Mick Strider has some explaining to do.

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When I went to bed last night it had been quite awhile that there had been no posts in this thread. It looked like maybe things were going to stop, or at least slow down until Spark came up with more pertinent information. Seems that is not the case.
 
Maybe we should have petitioned Mr. Carson to share some of that wisdom here with us in this thread back on page ten. We could have avoided this.

If you have been watching and shaking your head no or bowing it wondering how we came to be in this firestorm lets agree that everyone has said their peace at this point. The only way to let a fire die folks is to stop throwing logs on it.

I wish you all the best, and you too Mick.

Readers. If you want it to die end it. No more logs.

STR
 
People, please keep in mind that neither Mr. Boats nor Mr. Carson are the subject of this thread.

I will, however, say that it is not helpful when Mr. Boats changes his mind saying that his reasons for doing so (reasons that might be helpful to some of the rest of us) are posted on another site that many of us can not read.
 
Gollnick said:
People, please keep in mind that neither Mr. Boats nor Mr. Carson are the subject of this thread.

I will, however, say that it is not helpful when Mr. Boats changes his mind saying that his reasons for doing so (reasons that might be helpful to some of the rest of us) are posted on another site that many of us can not read.
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EXACTLY! You are correct Sir. :thumbup:
 
He posted a sincere apology for taking part in this. That's all that needs to be said.
 
its sad that this has come to this. the only question i have, is has spark confronted mick to his face about this, or is it all an internet thing?
 
To his face? What, you expect me to fly out to California to ask someone if they are telling the truth when they make an outrageous claim online, one that federal sentencing guidelines proves not only impossible but not even plausible?

You are kidding me, right? I'm utterly amazed by what lengths people will go to rationalize their double standards and justify their hypocrisy.
 
Spark said:
To his face? What, you expect me to fly out to California to ask someone if they are telling the truth when they make an outrageous claim online, one that federal sentencing guidelines proves not only impossible but not even plausible?

You are kidding me, right? I'm utterly amazed by what lengths people will go to rationalize their double standards and justify their hypocrisy.
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why are you getting so upset. it was a simple question that i was just wondering. i was not planning a response, but so many questions were answered, and i was just wondering if a face to face encounter had accoured and how that went. sorry to hit a nerve with you. i figured somebody as big in the knife community as you would go to a few knife shows where the strider guys where, but i guess i was wrong. i just know that if im going to take the hours, and i can't imagine how many you have put into this, to try to find answers, that the best place to start would be to ask them in person. but i guess your never around them so everythings cool. again im sorry for striking a nerve with you with my question.
 
It's ok, I just wanted to put it out there about how ridiculous that sounded.

You know, it's been seven days since I posted this thread online. Seven days where I've heard a wide spectrum of responses. Some questioned my motives, some my intentions, some my integrity. Some were thankful, some were shocked. Some were derisive, or openly hateful.

At the end of this, the only result is that Mick Strider isn't answering anything and refusing to even answer questions on his own forums. I've yet to be served with any legal response, not even a cease & desist, which tells me a lot. Mick Strider's been given every opportunity to correct any flawed information, and give his side of the story.

Boats made an apology for his statements, and got derided by the same fans who were preaching forgiveness and saying "oh, it's not a big deal". I've had a couple members say they'll never be back, some of whom are reading this thread right now. I've had more than a few thank me for bringing this information up, or putting it all in one spot.

In the end, the facts speak for themselves. I've accomplished what I set out to do, specificly I've raised my doubts on the credibility of stories we've been told. I said this publicly, and gave him an opportunity to respond. You all have to make your own decisions as to what to do with this information.

To the haters: Doing the right thing has never been easy, or popular. It's easy to light the torches and shake the pitchforks when you are part of a mob. It's a lot tougher to stand up and say "This is wrong" when you see something that bothers you.
 
Spark said:
To the haters: Doing the right thing has never been easy, or popular. It's easy to light the torches and shake the pitchforks when you are part of a mob. It's a lot tougher to stand up and say "This is wrong" when you see something that bothers you.
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Ummmm... thread closed?
 
