Looking for Fairbanks hammer operating manual...

Mike, actually me and my buddy Mitch did all the work for the clutch and brake. If you look at picture 3 we put the wire linkage further up on the angle iron to provide more play in the idler pulley with the same amount of movement on the treadle. So not completely cobbled. :p hehehe

Farmer, I use grease for all of my oil holes other than the 4 on the arms that contain cups for pouring the oil in. I would use grease there too but I would have to take apart the hammer to install zerk fittings. For now I just use gear oil in those. I like grease because I know that there is lube in the parts and it helps to keep the belt oil free.

I'll get you some more pictures on monday or tuesday. Its about all I can do to help, I'm not as smart when it come to fixing up a hammer as Mike and Bruce. :)
 
More work on the hammer rebuild today.
Useful information: 1) The set screw holes into the main shaft bushing go all the way through the bushing and to the main shaft. The set screw could be removed temporarily and the main shaft lubricated through these holes as well as the oil holes. It seems dangerous to the shaft for the design to allow those set screws to go all the way through, but the holes do. 2) The bushings for the main shaft have grooves in them spreading to the front and to the back each way from the oil holes in an attempt to spread the oil. They are low on the bushing though, since the oil holes go down at an angle. Mine are totally impacted with hard oil/dirt. The oil would tend to pool in the bottom of the bushing, even if they are not clogged. 3) The key on the flywheel/crank is definitely larger on the front than in the back, meaning that the key must be punched out from the back of the flywheel/crank after the main shaft has been removed or at least pressed out a distance. 4) There are two holes in the brake ring that are apparently designed to oil the brake ring. They are in the bottom of the ring on the hub at about 5 and 7 o'clock. They are easily plugged and concealed by dirt. Oil is necessary, since the brake ring and drive pulley is just a metal-on-metal contact when the brake is applied. 5) The drive pulley is keyed to the main shaft. There are 4 set screws holding the main shaft to the drive pulley. Two of those screws, one on each side of the pulley, exert pressure directly on the key and the other two hit the shaft itself.

Well, I finally was able to get the main shaft out today. Using the porta power straight through the back on the end of the main shaft, while rotating the flywheel/crank to free the shaft, is definitely the best way I have found. I kept squirting lubricant through the oil holes, the set screw hole and every crack I could find. After the shaft moved out about 6 inches, it became free. I would guess the flywheel and main shaft weigh about 100 pounds and the drive pulley is not far from that by itself. The shaft is worn and scoured, and so are the bushings. I assume most of the problem is a lack of lubrication coupled with the open oil holes allowing dirt into the shaft/bushing area.
 
Robert,

Sorry to have not answered... just got back from three days of helping with a small knife forging/building class at John Strohecker and Dave Banks shop in Riverton, Wyo.

I'll take as many pictures of this as you can stand to put up... I'd love to see them all.

I'd really like to see pics of this whole set up from your post... 1) The set screw holes into the main shaft bushing go all the way through the bushing and to the main shaft. The set screw could be removed temporarily and the main shaft lubricated through these holes as well as the oil holes. It seems dangerous to the shaft for the design to allow those set screws to go all the way through, but the holes do. 2) The bushings for the main shaft have grooves in them spreading to the front and to the back each way from the oil holes in an attempt to spread the oil. They are low on the bushing though, since the oil holes go down at an angle.

Asking because it doesn't sound like what Bruce and I are used to on our 50#'s. On mine (rear drive pulley), there are angled set screws keeping the bushings from turning and threaded holes (1/2" fine, if I'm remembering right) for grease cups on top of the bushing journels. Our hammer didn't have grease cups so I drilled a hole through a 1" bolt and fit a grease zerk in it. Could use a longer bolt but would need a lock nut on it to keep it from moving down to the bushing. Other grease zerks on our machine are idler nose and pitman arm.

