Notes from the Editor....

...I have never even heard of an actual person (as opposed to an actor or politician) who manages to be so consistently wrong about everything....
Now thats funny! Made me laugh first thing this morning.

Bill
 
mr harley, RIGHT ON. takes a man who's been through the wringer to say the truth.

you are fully correct, kohaii lives to stir up trouble, his statement about josh's kids proves it. he'd have been banned for his dick statement if he didn't have his fan club. it's amazing how muck he's like cliff stamp the one he hates so much.

wwg is all about money, he's stated that the only knives in his collection are those which increase in value. he never buys for fun alone. wwg is not capable of understanding that the abs is happy to turn out smiths that compete with current members. the abs is happy to improve the skills of existing members. its the mission of the abs. its mission is not to make money for the members. more smiths only threaten the mediocre smiths since they will die out earlier. good smiths aren't threatened, they'll just get better. however the more smiths, the harder it is for wwg to hype his posse and maintain his customer's investments. wwg would bash anything he couldn't manipulate as part of his business plan.

i just love your tag line for fowler..."home spun" i've read every article of his in the last ~7 years, he still hasn't released any of his secrets or cohesive testing results on his "performance blades." this secrecy alone is enough to show he doesn't belong in the abs. as you say, his knives speak for themselves, particularly when you pick one up. however, i'd bet even harley would admit home spun's articles are highly entertaining.

hanson's wrong about one thing, there are not a lot of collectors present in this subforum. there is a small group with similar interests. most discussions are driven by less than 15 people most of which are forged blade collectors. there's a lot more diversity in the custom knife collecting world than is represented here.

One of the most ill-informed posts I have ever seen here. (Putting it very mildly.)
 
Hi Keith,

The "Kumbaya" mindset seldom if ever moves anything forward. Kumbaya may give those involved a warm fuzzy while they are together. However, the problems that brought the group together in the first place remain.

This tread has wandered away from the original post. As is the case with most long threads.

While Brownshoe may think only 15 people are responsible for the majority of the posts. What he fails to take into consideration is the amount of "views" the thread has. As well every once in a while check out who is actually viewing the thread. Some very well known makers and collectors can be found.

While Mrs. Hughes may not read the Internet there are many who take advantage of the knowledge that is given freely every day on this forum and other like it.

I think that Hammer-Ins provide a great service to makers and collectors alike. Last year when I wen to Jerry's Micro-Show he took us to the school at Old Washington. I found it fascinating to watch Steve Dunn and Dickie Robinson work the steel and teach the students that were there. We were also treated to JR Cook's shop and got to watch him forge a hunter blade. Then back to Jerry's and got to watch Mike Ruth forge a Bowie blade. If nothing else it gave those watching an appreciation for what it takes to make a blade.

As well it was testament to the skills that Steve, Dickie, JR and Mike have...as they made it look much easier than it really is.

Im sure that Josh's Hammer-In will be a huge success. Lets face it he picked the right person to talk about Internet Forums. You have well over 1 million posts on the internet! :D

Keith, many of the people who express strong opinions here are those who have been involved with custom knives for a loooonnnngggg time. Lets face it there is no substitute for experience. These people will show you all sides of custom knives. Which, at least in my case, is what I want to see.

WWG
 
There is a difference between warm and fuzzy and respectful. There can be major disagreements without the need for insults and rudeness. I realize that things can get heated, but many of the posts in this thread point to the reason for Mrs Hughes' (and/or Mr Hughes') opinion of knife forums.
 
Hi Keith,

You may have missed one point of Mrs. Hughes comments....she has never read any of the threads on Internet forums.

So Keith how much credence would give the opinion of a person who knows nothing about what happens on the Internet. She made a comment about the "So called Experts". How does she know if someone is or is not an expert if she has never read anything they wrote?

Keith, I think you would agree that there are a fair amount of experts and expertise on this forum.

While sometimes some of us go a little overboard (guilty as charged) for the most part the information and the posts here are done in a positive matter.

So Keith, what is the response after you have been "respectful" and another person is not so respectful with their response to you. How would you handle that scenario.

WWG
 
There is a difference between warm and fuzzy and respectful.

You may have missed one point of Mrs. Hughes comments.
Les, I think you missed Keith's point.

I have a question for you. What does disrespect, rudeness or condescension gain you as a business man?

WoodWorkGhost said:
Im sure that Josh's Hammer-In will be a huge success.
Josh's Hammer-In is a big success. 2008 will be the third year Josh has hosted the Big Sky Hammer-In. The last two years were great and next year looks like it will be even better.
 
Hi Keith,

The "Kumbaya" mindset seldom if ever moves anything forward. Kumbaya may give those involved a warm fuzzy while they are together. However, the problems that brought the group together in the first place remain.

This tread has wandered away from the original post. As is the case with most long threads.

While Brownshoe may think only 15 people are responsible for the majority of the posts. What he fails to take into consideration is the amount of "views" the thread has. As well every once in a while check out who is actually viewing the thread. Some very well known makers and collectors can be found.

While Mrs. Hughes may not read the Internet there are many who take advantage of the knowledge that is given freely every day on this forum and other like it.