Nous: I really don't know what else can be said at this point. I've made my point. Anyone who wants to continue the discussion can feel free. Like I said, if anyone can provide documentation that disproves anything I've said, please post it and I'll correct the wrong areas immediately. Otherwise, what's left?
 
cdixon said:
i figured somebody as big in the knife community as you would go to a few knife shows where the strider guys where, but i guess i was wrong.
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You were NOT wrong. Spark has been at shows that were also attended by the Strider guys in the last 2 years since this stuff came up. There was plenty of opportunity for him to address it if he chose to. Of course, the only thing he is REALLY interested in is the Mogadishu issue....which he only just found out about.... but from his posting on the pownetwork.org site, you would never know that.

i just know that if im going to take the hours, and i can't imagine how many you have put into this, to try to find answers, that the best place to start would be to ask them in person.
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Seems reasonable to a lot of us... but aparently not all...

but i guess your never around them so everythings cool.
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Again, not true.


Spark said:
At the end of this, the only result is that Mick Strider isn't answering anything and refusing to even answer questions on his own forums.
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No Spark, it means he isn't answering anything.... to you. Once again you are SPECULATING and trying to force your speculations and assumptions down everyone elses throat. Some will swallow, some wont.

I've yet to be served with any legal response, not even a cease & desist, which tells me a lot.
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It tells you something, based on your speculation of how you would LIKE someone to act....and your preconceived notions of what is a correct response *to you*. What it tells ME is that maybe he doesn't find you important enough to bother with. Now see, that is what is cool about SPECULATION. We can all speculate different things. It's similar to opinions. Everyone has their own speculations about given events. Some people are content to let others form their own opinions and speculations. Some feel a need to force their speculations and opinions on others.

Mick Strider's been given every opportunity to correct any flawed information, and give his side of the story.
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To you? Why would he? Who are you in the scheme of things Spark? You own a knifeshop and a forum. Are you that big a player in this industry? I can't remember the last time I've seen so many REPUTABLE knife makers get together to wholly DENOUNCE something as I have seen here. And they aren't denouncing Mick. They are denouncing this whole disaster, and the person who propogated it.

Boats made an apology for his statements, and got derided by the same fans who were preaching forgiveness and saying "oh, it's not a big deal".
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Boats is well aware that to go to Badlands at the point he did, that he would not be unanimously received with open arms and that he would be open to derision and criticism for his actions. He sacked up and did it anyway. That's admirable.

In the end, the facts speak for themselves. I've accomplished what I set out to do, specificly I've raised my doubts on the credibility of stories we've been told. I said this publicly, and gave him an opportunity to respond. You all have to make your own decisions as to what to do with this information.
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Again you assume that if he is not responding TO YOU, he is not responding. Speculation again.

To the haters: Doing the right thing has never been easy, or popular. It's easy to light the torches and shake the pitchforks when you are part of a mob. It's a lot tougher to stand up and say "This is wrong" when you see something that bothers you.
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Don't know if you are including me in this group, but for the record, I'm not a "hater". I actually feel badly for you at this point Spark. This could have been handled with so much more decorum and civility. I have to assume that when you started this you thought either (a) you were doing the right thing, and were blinded by your self-rightousness; or (b) you thought your plan was bullet proof; .... because I can't imagine you risking everything on this endeavor if you didn't feel one of the above two things.

Time will tell on both (a) and (b). While to 99% of the people contributing in here it was like a sport, to join in the pile-on, for you, there's a lot more at stake.

My hope for you is that you get what you deserve. It will either be wonderous glory and vindication, or professional suicide. I don't "hope" for one or the other. I simply hope that justice will prevail.

I would like to close by saying that Kit Carson is a wonderful person and we all could be benefitted by having counsel such as he has to give. Not just about knives (tho he is a supurb knifemaker) but also about how to be a decent human being. We could all learn a lot from him, myself included. I, for one, am going to keep working on that.

