Knife or Death

Nathan the Machinist said:
Oh yeah man there is YouTube video of him cutting down pretty good size trees with a super assassin in two whacks, it's crazy. That's a sword that can go through a two-by-four in one hit pretty easy, it would have been insane on the Knife or Death competition.
Click to expand...

Yep I remember seeing that. Dan K's power behind that cutting geometry, insane. After you put the thought in my head I keep imagining what the corner of that box on Knife or Death would do if he hit it with a Sasquatch.

TommyGun56 said:
^^^^ Ask and you shall receive
Click to expand...

And there it is! The camera man giggles every time Dan swings :D
 
Last edited:
UffDa said:
I kind of cringed when the guy with the bowie said that he just got it from Palestine. I didn't think that a hidden tang knife would hold up very well. It didn't. Then, there was the fine bent Japanese sword. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Yeah, that was the other part I laughed at, the guy talking about his authentic Japanese shinken...Made in China... with the wobbly handle...

Not that there aren't decent (and even good) katana coming out of China, but
A) a loose handle tends to not instill confidence in the quality
B) despite Hollywood's propensity for showing Japanese katana easily chopping through all manner of ridiculous stuff with no damage whatsoever (heavy chains and padlocks, stone/marble columns/statues, firearms etc.), they were designed for slicing and dicing human bodies, optimally unarmored, but up to and including with light armor. The traditionally forged ones don't make good machetes or axes, as they aren't very tolerant of abuse.

I've seen someone with more money than skill (or sense) permanently bend an actual NBTHK authenticated/rated Japanese sword using it in tameshigiri on rolled tatami simply from a poorly executed cut with a crappy angle (despite the instructor's recommendation to purchase a reproduction for practice cutting, as opposed to using a $XX,XXX authentic collector's grade piece).
 
I watched it last night (twice actually) and have been waiting for a break at work to properly articulate my feedback and questions:

First Off, Jo the Machinist Jo the Machinist - you ROCK MamaJo. Seriously impressive chopping and endurance on that course. What a memorable experience for you - I bet your kids are proud to have one of the cooooolest Moms on this planet!!!

The PPE they provided seemed quite uncomfortable and inhibitive to being in a natural, or more relaxed posture like you may be used to. I know I would have gone NUTS wearing those googles and bulky pads. But, safety third as I always say! ;)

Seeing the (Zombie) Behemoth and Grog's awesome sheath was pretty cool, too! I felt like a little kid excitedly telling my g/f "That's Jo Carothers!!! That's the same Behemoth that they made for me!!! That's Grog's sheath, too - he made that special for Nathan and Jo!" Even though she's not a knife-fanatic (like I am) she was still pretty amazed that the Carothers Community is so tight-knit and supportive.

Feedback & Questions about the course:
1. How strict were they about the "technique" used on each obstacle? For example, on the dowels - would they have let you use the spine of your blade to break through them using shear force in order to preserve your edge for the other areas? I imagine not, since it's a cutting competition (not a bludgeoning competition) but I am just curious.

2. Were you allowed to give your edge a final "touch-up" before running the course? I know Travis did a safety check initially, but were you allowed to re-sharpen prior to starting?

2. On the 'Stick and Move' course - were you required to use a "chop" motion, or were you allowed to stab (say the underside of) obstacles? I would think using gravity and weight to your advantage may be a good tactic. I watched "Cowboy Jo" use a similar technique to keep most of the weight inside the crate as he weakened the exterior structure enough for it to give way under it's own weight. Same could be used on the buckets - STAB STAB STAB the bottom and then chop the side?

3. The Ice Block seemed crazy difficult for all competitors. Equally hard on the blades as it was on those wielding them. I liked Rodrigo's approach with his Kopis - attack the bottom to weaken the "trunk" and let the top-heavy weight topple it over.