Sid figured out a long time ago that bar chain oil was the oil to use... sticky as all get out so it stays on a chainsaw bar. Buying it by the gallon is the way to do it... oiler with a flex tip and thumb pump is handy. "Bear" uses waste oil he picks up at the dump... uses A LOT of it. Part of the thing about oil is, it flushes the wear surfaces as more is added where grease tends to hold abrasives. I really don't know if it was lack of grease zerks when originally designed or if the oil holes are part of the greater design... one of the reasons I'm looking for an operating manual.
---------------------------------------------------

See you got the disc drive and shaft out. Good lick. It will go back in a lot easier than it came out, I'll bet you anything... =]
 
Robert & Dan...

Do you have the Barbour Stockwell Company catalog? I thought maybe it was reprinted in Doug Freund's book(s) but am wondering if maybe not. If either of you want it, get in touch with Keri. There is a parts picture page and, if you ask, Keri has a parts numbers/names page, also. There is quite a bit of information on machine set up in the catalog.

Mike
 
Mike, I do have a copy of the catalog and I did receive the pictures. I'll post them up here for you tomorrow. I sure hope your hammer is cleaner than in the pictures or I'll have to report you for hammer abuse! :p

As for the pictures you don't need a paid membership here. I use photobucket to host my images even though I could use bladeforums; but I'll still post them for you. :)

As for grease holding abrasives, that's just another reason to add more grease to help flush out the crud. I use a red grease so I know when the dirty grease is gone. Plus I grease before starting the hammer, and every 2-3 hours as I work. Grease is cheap, replacement parts for my hammer are not.
 
Hey Guys. I will figure the picture thing out and get some on here. When I try to make them lower resolution, they still are too large of files. I know that would be much better than just descriptions. I have thought about it some more, and I will probably post a separate thread about the rebuild, when it is all over, complete with pictures. However, I will try to get at least some for now. I hope some of the "useful information" is indeed useful to someone.
 
Robert, I guarantee you this info will be useful!!
You're a good man to share this stuff with everyone. You too Dan and Mike!!
 
It's sure your call, Robert. I understand the topic title doesn't lead a person to believe it would be a thread about rebuilding a hammer. Maybe linking the new one you propose to this one would help, I don't know.

I agree with Bruce in you and Dan doing a really nice thing for hammer owner's... not just Fairbanks owners. The Little Giant owners have a great help in both the Little Giant book and access to Sid and Keri. Most other hammer owners are on their own excepting for what cross referencing can be done. Given that all the hammers with similar form/function type, Fairbanks, Little Giant, Meyer, etc. are directly related (without coming a foul of patents, all are knock offs of a Fairbanks), the Little Giant book and people are very helpful but it's still an on your own thing.

Do you have access to the catalog I mentioned, Robert?

Mike
 
Mike, Yes I have the catalog material. Bruce mailed it to me. Thanks buddy. I tried quickly to figure out how to post pictures, but I couldn't figure it out. Anyone have the quick and dirty info on that?
 
Farmer, create a photobucket account. Upload them there and then just copy the IMG code and paste it into your post. :) If you need help with any of it let me know.
 
Dan Seaver said:
I sure hope your hammer is cleaner than in the pictures or I'll have to report you for hammer abuse! :p
Click to expand...

Oh, there's a little crude still on the ol' girl. I hauled a bucket of it off, though. All the parts needing work got cleaned well... down to bare metal, the original dark gray primer coat or black finish coat... whatever was underneath the grime. I literally scraped or chipped off 3/4" of oil/grease caked scale and coal dust in some places.

Not to be disparaging, Daniel, but I have never figured nice rims and a sound system was the highest priority on a prideful ride... =]

Mike
 
Mike Krall said:
Oh, there's a little crude still on the ol' girl. I hauled a bucket of it off, though. All the parts needing work got cleaned well... down to bare metal, the original dark gray primer coat or black finish coat... whatever was underneath the grime. I literally scraped or chipped off 3/4" of oil/grease caked scale and coal dust in some places.

Not to be disparaging, Daniel, but I have never figured nice rims and a sound system was the highest priority on a prideful ride... =]

Mike
Click to expand...

No... but washing your ride once a century is necessary. :p Hehehe

Pixor time!

