Learning the Hard way (cleaned up)

[BlackyHouston]

I have learned several lessons this week:

Emerson has poor quality control
The Wave feature is probably more suited to smaller folders

When learning to sharpen, should probably practice on an old beater...

Story:

Last week I bought a few knives of which one was my first Emerson and a Lansky sharpening set.
The Emerson is a CQC 8BT which was hard to open and gritty and had lock stick. So as with all my I spent a few days flipping it and working it, then pulled it apart, cleaned everything, NANO lubed the washers and reassembled. Grit was gone, and became very smooth to work and lock stick was gone. However now lock contact is lacking and pivot screw loosens. A little Blue Locktight and pivot pin is good, but liner lock will probably need to be sent in.
Usability: The blade tends to want to deploy too easily when removing from pocket and thought needs to be given each time I reach into that pocket to prevent being bitten. Also, when deployment is wanted, the blade tends to grab outer garments, I think this is a blade size thing.

Sharpening episode.
This happens to be the knife I had in front of me when I decided to try my new Lansky kit.
Problem one... The rubber in the vice jaws kept sliding around
Problem two... Grip and method - ALL ON ME
Problem three... Emerson has NO defined angle from the factory

Result: Started at 20 Degrees - Bad move, really opened up the exposed edge from the black blade and nicked a couple of spots I didn't want to.
Deciding now I have an expensive beater, I moved to 25 degrees on both side and it is now sharper than a mean woman's tongue.

In the end I'll be carrying this as a work knife and will need to send it in to get the lock fixed at some point.

In the back of my mind I'm thinking that a custom lock a scales might make me feel better about it.

 

[jkwithawave]

They have a chisel edge. One side is sharpened 20° ish and the other is flat. Is the flat side where you meant it has no defined angle?

 

[Joe58]

I found out too that if you rebevel your blade to have a standard V edge as opposed to the Emerson chisel, it voids your warrantee. I myself do not care for the chisel edge and had it professionally redone to the more common V type edge.

When I sent in the knife to repair the liner lock from sliding off the blade face with very little spine pressure, they refused to work on it because of this. Told me I voided the warrantee, even though I'd never had it apart or anything and the knife was basically new. I wasn't very happy as I didn't understand what one had to do with the other. Don't carry an Emerson anymore. But many others are very pleased with theirs, which is fine.

 

[jbmonkey]

i think he means it was hand/belt sharpened or whatever the emerson factory does............ so the bevel, like just about every production knife, isn't even in angle. this is one of the curses of sharpening with a fixed angle sharpener. free handed on a belt or whatever sharpened requires adjusting to match the bevel or reprofile.....

i tend to reprofile them when i can't keep them sharp on the sharpmaker anymore. major pain, but it is what it is....

that said....my emersons all seem to come closer to high 20's to 30 plus degrees on the bevel side, and there is a micro bevel on the other side, but i couldn't tell you the angle...maybe 15 degrees? just a guess...

i have maybe 6 emersons and all are no where close to 20 degrees on the bevel side. maybe i got unlucky with who sharpened mine?

 

[Lee D]

It took me a sum total of 2 seconds looking at my first Emerson to realize I was gonna need to sharpen it freehand. Quickly found that the ceramic rods that come with the sharpmaker and a strop will keep an Emerson screaming sharp. As for QC issues, mine are all 2014 knives, and aside from my Traveler being slightly off center outta the box, which I've since fixed, I have no complaints whatsoever..... and if you don't like the wave feature, remove it.

 

[BlackyHouston]

I find the thought that sharpening the blade on my knife would void its warranty absurd!

I haven't Googled it yet, but it would seem to me that the lock would carry an implied liability that any manufacture would stand behind......

 

[Sonnydaze]

Emersons are not for the faint at heart. Ernie makes the knife the way he wants it...NOT the way you want it.
Many folks love 'em; lots do NOT. I've had three.
IMO...wave is a good thing; chisel edge is crap; quality-control is less than the price of the knife; 154cm is prehistoric.
Opinions are worth what you pay for them...

