Leu Custom Kozuka Neck Knife

Trace Rinaldi: if i have offended you in anyway, i apologize. i simply stated what i saw in person. it was not to say you were wrong or anything.
 
Burchtree said:
You're deliberately using another maker's designs and style? I had assumed you had apprenticed under PH or something when I saw your blades. I like to think of the knifemaking community as one that shares and gives, not one that takes. :(
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He basically worshipped Phill for years. His designs are not the same as Phill's, and he can not do all that Phill is capable of at this point. He always acknowledges his influences by Phill and traditional Japanese blades. It has all been done before and to say Pohan is copying someone does not do justice to his attempt to honor Hartsfield. Just because a style of knife is very functional and can outperform most of what is out there, does not mean it should be off limits to all following craftsmen. The first guy who made the wheel should not have expected that the next generation of wheel builders should have to make them with a square profile! If you come up with the best design for performance, it should become the standard the human race should strive for. Otherwise, we would all still be getting around by horse and buggy!
 
Burchtree said:
You're deliberately using another maker's designs and style? I had assumed you had apprenticed under PH or something when I saw your blades. I like to think of the knifemaking community as one that shares and gives, not one that takes. :(
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other than the blade having a point, an edge, being chisel ground, cord wrapped with a turks head knot, what actual design element is there? Phill said it himself in "Mastering the samurai sword" video that people have been making this style for thousands of years. no one bashes the other knifemakers that make in this style that did not consult Hartsfield first. Why is that? if one makes a knife chisel or double ground with cord wrap and turks head knot, he is GUILTY of a hartsfield copy period. Amazes me people are willing to chime in and jugde that dont know the whole story. i am not pointing fingers at anyone and i am simply replying to your post Mr. Burchtree. please do not get offended by my comments. that is not my intention. you appear to be wise
 
Leu Custom said:
other than the blade having a point, an edge, being chisel ground, cord wrapped with a turks head knot, what actual design element is there? Phill said it himself in "Mastering the samurai sword" video that people have been making this style for thousands of years. no one bashes the other knifemakers that make in this style that did not consult Hartsfield first. Why is that? if one makes a knife chisel or double ground with cord wrap and turks head knot, he is GUILTY of a hartsfield copy period. Amazes me people are willing to chime in and jugde that dont know the whole story. i am not pointing fingers at anyone and i am simply replying to your post Mr. Burchtree. please do not get offended by my comments. that is not my intention. you appear to be wise
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Amen!
 
pretty nice website there. The 'testing' videos are pretty cool. I think more makers would benefit by having a feature like that available for viewing.
 
TJL said:
TJL said:
My answer to this is anyone can buy preshaped 1/16" Damascus blade stock and grind an inferior edge on it. A monkey can basically pull that out of his ass. You can not deny the skill and effort it takes to do a zero grind on 3/8" stock. You should know better than most what a bitch that is. If you can not acknowledge this, it is clear you have never worked with anything thicker that 1/8' stock since you claim it is so easy to grind a blade. It is physically impossible for the edge of one of your stock knives to be as sharp as what Pohan Leu grinds. Like I have said before, just do the math. Don't even get me started on the poor edge holding qualities of Damascus that you use on a regular basis!
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When I did do chisel ground blades I used mostly 1/4" stock.. I think 3/8" stock would be stupid thick, and make it cut very poorly which is how the knife demo's looked to me. BTW if you NOTICE in the link I posted the knife there was made from 1/4" A2

You are arguing about things you know nothing about, and your statments keep proving this to be true.

BTW Lycosa I havent taken an order in a few years now, I still have a alot of backlog to finish before I do. I am not in fear of losing business, nor am I trying to garner business here. I was asked questions, and I answered them.
It may not have been what you guys wanted to hear but thats my opinion.