Mike's hammer.
FB1.jpg

FB5.jpg

FB9.jpg
 
Hey Guys, thanks for posting the pics. That really helps me with considering how to convert to a low and back motor mount. I will get some pics up soon. I opened the photobucket account, and I just need to upload some pics.
 
farmer12888 said:
Hey Guys, thanks for posting the pics. That really helps me with considering how to convert to a low and back motor mount. I will get some pics up soon. I opened the photobucket account, and I just need to upload some pics.
Click to expand...

Looking forward to the pictures, Robert...

The jackshaft-type mount on our hammer has feet near the four mounting bolts. They are a work-around for the hammer frame not being flat/square. Shims can be placed under the feet to align the motor-shaft/jackshaft shaft with the hammer shaft. You may know this, but... flat belt pulleys (those without flanges) need to run parallel, or nearly so, to keep the belt on. In the pics of our hammer, the motor pulley's Z axis and the hammer shaft Z axis have been shimmed parallel. The reason being, a flat belt will walk off the closer ends of flange-less pulleys that are out of parallel very much.

Another thing about flat belt pulleys... the crown is 1/8" in 12" for almost all types, with some (not on these hammers) being a little more than that. They need to be at least 1" to 2" longer than the belt is wide.

It's probably obvious, but belt width less than spec (2 1/2" on a 50#), like 2 1/8" for example, gives up 17% of surface area. The motor in the picture is an 1140rpm Baldor 3hp. The original rpm for the hammer is 900rpm, with an original driving pulley diameter spec. of 5". By putting a 4" flat belt pulley on the 1140rpm motor, the 375 beats-per-minute 50# spec. is met... but with a loss of about 25% of belt-on-driving-pulley square inches. For a machine specifically designed to clutch through a slipping belt, the amount of belt surface area on both pulleys will have an effect on hammer function.

I'm going to go take a little bite out of Daniels butt... =]

Mike
 
Last edited:
Dan Seaver said:
No... but washing your ride once a century is necessary. :p Hehehe
Click to expand...

OK, puppy... here's how this goes...

As I worked down through the years in layers of cake, I started thinking about the remnant history of it... artifact of every thing this hammer had ever done... places, times, ways, and it's people. Patina is a reverance, regardless of type... layers of hand prints, one on another... a string in time, and a reminder... a thing reflecting back to you, your humanity and it's unbreakable ties.

You have a good day and life, Daniel... I'm enjoying knowing you.

Mike
 
Last edited:
Wow, that's a little too deep for me. :o Mine was clean when I got it so I never went though that experience; but that makes absolute sense.

Bruce, most of his hammer is very clean except the very top. That's the part I was joking about. :)

Farmer, thanks for informing us and getting pictures. We need all the information we can get on our hammers. :thumbup::thumbup:
 
Mike, thanks for the belt and mount info. I'm going to need a bunch of info to make the switch. That whole patina thing sounds like antiques road show on PBS. I'm going totally clean to the metal with mine. The old girl deserves a new outfit!
First off, a little somewhat useful info. The anvil is not a solid block, so resist a blow, especially down low, with your sledge. I noticed what appears to be a patched area on mine, and when I was running the angle grinder with a wire brush over the anvil today, I detected a strange tone near the holes on each side. I stuck my finger in, and the metal is about 4 inches thick. Apparently, the anvil is a heavy shell. I haven't been able to get my anvil out - yes, I have been trying to remove the anvil - and tonight I noticed a broken bolt inside a hole down low in front of the anvil. Tomorrow, I am going to try to remove the bolt with an easy out.

You may ask why I am trying to remove the anvil, and the answer is that it is the only piece left on the frame. I have taken every other part off the hammer. I am going to take "clean" to a whole new level in the pictures I am going to post for you guys.

I had a stuck lower die in the hammer. Some gorilla had beat it in. I hammered and hammered with a long piece of metal through the hole in the hammer, on the wedges, and they would not move. Then, I realized that since both wedges were put in from the front, I could hit the die with a sledge and drive it back, rather than trying to drive the wedges forward. It worked like a champ, and the die came flying out. Nice trick to remember, if the wedges are both put in from that direction.

I spent a few hours this evening wearing out a cup wire brush on my angle grinder on the frame of the hammer and the anvil. It is starting to look good.