I wont bother you any more with my posts.

m1
p.s. I WILL state that the fact you haven't banned me, despite the fact I have been one of the most vocal protestors in this whole thing has left me surprised and impressed. I thank you for that. Take care.... in all things.
 
For someone who is so vocal about speculation, you sure do a lot of your own. You speculate I've been waiting for 2 years, but it's been 9 or 10 days since I first read the Somalia claim, past that my experience with this issue has been tangental at best. Unlike McClung et al, I wasn't on the distribution list when this stuff first came out. Furthermore, I didn't even start the Cold Steel thread that caused me to sign up on Badlands and read Mick Strider's words for myself. So, your snide remarks about not taking action for 2 years fall way short of the mark.

Regardless, never let it be said that I kept you from giving your side of the story. No matter how hypocritical it may be. Please don't lecture me on self-righteousness, especially with your double standards.

Who am I? I'm just a vet, who served honorably. I'm just a man that recognized a lie when I read it, and said so. You can be as preachy and offended as you wish, but that doesn't change the facts: Mick Strider's claims don't add up.

As for pile on's, well, we've got two different opinions of what they are, but that's neither here nor there. Regardless, the questions remain.

Best of luck to you, Michelle.
 
I personally think the last thing that Mick would want would be someone walking up to him at a knife show and asking about the questions that were raised at the beginning of this thread. I think he would be more likely to tell you to go screw yourself than he would be to give you the information that you inqured about. I know that would be my likely reaction if I was in his position.
 
Well, since the thread didn't die I can think of something else to add to at least think about.

The last thing Mick suggested to his fans before taking leave of the internet was to "kill them with kindness." This was excellent advice and everyone agreed in harmony. Even the Admin guys where it was posted. Then I get a heads up they are makings lists to ban those with opposing views and opinions to theirs which seems contrary to that advice in my opinion.

I got along over there on the other forum. Maybe not as well as some did and maybe I never would have but I loved the USN. And it hurt me to resign. For what its worth I'll miss you guys even if you won't miss me. I particularly loved the fact that Ernie Emerson and Chuck Bybee invited me to join there at around the same time. This happened around the time Ernie was checking me out to give me permission to do Wave mods for you members folders that had been asking me to do it for you. How ironic is that? I'm the only guy on the planet with permission from Ernie to do that and I can't even view his forum now. (yeah I know he has one here and on the KF, but those are dead compared to there) All because I caught wind of the fact that I was going to be removed for having an opposing view to the party line that came out in this thread. Now some of you may think, what does this have to do with this topic?

I have a point believe me. When Mick was the one a while back doing the calling out. Then the fans all saw it as "the good fight'' and Mick was just in his actions. But now when Spark is the one doing the calling out and it happens to be Mick he called on its not viewed the same way for some reason and everyone is fighting about it. This fighting and bickering in my opinion and the hasty emotional reactions back and forth are more of an overall irritant to me personally than anything Mick has ever done.

I felt a lot of this thread was worthless drivel. I'm sure most of you agree. But much of it is very well thought out memorable stuff that I'm glad we had the chance to air out. I didn't really lean one way or the other in my opinion of Mick or Strider and tried to remain as neutral as I could all the way up to my post on page 72 which was mostly because I was still dealing with losing a forum I really liked having access to. I'll be the first to admit I was leaning about 55/45 that it was looking pretty bad for Mick.

Anyway, thats my only real complaint over this. If you have lost something out of this also because of a different opinion to a friend over it, look at that for the lesson you can take from it and ask yourself if it is really necessary that we agree on every page of every issue to be able to get along around here. Its new territory for me to deal with this because some I called friends won't even return my emails now and to me that is not anything to do with forgiveness or killing with kindness or understanding. That is so Nazi tasting to me that it stinks.

STR
 
Alright. I am going to try and add some newly gained persepective.

First of all, we don't need to act like we were raised by wolves. I was by far the worst offender of that notion present in this thread.

I am apologizing to everyone who will listen.

I've been in multiple conversations with all kinds of people over this, from my boss, to total strangers.

