knives.
 
J. Doyle said:
I can't speak as to the laws as I'm not well versed in that. And Im assuming what you say is accurate.

Its also unfortunate because that would mean a LOT (maybe most?......nearly all?) knives wouldn't meet the "Made In USA" standard.

That may be the law but it isn't a realistic standard to judge makers by.

Much of the steel isn't made in the US. And almost all of us use titanium not from the US.

But bars of steel and titanium sheet aren't very practical for cut and carry. The blades and liners/frames are made here. That's made in the US as far as I'm concerned.

Im going to keep saying my knives are made in the US. Im not 100% sure where the washers and a few screw types are made and frankly, I don't care. My knives are still made in the US.
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As long as the steel used meets AISI/ASTM standards for composition and can be certified as such who cares where the steel is made. The composition would determine the heat treat protocols used and would ensure a good outcome to the final end product user. All makers should be truthful if asked what the country of origin for the steel is.
 
Sharp & Fiery said:
And how do you suppose this would work? Putting the blame on retailers? Ummm…so would you have walmart go through all their stuff and confirm providence?

Retailers have to trust the makers word.
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I'm not sure Walmart can confirm Providence even if they go through all their stuff, but they can at least take reasonable measures as regards provenance. ☺️
 
Glen Juntunen said:
Like Benchmade! They claim their products are Made in the USA but use European steels on some of their knives.
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You would have to look at the regulations regarding what percentages and key ingredients must be of U.S. origin to make particular claims. I didn't work in our fraud division, so it's not my area of expertise.
 
Glen Juntunen said:
If the steel is 100% made in the USA, then I agree. If it’s made in Europe, sold to a US based retailer, then purchased by the factory to make knife blades, then it’s a different story.
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This is ridiculous and getting way over complicated and off in the weeds.

A sheet of steel isn't a knife. If the blade was made in the US (and the rest of the parts) the KNIFE was made in the US. Period. Regardless of where the raw materials came from.
 
somber said:
Mike Stewart lives in a home that’s two levels above a mobile home.

Where the money went, I have no clue, but unless he lined the walls in gold, the money he took isn’t in his real estate holdings

Even the ship was a rental.
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which makes more sense. think michigan homestead bankruptcy protected allows 40k to 50k something and 76kish if over 65...

i dont know prices up there, maybe that super low for even a mobile?
 
jbmonkey said:
which makes more sense. think michigan homestead bankruptcy protected allows 40k to 50k something and 76kish if over 65...

i dont know prices up there, maybe that super low for even a mobile?
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Acreage is probably more relevant.
How many acres of land is that home on.....?
 
For sure. I bought a home there in 2015 for $32,000 and it was very average

Stewart’s home is in the bluff of Gladstone and has no real acreage to the property.

Normal, typical plot. I’ll try and find the address.
 
Glen Juntunen said:
If the steel is 100% made in the USA, then I agree. If it’s made in Europe, sold to a US based retailer, then purchased by the factory to make knife blades, then it’s a different story.
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Is a Erasteel magnacut/magnamax steel knife considered as 'made in USA?' or need different label.
 
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1066vik said:
as an example of doing it the right way by a knife company: a while back, the US foundry producing 1095 cro-van steel shut down. That's the primary steel for most of KaBar's knives that are actually produced in the USA. As a result, they had to start ordering their steel from a German supplier. Due to a tightening of the laws concerning "USA made", they had to remove the USA marking off their knives in 2019 or 2020, because foreign steel was the main component of their product and NO amount of processes done in country was enough for them to label the knives as a USA product under those laws.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I find this hard to believe and I could be wrong. Seems like there are way more factors to that story to be true. Importing a raw material and then using it in your own factory would still have to be considered USA made. It’s a global economy. So many raw materials are imported that only using American sourced raw materials to be considered American made would make it virtually impossible.
 
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Glen Juntunen said:
If the steel is 100% made in the USA, then I agree. If it’s made in Europe, sold to a US based retailer, then purchased by the factory to make knife blades, then it’s a different story.
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So if they use screws made in China can the product still be made in the USA? To me that’s taking it to an extreme. And fortunately that’s not the cass to be able to claim made in the usa.
 
somber said:
For sure. I bought a home there in 2015 for $32,000 and it was very average

Stewart’s home is in the bluff of Gladstone and has no real acreage to the property.

Normal, typical plot. I’ll try and find the address.
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I would not publicly post his address here.

Might actually be a rules violation.

But not a good idea either way.
 
lunect said:
Is a Erasteel magnacut/magnamax steel knife considered as 'made in USA?' or need different label.
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nsm nsm is in the best position to answer this question.

Larrin Larrin may know as well, I don't know how much he gets involved in this side of the business.
 
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