4. Lifeline - I was pretty surprised how hastily everyone approached this obstacle. It seems like this was one that would take the most time and precision to plan your chop. Would they let you touch any of the object - to set them at the right angle you'd like to strike? The fish, for example, may have been best struck right at the spine with enough follow-through to make it through the tough gills and meat. It seemed like most of the strikes on that fish were not well-placed or planned. But - here I am typing on a laptop like I'm an expert or something, HA!!! :D

5. I was really hoping to see someone advance to the final obstacles: the meat curtains(?) and the metal sheet, especially the metal. Those blades/edges would be so beat up by that point, I would love to see them plunged through that sheet metal. Such punishing torture for such nice blades, but pretty damn crazy to see how well they hold up after it all.

6. I do think the BC the best blade out there for this course -BUT- after seeing the variety of obstacles and different mediums used, I can't help but wonder how well a (modified) "competition" Kukri would have fared. With the right blade grind/profile, thickness, steel and heat treat, I think it might be a worthy design to see compete on this course. The recurve might allow for more powerful and less-fatiguing swings and more-natural follow through on each swing.

7. Lastly - watching this is pretty damn inspiring. It really shows how much skill, strength, and endurance is required to compete in Blade Sports (like this). Not only is a good way to test your mettle, or put your money where your mouth is, but is physically demanding and a rigorously FUN workout!!! It makes me want to compete. It makes me want to pre-order a CPK KCC. It makes me want to take Nathan and Jo up on their offer to pay for the BSI entry/training. It makes me want to contact the producers to get on that show and bring my own BC along. It makes me want to CHOP SOMETHING!!!! :mad::mad::mad::)

Thank you for sharing this with us, Jo! No need to answer any of these questions, these were just my own observations and crazy stream of consciousness thoughts as I was watching the program. And congratulations again for participating in such a cool event. That's a very cool experience that you will remember for life! :)
 
Last edited:
Nathan the Machinist said:
I'm pretty sure that sword that was bent was a $5,000 piece which maybe isn't a "high-end" sword but that's still a pretty spendy blade to wreck.
Click to expand...


Not to get too far off topic, but I read an article awhile ago about Japanese swords vs. European swords made in the same period. Basically, the European sword makers would laugh at the Japanese swords. Poor quality steel, only cuts in one direction and most are rather poor at penetrating mail. The Japanese fighting style would not fair well against a skilled knight of the same period.

I always laugh when someone tells me that a Japanese sword cut a machine gun barrel in two. Sorry, it ain't gonna happen. One guy in a gun shop said that he had a sword made by a 16th century master that would do that. I offered a 03A3 barrel for him to cut in half. He declined. BS walks. ;)
 
So I sat down to watch the show and immediately the wife asks what it is that I'm doing? ....Having a 2.5 year old that decides when her bedtime is every night has admittedly eliminated any form of cinematic enjoyment from our household.

But I was determined to watch!! Just as I was explaining the jist of the show, the contestants make their way in and I'm like LOOK that's Jo... We like Jo! Watch her go!

My wife's reaction... "there's a lady competing with all these dudes?" She sat there quietly and watched the entire episode. Only to make a peep when cheering as Jo made it up to the block. Mind you she has zero interest in anything sharp. I explained what bladesports was, why a reality show like this may have come into existence and what the Carother's clan does and how they do it so well. After all was said and done she actually asked if I had a chopper and could I show it to her.

What a great night. Job well done Mr. and Mrs. Carothers. Applause all around. We appreciate what you guys do.
-Renato
 
untytled said:
So I sat down to watch the show and immediately the wife asks what it is that I'm doing? ....Having a 2.5 year old that decides when her bedtime is every night has admittedly eliminated any form of cinematic enjoyment from our household.

But I was determined to watch!! Just as I was explaining the jist of the show, the contestants make their way in and I'm like LOOK that's Jo... We like Jo! Watch her go!

My wife's reaction... "there's a lady competing with all these dudes?" She sat there quietly and watched the entire episode. Only to make a peep when cheering as Jo made it up to the block. Mind you she has zero interest in anything sharp. I explained what bladesports was, why a reality show like this may have come into existence and what the Carother's clan does and how they do it so well. After all was said and done she actually asked if I had a chopper and could I show it to her.