I realized tonight that I would have to put a bushing in my drive pulley to mount it outside the frame, since the shaft is smaller in diameter on the back of the hammer than the thicker shaft where the drive pulley mounted inside the yokes. The flanges on my drive pulley are also considerably bigger across than the little donut-looking flange that is on the back of my hammer around the shaft. The drive pulley shouldn't really be rubbing on that flanges, but the flanges are machined surfaces on the drive pulley and the yokes.
 
farmer12888 said:
Mike, thanks for the belt and mount info. I'm going to need a bunch of info to make the switch. That whole patina thing sounds like antiques road show on PBS. I'm going totally clean to the metal with mine. The old girl deserves a new outfit!
First off, a little somewhat useful info. The anvil is not a solid block, so resist a blow, especially down low, with your sledge. I noticed what appears to be a patched area on mine, and when I was running the angle grinder with a wire brush over the anvil today, I detected a strange tone near the holes on each side. I stuck my finger in, and the metal is about 4 inches thick. Apparently, the anvil is a heavy shell. I haven't been able to get my anvil out - yes, I have been trying to remove the anvil - and tonight I noticed a broken bolt inside a hole down low in front of the anvil. Tomorrow, I am going to try to remove the bolt with an easy out.

You may ask why I am trying to remove the anvil, and the answer is that it is the only piece left on the frame. I have taken every other part off the hammer. I am going to take "clean" to a whole new level in the pictures I am going to post for you guys.

I had a stuck lower die in the hammer. Some gorilla had beat it in. I hammered and hammered with a long piece of metal through the hole in the hammer, on the wedges, and they would not move. Then, I realized that since both wedges were put in from the front, I could hit the die with a sledge and drive it back, rather than trying to drive the wedges forward. It worked like a champ, and the die came flying out. Nice trick to remember, if the wedges are both put in from that direction.

I spent a few hours this evening wearing out a cup wire brush on my angle grinder on the frame of the hammer and the anvil. It is starting to look good.

I realized tonight that I would have to put a bushing in my drive pulley to mount it outside the frame, since the shaft is smaller in diameter on the back of the hammer than the thicker shaft where the drive pulley mounted inside the yokes. The flanges on my drive pulley are also considerably bigger across than the little donut-looking flange that is on the back of my hammer around the shaft. The drive pulley shouldn't really be rubbing on that flanges, but the flanges are machined surfaces on the drive pulley and the yokes.
Click to expand...

The dovetail on the top of the sow block (technically, the die block) is parallel sided. But the dovetail sides and the sow block sides are not parallel. The dovetail is pivoted on it's mid point at 1/8" per 12" (0 deg.-36 min.). The other two female dove tails are not parallel sided. The back edge (to the frame) of the anvil dovetail has a 1/8" per 12" taper, wider on the right side, and the front edge is "square". The female dovetail on the hammer is the same but the back edge is square and front edge tapered. All the male dovetails are parallel sided and square. All the die keys are 1/8" per 12" tapers and have "proper dimensions" for end width and height as well as length. The double dovetail holding the sow block to the anvil is designed to tighten and remove the die keys from the front and go in with the tapers opposed. It shouldn't make a difference which side the innies and outties are put in but I'd tend to mark the keys original position, both to which side and to up/down because they've been seated that way and probably have opposing corners relieved to not foul the corners of the die/dovetail. The dies are supposed to have a 0.025" space underneath... that is, the dies seat on the flats, not on the dovetail bottoms (like LG's and most others). Oh, the dovetail sides are 5deg. tapers.

The design of the dovetails lets a person adjust upper and lower hammer die alignment. The hammer die goes on the hammer square to the sides. The sow block/anvil dovetail adjusts left/right and the sowblock/lower hammer die dovetail adjusts front/back.

Robert, I get the first part of the second hi-light, but I'm lost on the last part. If you can make time to get the pictures up, run it by me again, please. Otherwise, I'll wait and see it... =]

If you look at the picture of our hammer, the one showing the drive pulley, you'll see the gib key and bolts holding the drive pulley on. I'm figuring you are going to need both. The gib key is going to have to fit right... just short of an interference fit on the sides.

Mike
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top