I'll add to this mess of a thread. After watching the Bushman tests, I learned that the 3/32" x 2" x 12" piece of 1095 I have isnt too thin to take some punishment. I learned that the rear guard on a ka-bar gets in the way for more people than me, and I learned that the SK-5 Cold Steel is switching to isnt half bad, if what is desired is a tough knife. I was also somewhat surprised by the USMC knives ability to slice a pretty thin orange w/ the out of the box edge. Hey noss, how about some battoning through some mild steel, like tie wire or bread ties or sheet metal or something. I've used my knives to cut metal, usually as a novelty, but if a home made kiridashi of 1095 at 64-66 HRc can do it with a 20 degree inclusive edge, some of the stuff you've got coming should too.
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knife tests .com?
- Thread starter MikePerrin
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Wow, moodino, you know so much! You should do some of your own knife reviews and tests!
"Those that cant do, critique."
The making of a knife may have some scientific processes, but the use of one seldom does. Lots of people find the videos informative, because when they actually use them they don't use laboratory conditions.
Whens your first test, by the way?
"Those that cant do, critique."
The making of a knife may have some scientific processes, but the use of one seldom does. Lots of people find the videos informative, because when they actually use them they don't use laboratory conditions.
Whens your first test, by the way?
Oh No! Not Again!!!! When someone at CPF did this dance ..."Wow, moodino, you know so much! You should do some of your own knife reviews and tests! "Those that cant do, critique." three years ago...
I met the challenge with what turned into a revolutionary way to look at Illumination Tool reviews. It still gets around 5,000 unique visitors per month, even though I closed the project two years ago.I've had offers to sell it even! But no, my job is to help people differentiate between voodo and medicine- between circus and science.
So my answer is. My group can out-test anyone on anything that can be defined as a technology- if properly paid to do so. Critiques we can offer for free
Here ya go...
http://www.imagometrics.com/FLReviews/FLR.home.htm
This series is expecially instructive...
http://www.imagometrics.com/FLReviews/FL_Stuff_2.htm
http://www.imagometrics.com/FLReviews/FL_GL_TB.htm
I met the challenge with what turned into a revolutionary way to look at Illumination Tool reviews. It still gets around 5,000 unique visitors per month, even though I closed the project two years ago.I've had offers to sell it even! But no, my job is to help people differentiate between voodo and medicine- between circus and science.
So my answer is. My group can out-test anyone on anything that can be defined as a technology- if properly paid to do so. Critiques we can offer for free
Here ya go...
http://www.imagometrics.com/FLReviews/FLR.home.htm
This series is expecially instructive...
http://www.imagometrics.com/FLReviews/FL_Stuff_2.htm
http://www.imagometrics.com/FLReviews/FL_GL_TB.htm
Cobalt
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Very simple. Taking any product beyond it's limits tells you much. It tells you how far beyond it's limit it can go, it tells you how it will react when it fails and most importantly it gives you confidence that the product isn't just hype.
Tell me that Noss's video didn't sell a shitload of Bushmasters and Kabar Bowies:thumbup: These are low priced knives that took a ton of abuse in my opinion. They may have blunted easily but they could be resharpened. The fact they took abuse means that you could count on one to work.
The Sog on the other hand failed miserably as did the Becker in my opnion. The becker I did not expect. I don't think a Brute would fail like that or a Campanion, but I don't know.
Destructive testing is done in every industry but in house and third parties alike. I see nothing wrong with it. I just always try to throw my 2 cents on how he could do stuff that would be duplicated by others, but I admit I enjoy watching the videos and they are informative to me.:thumbup:
Sal Glesser
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Dick Newick said; "You must exceed the limit to find the limit".
Knowing the limit is wise.
sal
Knowing the limit is wise.
sal
Cobalt
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ok, so you said in one sentence what took me four paragraphs.
and that is why spyderco kicks azz:thumbup:
Torture testing needs to be meaningful. Did he test chemical resistance? Corossion resistance? No? Why not?These are very important in survival scenarios. What about electrical conductivity? Ka-Bars are great since the handles seem to be electrically insulative. Are they? I'd like to see a video of a knife 'accidentally' cutting a live high voltage cable.That's more realistic than a knife chopping concrete block.Or how about cutting into a plastic or steel drum? I've read of more than a few Soldiers having to do that in theater.
The video are great, but where is the test result data in a table with metrics?
Look. I never disagreed with the torture aspect of the test plan, only the fact that it's administered inconsistently across the group of subjects and the torture methods are arguably unrealistic. I mean, it's possible to exert a different amount of force when smacking one blade than when smacking a competitor- hence the need for robotics labs. Why is the identity of the tester hidden? In my field, everyone that does the testing and writting is known. How else can you qualify the results as valid and impartial? So I guess what I mean is, how do we know what personal leanings the tester has if we don't know who they are?
It's like giving student in a class a different test each! I would love to know which knife is the best carver or chopper or slicer- in a fair trial.
The video are great, but where is the test result data in a table with metrics?