What a great night. Job well done Mr. and Mrs. Carothers. Applause all around. We appreciate what you guys do.
-Renato
Click to expand...
Very awesome! Yay! Thanks Renato! :D
 
Benson X said:
Feedback & Questions about the course:
1. How strict were they about the "technique" used on each obstacle? For example, on the dowels - would they have let you use the spine of your blade to break through them using shear force in order to preserve your edge for the other areas? I imagine not, since it's a cutting competition (not a bludgeoning competition) but I am just curious.

I wondered about this too. By the time Rodrigo got done whaling on the ice block in round 2, it was obvious how dull the edge of his kopis had become, while trying to cut the hanging meat

2. Were you allowed to give your edge a final "touch-up" before running the course? I know Travis did a safety check initially, but were you allowed to re-sharpen prior to starting?

The blades all seemed usably sharp beginning stage 1. I'm assuming they might've been allowed a touch up before stage 2, as Rodrigo's kopis seemed sharp enough to cut the meat at the start, where it looked like it had blunted somewhat near the end of stage 1 (and definitely midway through stage 2).

2. On the 'Stick and Move' course - were you required to use a "chop" motion, or were you allowed to stab (say the underside of) obstacles? I would think using gravity and weight to your advantage may be a good tactic. I watched "Cowboy Jo" use a similar technique to keep most of the weight inside the crate as he weakened the exterior structure enough for it to give way under it's own weight. Same could be used on the buckets - STAB STAB STAB the bottom and then chop the side?

Or try to stab the sides at intervals, then chop through the dashed lines?

3. The Ice Block seemed crazy difficult for all competitors. Equally hard on the blades as it was on those wielding them. I liked Rodrigo's approach with his Kopis - attack the bottom to weaken the "trunk" and let the top-heavy weight topple it over.

I actually admired Cowboy Joe's approach on this obstacle. Definitely an experienced competitor's approach, with a tool he knows VERY well.

As opposed to swinging hard like most of the competitors (expending energy, and risking edge damage), he was aware of his blade's edge hardness and geometry, to use light chops to chip just enough of the ice away to reach the dye tube in stage 1, and to get the job done in stage 2.

This was the obstacle I would have used the spine (especially on stage 2), if allowed. Hard whacks to crack the ice without any risk of dulling the edge (would depend on if the blade was heavy enough, with a strong knife, wielded by a powerful individual). That would likely have helped Rodrigo in stage 2, as the difference in cutting the meat at the beginning of stage 2, vs right after the ice block, was quite apparent.

4. Lifeline - I was pretty surprised how hastily everyone approached this obstacle. It seems like this was one that would take the most time and precision to plan your chop. Would they let you touch any of the object - to set them at the right angle you'd like to strike? The fish, for example, may have been best struck right at the spine with enough follow-through to make it through the tough gills and meat. It seemed like most of the strikes on that fish were not well-placed or planned. But - here I am typing on a laptop like I'm an expert or something, HA!!! :D

Yeah, every guy who made it to the fish completely underestimated that armored fish! None of them really took even as much time to focus, as they did with the chicken.

5. I was really hoping to see someone advance to the final obstacles: the meat curtains(?) and the metal sheet, especially the metal. Those blades/edges would be so beat up by that point, I would love to see them plunged through that sheet metal. Such punishing torture for such nice blades, but pretty damn crazy to see how well they hold up after it all.

6. I do think the BC the best blade out there for this course -BUT- after seeing the variety of obstacles and different mediums used, I can't help but wonder how well a (modified) "competition" Kukri would have fared. With the right blade grind/profile, thickness, steel and heat treat, I think it might be a worthy design to see compete on this course. The recurve might allow for more powerful and less-fatiguing swings and more-natural follow through on each swing.

The kopis is close enough to a kukri, that I don't see that significant of a difference due to blade design. Some kukris are beefier, or more front heavy, have more curvature etc., so there's variation even within the design.