I also understand you guys defending PH blades as you do. If I had a bunch of money invested in them I would want to protect that as well.
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Trace Rinaldi said:
TJL said:
When I did do chisel ground blades I used mostly 1/4" stock.. I think 3/8" stock would be stupid thick, and make it cut very poorly which is how the knife demo's looked to me. BTW if you NOTICE in the link I posted the knife there was made from 1/4" A2

You are arguing about things you know nothing about, and your statments keep proving this to be true.

BTW Lycosa I havent taken an order in a few years now, I still have a alot of backlog to finish before I do. I am not in fear of losing business, nor am I trying to garner business here. I was asked questions, and I answered them.
It may not have been what you guys wanted to hear but thats my opinion.

I also understand you guys defending PH blades as you do. If I had a bunch of money invested in them I would want to protect that as well.
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If you owned a Hartsfield or a Leu, you would come to understand. If I was planning to sell my Hartsfields, I still would not defend them if they were anything less than outstanding. The same with Pohan's blades. Since I am NOT ever selling my Hartsfields, and I could not care less about investment value, I have no motive to promote Phill's work from that angle. Like I said before, I speak only from experience, and I have been around a long time and have owned and made use of most everything. You simply can not bully me into submission with flying B.S. By the way, Pohan can make a 3/8" blade that cuts with the precision of a scalpel. Just because you can't achieve this, does not mean it can't be done. While a 3/8" blade is not advisable for most situations, I assure you that there are applications that you can't even imagine, and that your "survival" knives would not survive.
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I don't even own a Hartsfield anymore!
Trace---it's cool.
Let's back it down, please.
 
Trace Rinaldi said:
Uh yeah you "told" me that PH told you this.. How can anyone know for a "fact" ANYTHING about ALL the knives he has ever produced in his career, do you track them with GPS or something?:rolleyes: I dont even care if its true, Im just pointing out how lame that sounds..
Also your opinion on what REALLY cuts means very little to me after seeing the cutting demo's on your site. I have seen Ginsu knives do better than that at swap meets. I didnt want to get shitty, in fact I was trying to compliment your work. I wont make that mistake again.
You keep right on doing what yer doing, making direct copies of another makers work, and trying to argue your way to success... It sure seems to be working well judging by the for sale area, and how your work is holding value.
I'll keep doing things my way as well, it IS working for me..;)

I dont want to argue with you any longer, I was bored today and should have just kept my mouth shut in the first place. Im sure you will want to turn this into another 18 page PH thread again, calling attention to yourself along the way though. Who knows it might work after a while. Good Luck!

BTW, I just re-read that post.. Thats awesome!! How come the BEST stories of the "single failure" always involve the knife being shot while being carried by a soldier..:D:p:thumbup:
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Wow, i was just about to sell some production stuff to start investing in custom knives...i think i'll hold off on that. I'm used to seeing this in the martial arts community anyway. Petty bickering is the spice of life isn't it? :rolleyes:
 
Lycosa said:
I don't even own a Hartsfield anymore!
Trace---it's cool.
Let's back it down, please.
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I think these are healthy points of view and we all can gain knowledge from sharing our experiences. Besides, you know me R, if I can back up my claims, I won't back down. That warrior thing again.
 
Derek24 said:
Wow, i was just about to sell some production stuff to start investing in custom knives...i think i'll hold off on that. I'm used to seeing this in the martial arts community anyway. Petty bickering is the spice of life isn't it? :rolleyes:
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If you hold off on buying a custom knife, it will just mean you will have to wait all the more longer to discover how great a knife can really be. I just recommend that you go somewhere like Nordic Knives or a big show where you can hold and compare a wide variety of blades before you start buying. Try them all, and decide what is important to you. Flash or performance. It will save you thousands in the long run. Good luck amigo!
 
the plunge might be off but the edge will sure do what it was intended to do! sounds like people dont like the PH style blades because they take little to no time to grind and are priced to high according to them. if you dont like it, dont buy it. damn i have discovered how to make lead into gold but i think i will just keep working my $3.50/hr job because someone else already beat me to it.
 