Look. I never disagreed with the torture aspect of the test plan, only the fact that it's administered inconsistently across the group of subjects and the torture methods are arguably unrealistic. I mean, it's possible to exert a different amount of force when smacking one blade than when smacking a competitor- hence the need for robotics labs. Why is the identity of the tester hidden? In my field, everyone that does the testing and writting is known. How else can you qualify the results as valid and impartial? So I guess what I mean is, how do we know what personal leanings the tester has if we don't know who they are?
It's like giving student in a class a different test each! I would love to know which knife is the best carver or chopper or slicer- in a fair trial.
Cobalt
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Chemical resistance? what chemicals and for what. How dangerous to humans do you wish to make this test? This is an individual not a corporation?
Corrosion resistance? That's easy 1000 series steels suck for corrosion resistance. 1095, 1050, etc will rust. You want to keep them from rusing? Ok, bring the metal to a high polish to reduce the surface grain size and then clear coat it with a thermal barrier, not an abrassion barrier. The higher the chrome content and general alloying content the higher the resistance of the metal to pitting during corrosion.
Electrical insulation? Unless specifically noted by the manufacturer that the handle resists conduction of current, do not in any way trust the material. There is only three knives to my knowledge that were designed to resist electrical conduction. Neither one of those has Noss tested nor will he be likely to ever test them.
NO, NO ,NO, do not ever do this unless the manufacturer guaranties electrical insulative properties You are missing the point on the concrete test. It is very destructive and it speeds up the deterioration of the blade much faster to see how the edge and steel react. That is all. Not so hard to understand and I fail to see why people have such a hard time with this.
Again, we are talking about an individual not a corporation. And he is fairly new to this. He has already improved his testing with each knife and I think he will learn from his own tests and continue to better his testing.
Yes, this is a tough one. You can hit one knife 3 times harder with a hammer than another and it will fail sooner. No doubt about this. However to date the knives that failed very early on with hardly any hammering while others took it all and failed much later than expected. Also you can never say that someone didn't hammer on the knife before starting the video to make it fail sooner. There are many ways to skew testing in any industry. Having non bias witnesses is a way to solve that, but that is nearly impossible.
Would you make sure that they are all given the same edge angleso that the blades geometry is the deciding factor? This would truly make it fair. Otherwise it makes no difference as the edge angle is usually what determines how well they cut.
Cobalt
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Cobalt: coming up on knife tests.com. The Uncle Fester Test. I will place a light bulb in my mouth and lay the blade on a 1000 volt power line an see if the
handle truly resists electricity. If we have light we know the knife fails.
just make sure that if you do the electrical test that you touch freddy, that way he grounds out and gets zapped as well
I would recommend that you put a magnet to each knife on video. You might be surprised at how some have very weak magnetic signatures.
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so pay noss for better testing
Sure if he's qualified to do so, we'd be delighted to subcontract him 
When can I see a resume?
When can I see a resume?
So first I'd want to see an unimpeachable trial with 3 comparable and competitive products. Testing them under the same conditions, timed and proctored . A test plan that lays out the objectives, spells out how the evaluation process will deliver actionable data that: manufacturers can use in talking to thier R&D as well as design departments, that consumers can use in making informed and relevant buying decisions and that marketing departments can package in thier materials in order to support claims that they may make for thier products.
Yes, then I will approach a bunch of manufacturers, get thier buy-in and sponsorship and hopefully that sponsorship will be enough cash to pay for the expected efforts of the properly conducted evaluations plus the flow of evals that should follow. I'll help to edit and package the results for publication in the knife mags and of course on YouTube. If it flies, I'll approach Discovery with the idea of combining our own upcoming movies with his in our program idea : "EXTREME BLADES".
My mobile phone number will be conveyed by PM under separate cover Oops! No way to conatct him. Can someone send me his e-mail address please?
Moodino
Yes, then I will approach a bunch of manufacturers, get thier buy-in and sponsorship and hopefully that sponsorship will be enough cash to pay for the expected efforts of the properly conducted evaluations plus the flow of evals that should follow. I'll help to edit and package the results for publication in the knife mags and of course on YouTube. If it flies, I'll approach Discovery with the idea of combining our own upcoming movies with his in our program idea : "EXTREME BLADES".
My mobile phone number will be conveyed by PM under separate cover
Oops! No way to conatct him. Can someone send me his e-mail address please?Moodino
Cobalt
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True, but a destructive test is designed to go beyond ny benchmark and it is done in all manufacturing where safety is a requirement
Professional evaluations are good, but when it comes to steel matrix and heat treat are next to worthless. You cannot tell anything by holding a product and evaluating it. With knife steel the only real way to determine it's quality is through testing to verify the makers claim. You can however, apply data to a piece of equipment based on the history of similar products from that same manufacturer and derive a somewhat accurate conclussion
prying wood out is a test of strength so it does matter. You cannot determine performance by examination.
all data is important not just certain chosen pieces. Fracture/failure data is crucial
Cobalt
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great answer :jerkit:
Like I said. Show me something with teeth and then I'll take it seriously. Entertainment is one thing.Reality TV is not reality- it's just entertainment.
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