The somewhat front heavy design does provide more momentum for a similar length and weight blade (i.e. a 15" 24 oz kukri is a little more forward heavy than a 15" 24 oz straight blade without the narrow 'waist').

Edge geometry, heat treat, hardness and durability, handle comfort etc. all come into play though. I've used various kukris from my younger days backpacking (late 70's - mid 80's) to now.

While they chop better, for their length, than a machete, the traditional handles aren't particularly comfortable, and I'd have way more confidence in CPK's full tang, heat treat, overall geometry, and overall 'function first' design orientation, than a 'traditional' design, for the sake of tradition.

As far as follow through, that's all about technique. Having trained in various blade, edged weapon styles, I find a straighter, not as forward balanced blade, easier to maneuver and control, than the kukri, ESPECIALLY for powerful through cuts.

Based on the ergonomics and function of my CPK LC, if I could sign up for that competition, I'd take the BC over a kukri any day.

I'd still LOVE to see Dan the Man go at it with the Super Assassin though (or try it myself, if I could afford a Super Assassin).

7. Lastly - watching this is pretty damn inspiring. It really shows how much skill, strength, and endurance is required to compete in Blade Sports (like this). Not only is a good way to test your mettle, or put your money where your mouth is, but is physically demanding and a rigorously FUN workout!!! It makes me want to compete. It makes me want to pre-order a CPK KCC. It makes me want to take Nathan and Jo up on their offer to pay for the BSI entry/training. It makes me want to contact the producers to get on that show and bring my own BC along. It makes me want to CHOP SOMETHING!!!! :mad::mad::mad::)

! :)
Click to expand...
Comments inside
 
Last edited:
I was on the road for work and didn’t get to watch “knife or death” until this morning.
Great job, Jo!!!
I do think the course, or parts of it, could have been modified slightly to accommodate beings of smaller stature.
The BC and Grogs sheath looked awesome!!!!!
Way to go CPK team and friends. I hope to see more CPK’s running the course in the future!
Again, congratulations and great job to Jo!!!
 
comments added
Benson X said:
I watched it last night (twice actually) and have been waiting for a break at work to properly articulate my feedback and questions:

First Off, Jo the Machinist Jo the Machinist - you ROCK MamaJo. Seriously impressive chopping and endurance on that course. What a memorable experience for you - I bet your kids are proud to have one of the cooooolest Moms on this planet!!! THANK YOU!! :D

The PPE they provided seemed quite uncomfortable and inhibitive to being in a natural, or more relaxed posture like you may be used to. I know I would have gone NUTS wearing those googles and bulky pads. But, safety third as I always say! ;) It was a bit cumbersome and apparently they did not believe a person could be that small. ;)

Seeing the (Zombie) Behemoth and Grog's awesome sheath was pretty cool, too! I felt like a little kid excitedly telling my g/f "That's Jo Carothers!!! That's the same Behemoth that they made for me!!! That's Grog's sheath, too - he made that special for Nathan and Jo!" Even though she's not a knife-fanatic (like I am) she was still pretty amazed that the Carothers Community is so tight-knit and supportive. It was a blast!!!

Feedback & Questions about the course:
1. How strict were they about the "technique" used on each obstacle? For example, on the dowels - would they have let you use the spine of your blade to break through them using shear force in order to preserve your edge for the other areas? I imagine not, since it's a cutting competition (not a bludgeoning competition) but I am just curious. I don't think that would have been allowed. Yes, it was a cutting competition. Also having the edge pointed at your face would have been dangerous. And for someone my size, it would have been less helpful not more.

2. Were you allowed to give your edge a final "touch-up" before running the course? I know Travis did a safety check initially, but were you allowed to re-sharpen prior to starting? We were told they would provide materials for sharpening, they did not. Jo Smith did bring his stones and was gracious enough to let those who wanted to use them. I think they were each given maybe 5 minutes. I don't know if they were allowed to resharpen before the Face off or not.