TJL said:
JTL said:
If you owned a Hartsfield or a Leu, you would come to understand. If I was planning to sell my Hartsfields, I still would not defend them if they were anything less than outstanding. The same with Pohan's blades. Since I am NOT ever selling my Hartsfields, and I could not care less about investment value, I have no motive to promote Phill's work from that angle. Like I said before, I speak only from experience, and I have been around a long time and have owned and made use of most everything. You simply can not bully me into submission with flying B.S. By the way, Pohan can make a 3/8" blade that cuts with the precision of a scalpel. Just because you can't achieve this, does not mean it can't be done. While a 3/8" blade is not advisable for most situations, I assure you that there are applications that you can't even imagine, and that your "survival" knives would not survive.
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Yeah I saw how they worked like a "scalpel" in the vid's... You have never used one of my knives, and yet you claim you know these PL/PH knives perform better than 9999.99% ANY blades out there.. Thats pretty big talk.

You say I cant "achieve" grinding skills that Master Po can.
Ok I got a bet for ya.. I said I can chisel grind a knife, and I can do it any thickness all the way down to zero ground. Whatever..
Ask Master Po if he can full flat grind a 1/4" recurve on both sides of the blade symetrically free hand. Then ask him what is harder to achieve.... Better yet WHY DONT you post a poll in the Bladesmith area asking which is harder to do?? I also use a machine satin finish so they come off the grinder final finished, I dont hand rub out any "flaws or errors" I'll bet ya $50 the outcome will not be in your favor.

Guys, Im all about letting this go, but Im not gonna let some clown shoe thats never stepped behind a grinder talk shit to me without saying something. This guy would have to study hard and take a test to be considered a dimwit.:jerkit:

Keep drinkin the cool aid amigo..
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Trace Rinaldi said:
TJL said:
Yeah I saw how they worked like a "scalpel" in the vid's... You have never used one of my knives, and yet you claim you know these PL/PH knives perform better than 9999.99% ANY blades out there.. Thats pretty big talk.

You say I cant "achieve" grinding skills that Master Po can.
Ok I got a bet for ya.. I said I can chisel grind a knife, and I can do it any thickness all the way down to zero ground. Whatever..
Ask Master Po if he can full flat grind a 1/4" recurve on both sides of the blade symetrically free hand. Then ask him what is harder to achieve.... Better yet WHY DONT you post a poll in the Bladesmith area asking which is harder to do?? I also use a machine satin finish so they come off the grinder final finished, I dont hand rub out any "flaws or errors" I'll bet ya $50 the outcome will not be in your favor.

Guys, Im all about letting this go, but Im not gonna let some clown shoe thats never stepped behind a grinder talk shit to me without saying something. This guy would have to study hard and take a test to be considered a dimwit.:jerkit:

Keep drinkin the cool aid amigo..
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i have no doubt you can outgrind me. i have made only a few flatgrinds :D if you manage to somehow take what i said the wrong way i will seriously have to jump ship :D
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TJL : this quote I found rather " off ":

TJL said:
To truly show amazing grinding skills with the naked, untouched surface is much more impressive. .
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No , getting all surfaces flat , and the same finish , without washing out your grind lines is much much more impressive. But I guess the other 95% of the knifemakers just like to spend time finishing all areas of the knife for no reason.

That is like saying " I built this nice desk from wood I bought at Lowe's , but I didnt bother sanding or finishing it as it is much more impressive to make that way ".

Care to elaborate on your statement ?

Kudos to PH for getting what he gets for his knives , to me , they appear unfinished. His grinds are clean , but taking his stuff to a higher level of finish , would make them more closely match their price in my eyes.

Leu:
As far as your knives being copies of PH's work , I would leave that to PH to decide , though you yourself said he has no love for you as he feels you copy his work , that alone is bad mojo. In this industry copying another makers work , or not coming to a resolution with that maker , can give ya a rep you don't want.

You got skills , hopefully you can come to an agreement with PH , or find a middle ground somehow , and have a healthy , and prosperous knifemaking career.
 
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