 

[asdf12345]

The production knives don't have the best QC in terms of fit and finish. If you're looking for cost effectiveness as a primary concern it might not be the right knife for you. If you go for fit and finish try out an Emerson custom.

 

[EChoil]

Sounds to me as though you should have been patient with the knife and allowed it break in for a week or two then, if still not satisfied you should have simply returned it for another or a refund.

By the time you took it apart a few times, did your own re-sharpening of a chisel grind incorrectly, probably over-lubed it making the blade limp-noodle now causing the "problems" you note with the wave action (which should eventually self-correct once it gets back closer to the designed friction-set when all YOUR lube works out of it and you re-adjustment the pivot screw back to where it was originally and then leave it alone) and whatever else you did trying to 'fix' it, you're now having a few problems with it.

I give knives a chance to break in a bit no matter how they feel out of the box. It is isn't right after a bit of time and cycling the blade, I might then go into it slowly, a step at a time trying to get it right rather than a full-on frontal assault on every piece of it at once. Or just exchange it if still not right.

If you'll just leave it alone now it may recover at some point and operate as Emerson designed it to do. If you have an unsatisfactory or defective knife (two totally different things) it should have just been returned. I hope it gets back in proper shape for you at some point in the future.

I rarely lube a pivot. A good knife should come from the factory ready to go without needing my own dismantling and tinkering in an unobtainable quest for air-pivot smoothness.

......ESPECIALLY WITH AN EMERSON !!

 

[Lee D]

Well, if this is going to become a math thing, you don't need to add 0 to a number any more than you need to subtract 0 from that same number. As for sharpening a chisel grind, freehand the bevel and strop the backside.... pretty darn simple.

 

[shinyedges]

Ditch the expensive liner lock Emerson and get a zt 0620/0630 framelock with better steel and better customer service.

Emerson voids the warranty if you put a v edge on... that's wack.

Also they charge 14.00 for the lifetime warranty. If its warranted why charge the 14.00??

Zt charges 0.00 for warranty issues because its covered under the warranty. Seems simple to me.

Zt will send screws and other items in the mail for free.

Emerson charges you for screws or clips. Again wack.

I have learned several lessons this week:

Emerson has poor quality control
The Wave feature is probably more suited to smaller folders

When learning to sharpen, should probably practice on an old beater...

Story:

Last week I bought a few knives of which one was my first Emerson and a Lansky sharpening set.
The Emerson is a CQC 8BT which was hard to open and gritty and had lock stick. So as with all my I spent a few days flipping it and working it, then pulled it apart, cleaned everything, NANO lubed the washers and reassembled. Grit was gone, and became very smooth to work and lock stick was gone. However now lock contact is lacking and pivot screw loosens. A little Blue Locktight and pivot pin is good, but liner lock will probably need to be sent in.
Usability: The blade tends to want to deploy too easily when removing from pocket and thought needs to be given each time I reach into that pocket to prevent being bitten. Also, when deployment is wanted, the blade tends to grab outer garments, I think this is a blade size thing.

Sharpening episode.
This happens to be the knife I had in front of me when I decided to try my new Lansky kit.
Problem one... The rubber in the vice jaws kept sliding around
Problem two... Grip and method - ALL ON ME
Problem three... Emerson has NO defined angle from the factory

Result: Started at 20 Degrees - Bad move, really opened up the exposed edge from the black blade and nicked a couple of spots I didn't want to.
Deciding now I have an expensive beater, I moved to 25 degrees on both side and it is now sharper than a mean woman's tongue.

In the end I'll be carrying this as a work knife and will need to send it in to get the lock fixed at some point.

In the back of my mind I'm thinking that a custom lock a scales might make me feel better about it.

 

[BlackyHouston]

Just as a note. .. On Emerson's site, they state they have no idea what the angle is,it is in the hands of the maker of each blade.