2. On the 'Stick and Move' course - were you required to use a "chop" motion, or were you allowed to stab (say the underside of) obstacles? I would think using gravity and weight to your advantage may be a good tactic. I watched "Cowboy Jo" use a similar technique to keep most of the weight inside the crate as he weakened the exterior structure enough for it to give way under it's own weight. Same could be used on the buckets - STAB STAB STAB the bottom and then chop the side? We were allowed to stab and I did do some of that, they just didn't show it. It wasn't nearly as effective as I would have liked. I wish I would have thought to use 2 hands on this one, but it goes against my training and never occurred to me until I was back home. I also should have gone for the corners, but I was concerned about wrecking my blade on the fasteners holding it together. Had I known I was going to drive it into some rocks in another minute, I probably would have been less concerned with this.

3. The Ice Block seemed crazy difficult for all competitors. Equally hard on the blades as it was on those wielding them. I liked Rodrigo's approach with his Kopis - attack the bottom to weaken the "trunk" and let the top-heavy weight topple it over. This one was my favorite. I thought my knife did a great job on it.

4. Lifeline - I was pretty surprised how hastily everyone approached this obstacle. It seems like this was one that would take the most time and precision to plan your chop. Would they let you touch any of the object - to set them at the right angle you'd like to strike? The fish, for example, may have been best struck right at the spine with enough follow-through to make it through the tough gills and meat. It seemed like most of the strikes on that fish were not well-placed or planned. But - here I am typing on a laptop like I'm an expert or something, HA!!! :D You were not allowed to touch the objects, but you were allowed to come at it from any angle.

5. I was really hoping to see someone advance to the final obstacles: the meat curtains(?) and the metal sheet, especially the metal. Those blades/edges would be so beat up by that point, I would love to see them plunged through that sheet metal. Such punishing torture for such nice blades, but pretty damn crazy to see how well they hold up after it all. Yes, I wish I would have made it this far. When I saw that stupid chicken when we were first shown the course, I just knew it was going to be my downfall. Self fulfilling prophecy I guess.

6. I do think the BC the best blade out there for this course -BUT- after seeing the variety of obstacles and different mediums used, I can't help but wonder how well a (modified) "competition" Kukri would have fared. With the right blade grind/profile, thickness, steel and heat treat, I think it might be a worthy design to see compete on this course. The recurve might allow for more powerful and less-fatiguing swings and more-natural follow through on each swing.

7. Lastly - watching this is pretty damn inspiring. It really shows how much skill, strength, and endurance is required to compete in Blade Sports (like this). Not only is a good way to test your mettle, or put your money where your mouth is, but is physically demanding and a rigorously FUN workout!!! It makes me want to compete. It makes me want to pre-order a CPK KCC. It makes me want to take Nathan and Jo up on their offer to pay for the BSI entry/training. It makes me want to contact the producers to get on that show and bring my own BC along. It makes me want to CHOP SOMETHING!!!! :mad::mad::mad::) Join me! You'll love it!!!!

Thank you for sharing this with us, Jo! No need to answer any of these questions, these were just my own observations and crazy stream of consciousness thoughts as I was watching the program. And congratulations again for participating in such a cool event. That's a very cool experience that you will remember for life! :)
Click to expand...

Thanks again Ben and everyone! I really had fun with it. Lots I would do differently, but there were 7 other guys who thought the same thing when we were done. I would try again in a heartbeat!
 
bluemax_1 said:
Comments inside
Click to expand...

Jo the Machinist said:
comments added


Thanks again Ben and everyone! I really had fun with it. Lots I would do differently, but there were 7 other guys who thought the same thing when we were done. I would try again in a heartbeat!
Click to expand...

Thank you both for taking the time to reply! Great feedback and insightful perspectives! :)

It's very easy (for me) to make observations and "shoulda/coulda/woulda" comments as an outsider looking in, so please take my questions and comments with a grain of salt (and maybe a shot of Tequila ;))!

I am really looking for to watching more episodes of KoD and seeing it evolve; I think it is an awesome concept and has the potential to be a pretty successful series!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top