First thing I'll say is that retaliation is petty and just perpetuates things. The entire internet would go dark if everyone who ever posted from work got fired over it. I didn't get fired, if anyone was hoping that happened. See, the same thing happens with me that happens with folks such as Mick Strider--the people who know me cut me some slack for the doings of my alter ego.

People who know Mick are free to do the same and probably have. Mick just doesn't use a handle.

So maybe he has said some things that don't add up when you pick at them too hard? Who hasn't?

So outting isn't what shut me down on this. It couldn't have. Had I gotten in "real life" trouble, I'd still have all of the tools, enough in the bank, and even way more time, to have pursued this matter to the ends of the freakin' earth.

The handful of people out there who have tried to retaliate against me in real life should really rethink their impulses. Not about me, but about maybe someone else down the road who won't stop and reflect regardless of the motive, and who would redouble their efforts just to spite you or the person you are thinking you are "helping out."

I could certainly see someone else getting harrassed for having been in an internet dogpile getting fired and NEVER GIVING IT UP. I could easily have been that person, but I choose to not be any further than I have.

You see, I had Kit Carson counseling me and the next guy might not. Making an opponent into a multi-level diehard would make this thread look like a game of patty cake.

Wise up. I did.

You can beleive it or not, but it was Kit Carson who brought me to heel, reminding me that I, in fact, am not an animal, even when I was in the middle of acting like one.

Mr. Carson will have to excuse me for dishing a little, but our communication was only a little bit about Mr. Strider, and a lot more about him, and a lot more about me. He didn't just waltz in, as some suspect, and merely give me only another "Mick's my buddy, isn't that good enough for you?" endorsement. That wasn't working on me, and in fact, that kind of thing doesn't work outside of personal circles. You think Presidents Bush or Clinton are hated deeply by many of the people they've actually known on a personal level? No, the legendary hate of those two men grew through mailings real and electronic, not from personal rancor. Who cares what the people who actually know them think about them? No one, or neither of them would fuel the neverending internet bile about them.

Back to Mr. Carson. He took the time to really read a lot of my posts from before this fight took off and reminded me that what was going on in this thread was not what I had been about on these forums before I had jumped in.

I had been here for entertainment, a diversion, even a diversion from the workday,;) but I hadn't been here trying to examine people with a microscope and rubber gloves on.

He knew that because he has done the same thing, piling on, being a major component of a mud-slinger, to tell me that I'd probably regret it when it came to an end. When you forget why you were here, when you lose sight of why you are a part of something, and you pervert it, you'll live to regret it even if nothing else comes of it.

I know I do.

What is there to life, even the life of an online alter ego, if all you are left standing amid is a bunch of burning wreckage?

Threads such as this one are like radioactive fallout. Fallout covers everything. It contaminates everything. It persists. It travels where the wind blows, and no one can really stop it on their own.

Everyone can get sick from it. Everyone has to clean it up and decontaminate things to make life liveable again.

This forum doesn't need nuclear level bombast. Neither does any other forum. People should be able to enjoy their time here, be members and enjoy USN without ridicule, and everyone can have their damn secrets as long as no one is getting hurt.

We shouldn't be into mutually assured destruction.

It's an internet knife board. It shouldn't ever be about life and death struggle with each other, no matter the self-declared provocation.

Spark, lay it down.

Everyone else? Please take a moment and reflect whether a never ending series of these moments is really what you want part of your hobby to be about.

I played with fire and a lot of people are feeling burned by it.

It wasn't worth it. Mr. Carson is right. All you really feel is a variant of "What in the hell was I thinking when I got started in this."

Don't make my mistake folks. You'll just feel hollow, even if you think you've "won," whatever the hell "winning" means to you.

No one 'WINS' this kind of thing. It just feeds on itself.

Mr. Mickey Ray Strider? I apologize to you sir, here, as publically as I can make it within the knife enthusiast community. You did nothing to me to make me some self-appointed Inquisitor. I will never say a cross word about you again.

Folks, please let me be the final word in this thread.
 
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