 

[Hawk45]

I tried Emersons several times back in the day and just never did it for me. Back when I was a big knife "flicker". Since then I have a newer perspective on knives where I appreciate a buttery knife. I'm glad I did try one because I couldn't be happier. Since then I've picked up a few more.
As mentioned, Emersons aren't for everyone and do have a break-in process. If this isn't something you want to do, you may want to steer clear. I look at is a way to get familiar with the knife. You want to keep your blade tight-ish and break it in. After a few weeks, break it down, clean it (no need for lube) and put it back together. Now it should be butter smooth. If you need a fast opening, you have the wave. These aren't meant to be loose pivot flickers. If you do loosen the pivot to make it "flickable" you are going to get blade movement (up/down/side/side) and cause the lock to wear wrong.

Most of their blades come with a v-grind bevels but a chisel edge. It's not great for slicing, but they get scary sharp real easy on a rod and strop. They aren't fancy, but are purpose built for tough work. Emersons are built as fighting knives, not EDC knives for cutting up apples or slicing paper for S&Gs, that's what Delica's are for.

 

[Lycosa]

OP- Sorry about that. EKI will correct any problem you created.
I think you will come to appreciate the Emerson Way.
rolf

 

[retzius]

Ernie makes the knife the way he wants it...NOT the way you want it.

What does that even mean... Its like answering the question of "why does my knife have issues?" by stating a non-related fact.

If I buy a knife and its built poorly and I ask the maker to fix it and he or she gives that answer I would never buy from them again.

Its like a non-direct way of saying "&*^K off, I don't need your business."

Imagine if you bought a new phone or television or car and one of the buttons didn't function smoothly and you brought it back to the dealer and they said "We build the phone/television/car the way we want it... not how you want it." They would go out of business.

That type of attitude is not tolerated in any other industry. Why is it tolerated in the tacticool knife industry? Is it because "Ernie" is a tough guy who build "combat knives for operators"? What a crock...

 

[Lycosa]

Oh no! ^
You mean Strider, yes??

 

[MatthewSB]

I found out too that if you rebevel your blade to have a standard V edge as opposed to the Emerson chisel, it voids your warrantee. I myself do not care for the chisel edge and had it professionally redone to the more common V type edge.

When I sent in the knife to repair the liner lock from sliding off the blade face with very little spine pressure, they refused to work on it because of this. Told me I voided the warrantee, even though I'd never had it apart or anything and the knife was basically new. I wasn't very happy as I didn't understand what one had to do with the other. Don't carry an Emerson anymore. But many others are very pleased with theirs, which is fine.

Did they fix your lock and charge you for it, offer to replace your blade at your cost and return the knife to factory specifications, or what?

I find the thought that sharpening the blade on my knife would void its warranty absurd!

I haven't Googled it yet, but it would seem to me that the lock would carry an implied liability that any manufacture would stand behind......

This is where I am. I cannot imagine a knife manufacturer not repairing a lock mechanism due to something that was altered on the blade that had no effect on the lock. This would be like a car manufacturer not replacing defective brakes because the owner spraypainted the muffler.

 

[DAVE_M]

That type of attitude is not tolerated in any other industry.

You'v never seen how bad the custom pool cue industry is. I've had two makers stiff me after waiting YEARS to get my cue. Only one of them apologized and refunded me my money.

And if you're speaking of Strider, that's a can of worms on BladeForums.

 

[retzius]

Oh no! ^
You mean Strider, yes??

Don't go there

 

[k_ozdragon]

What does that even mean... Its like answering the question of "why does my knife have issues?" by stating a non-related fact.

If I buy a knife and its built poorly and I ask the maker to fix it and he or she gives that answer I would never buy from them again.

Its like a non-direct way of saying "&*^K off, I don't need your business."

Imagine if you bought a new phone or television or car and one of the buttons didn't function smoothly and you brought it back to the dealer and they said "We build the phone/television/car the way we want it... not how you want it." They would go out of business.

That type of attitude is not tolerated in any other industry. Why is it tolerated in the tacticool knife industry? Is it because "Ernie" is a tough guy who build "combat knives for operators"? What a crock...

That's the Emerson way man. He's a badass, and you better accept that fact lol. I've never understood why these knives are so legendary - especially when I hear stories about them *not* fixing basic warranty issues over some lame excuse time and time again. If I ever wanted an Emerson knife, I'll just buy the ZT version. At least its made better, better materials, modern lock, and by a company that will abide by its promises to their customer.