New WSK TRACKER hits market

Allen242 said:
No Aaron I don't work for TOPS, but I'm good friends with Mike Fuller and they make some of my knife designs. I build equipment for knife makers (grinders, tables, jigs, etc) and supply charitable and non-profit groups with custom knives for fundraisers.
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Cool, you seem to be plugged in and I wanted to thank you for your support on some of the other threads we have crossed paths on. So if I pay for this knife I won on ebay, you think it will I ever receive it?
 
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These guys really like TOPS knives. Did Mike Fuller sub his designs out. They got the Tom Braun and Kelly Warden "Scorpions Claw" too
 
does this really matter? the people who buy this crap aren't going to spend the money to buy the real thing anyway. so it really doesn't effect TOPS. take for example nock-off pocket books. my wife would never spend $700 for a real Gucci bag, but will spend $100 for a fake. its the same with these knives. in the grand scheme of things it doesn't really affect Tops. I personally like the fact that Tom Brown has a little bit of Karma coming his way.
 
I'm with you on this one hkhunter. Does it matter? Maybe it should be a red flag that says the price of our product is too high. Maybe sell more at a lower price and capture your profit by volume.
 
Trentu, the thing is, when you sell goods at a net LOSS per unit sold, you don't make any profit no matter how many you sell.... in fact, the more you sell, the more you LOOSE.

The USA has the 2nd highest labour costs in the world. One way US companies lower their prices to compete with cheaper goods made in low wage countries is to close heir US factories and have their goods made in the same low wage countries who rip them off. Who does this hurt? The people who used to work in manufacturing in the USA. Take a look at the Etch-A-Sketch product as one example.

Fake products do hurt the makers of real products, damage their markets, their Brand value and ultimately hurt the employees who make the real deal merchandise. People who buy fake good should know this.

The Chinese have a much different view of intelectual property than ours in the West. This is a cultural tradition in China. The combination of this Chinese tradition of copying things they like combined with the incredibly aggressive capitalism dominating China today is a real problem for the entire world. Solving this problem will be a tremendous challenge for people and politicians in the coming years.

Western consumers today should know they aren't doing themselves or their economies any favors by buying counterfeit goods.
 
if someone isn't willing to spend $250 on the TOPS WSK, but is willing to spend $80 on the nock-off, that does not affect TOPS in anyway. they wearn't going to purchase the knife anyway. if TOPS wants to target these buyers they should send there knives out to be made. TOPS is targeting the guy who wants a good knife, but doesn't have the money for a custom made knife. so, does it really matter? I say no.
 
Unfortunately your guess is wrong, as anyone in the industry can tell you. Knockoffs do hurt sales of the originals, very significantly.
 
I'm not guessing ,I think I'm speaking for most people who work hard for their money. If your a married middle class man, ask you wife if she would spend $600 for a Gucci pocket book. then ask her if she would spend $100 for a good nock-off. I bet 9/10 would say no to the first as yes to the latter. if that's the case, how is Gucci losing money? how many people do you think are going to drop $10,000 on a Rolex? not many, but i bet the people who want the Rolex and can't ever afford it buys a replica for $100. so Rolex is miising out on all the sales they were never going to get anyway?
 
You may not be guessing but you're certainly totally wrong on every point you make.

Ever thought about why the BRAND you want is so important? Why is a Gucci pocket book more desirable than a non-Gucci one? One hint: Quality is not the answer you're looking for.

Why do you think companies like Rolex and Gucci spend substantial sums fighting product counterfeiting?

And no, I'm going to answer these questions for you.
 
so your say if someone made a replica of a Ashton Martin DB7 and sold it for $20,000 it would affect Ashton Martins sales of the DB7? the people with money are still going to buy the real thing (its a status thing) while the poor bastards that can't afford the real thing will buy the fake. its like me wanting a roger linger WSK, but I can't afford the $700 so I buy a Predator instead. is my purchase going this hurt Rogers sales? no because I didn't have the money in the first place to buy from him. now this Chinese WSK might pull a small amount of potential TOPS buyers away, but its really going to get the buyers TOPS was never going to get. the fact that its such a blatant rip-off is wrong, but what if a Chinese company came out this a close look alike and labeled it a survival knife? that might hurt Tops more. most smart people see this knife for what it is, a cheap nock-off. it will be a big hit for high school & poor college students looking for a WSK.
 
This thread is starting to go a different direction than I originally intended, but I think it does make an interesting debate.
Personally I believe an Exact Copy with Marketing posing the product as the Original is a crime on the public. I do believe and support EVOLUTION of a design and answering a call to market demands.
Stamping a BRANDED name on a product that are knock offs, replicas, are CRIMINAL.
That company built their brand, product and reputation. They do not deserve to lose in their efforts. That is Pirating Activity and wrong. I do not support it.
American Manufacturing costs are highly inflated and to stay competitive will need a major overhaul. Just ask the automotive industry guys. We American's price ourselves right out of many deals. But at least we have our Ego's. You can see this being evident in the financial growth of many nations and the technology advances. They are gaining on the US. We set the bar and now everyone is starting to catch up. The question we should be asking ourselves is how do we maintain the advancement of financial resources and technology to remain the world dominant leader. We are sliding and the manufacturing industry is just an early indictator of things to come.
 
hkhunter said:
if someone isn't willing to spend $250 on the TOPS WSK, but is willing to spend $80 on the nock-off, that does not affect TOPS in anyway. they wearn't going to purchase the knife anyway. if TOPS wants to target these buyers they should send there knives out to be made. TOPS is targeting the guy who wants a good knife, but doesn't have the money for a custom made knife. so, does it really matter? I say no.
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The knock off on ebay was sold for around $200, not $80. So whoever bought it could have easily shelled out another $20 to $30 for the real deal. The person who buys knockoffs may think that they are getting a good deal, however when you look at the thousands of people who buy them, it is hurting our economy (everyone) as a whole.
 
E-mailed the guy (xm2005) selling them and he said that there was only a few of the Trackers made and he is out (5). He sounded like they were a trial run. Anyway they will no longer be available.
 
It's called selling the sizzle off of someone else's steak. It's wrong, unlawful, unacceptable, but everpresent. Unfortunately, it's also sometimes not practical to pursue unless one entity can be isolated as a target for restitution. Often, they appear and disappear as quickly as a mosquito and there are so many all one can do is swat at them.

It's interesting to me how few rancid comments are made against the hucksters in cutlery ( or any other product), so this thread is refreshing. Very few legitimate players make blades that are an attempt to deceive, yet we don't hesitate to share our poor opinion of their product if we are not completely satisfied. This crosses my mind each time I am tempted to complain so sometimes my comments may be softened a little. The junk out there is so bad and so deceptive that when we see it I believe I should say so. Good thread. By the way, my Nogales Rolax finally quit but still looks great. ss
 
I think they would probably have strong case against the use and copy of the Trademark. That was a blatant copy. The knife would only need to vary slightly in design to be subject against patent protection, which I don't think these blades hold any patents. I know we don't, it is hardly cost effective to attempt to patent a blade design for fixed blade. Unless there is a unique locking or opening mechanism for a knife it seems difficult to obtain patent. Otherwise it is a piece of steel with an edge that can be produced in anyone's shop.
I am concerned that the false labeling of these knives are deceptive practices. If they produced their versions without copying the logos and names they may have a marketable product. Making a exact copy and labeling and marketing as the legitamate product is the issue on these.
 
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