I think that Hammer-Ins provide a great service to makers and collectors alike. Last year when I wen to Jerry's Micro-Show he took us to the school at Old Washington. I found it fascinating to watch Steve Dunn and Dickie Robinson work the steel and teach the students that were there. We were also treated to JR Cook's shop and got to watch him forge a hunter blade. Then back to Jerry's and got to watch Mike Ruth forge a Bowie blade. If nothing else it gave those watching an appreciation for what it takes to make a blade.

As well it was testament to the skills that Steve, Dickie, JR and Mike have...as they made it look much easier than it really is.

Im sure that Josh's Hammer-In will be a huge success. Lets face it he picked the right person to talk about Internet Forums. You have well over 1 million posts on the internet! :D

Keith, many of the people who express strong opinions here are those who have been involved with custom knives for a loooonnnngggg time. Lets face it there is no substitute for experience. These people will show you all sides of custom knives. Which, at least in my case, is what I want to see.

WWG
True, Les, but I would counter by saying that the "F**K you, a**hole" mindset does even less than "Kumbaya" I'm just looking for a little civility:D
 
HI Chuck,

Generally being, as you say, disrespectful, condescending and rude saves time in the long run.

As a businessman you know that time is the only thing you can't buy, trade or in any other way get more of.

What you mistake for my comments as being disrespectful, condescending and rude. Is my way of pre-qualifying those I respond to. No matter how nice you are to people, there is always 10% that are idiots and not worth your time.

There is a maker I know who is one of the nicest guys you would ever want to meet. Is giving of his time both towards the organization he belongs to and other makers. Goes out of his way to help....always there to volunteer.

But he has committed the cardinal sin among knife makers. He has achieved a level of success and notoriety that most makers could only hope to achieve. His reward for all of this hard work that led to his success. His is there are makers and board members who are intimidated by his success. These individuals will spend more time and effort trying to bring him down a notch than they will to increase the success of all of those those who are in the organization.

So what you may misconstrue as being rude or disrespectful is neither. It is a time saving device.

Examples:

Custom knives...Randalls and Chris Reeve Knives are not.

Jigged bone should not be on a knife unless it is for historical accuracy.

Nickel Silver....same as above.

Colored Giraffe Bone and Colored Woods should not be put on a knife.

Mokume should not be put on a knife.

Now what some may perceive as confrontational comments. These are the same people who do not understand the 80/20 principal hat make up the custom knife market.

I live in the 80% part of the market. As well I am the one who lives in the aftermarket. Consequently, unlike makers, collectors and suppliers like you Chuck. Do not have people coming to your table trying to trade you knives at shows and in many cases showing you all kinds of disrespect. Why? All because I wouldn't buy their knife or take it in trade.

By making condescending or rude comments like the ones above. What happens is that the word gets out that I have no interest those items above....and people stop bringing them to my table. Those who do bring knives to my table to sell or trade have in most cases pre-qualified in the 80% of the market. This saves me the one thing i can't get more of....Time.

As Brownshoe pointed out I am all about the money...as are you. Why because you are involved in the business end of custom knives. I don't know about you Chuck, but I find it rude and offensive when people try to make me out to be some kind of bad person because I make money from selling custom knives.

Personally, I feel I give back to the custom knife community as much if not more than I get from it.

Hope this answers your question. If it doesn't, let me know and I will try to further qualify why some consider my comments rude, condescending and disrespectful.

WWG
 
Hi Joe,

Agreed.

However, Sometimes F**K U A**H**E is the appropriate response.

WWG
Looking for his copy of Michael Row The Boat Ashore, lighting incense, taking out his tatami mat, opening the window so I can hear the wind chimes. Assume the lotus position and start relaxation first with breathing exercises than with the mantra of Kumbaya!
 
Hi Joe,

Agreed.

However, Sometimes F**K U A**H**E is the appropriate response.

WWG
Looking for his copy of Michael Row The Boat Ashore, lighting incense, taking out his tatami mat, opening the window so I can hear the wind chimes. Assume the lotus position and start relaxation first with breathing exercises than with the mantra of Kumbaya!
Don't forget to loosen up the belt on your tie dyed utilikilt, take off your Birkies, let your dreadlocks down and douse yourself with patchouli oil:D
 
Hi Joe,

I don't have enough hair for dreadlocks! LOL :D

As for the other stuff, I think your "meditation experience" may go back a few years further than mine. :D

WWG
 
Kohai999;5028915]1. . Because of the medium used, it was not just a casual, INDIVIDUAL opinion...it speaks for the collective voice.

{what about the word editorial do u not understand.
she is the editor
thats her opinion and just like u she is entitled to her opinion
and if she were speaking for a collective voice neither i nor any members of the abs would be on here
but we are
so u r wrong dufus}


2. Larry Harley got support from the ABS, obviously that is a good and noble thing....a fellow who got hepatitis from what, Larry, since you decided to hang your ass out there

{glad u asked (ahem)
it was a bright summertime day in 1974 and i was at the crossroads of Nashville and okervill ill.
i was driving down the road in my 1965 Chevrolet sport van
about 65 mph when like the hand of god hit me i was swept me off the road
someone ran a stop signed they to were doing about 65
:) get the picture ace
and hit me about a foot behind the drivers side door
after the end over end I had the steering wheel bent in a figure 8
after the second or 3 ed rollover there was very little top on the van
so there I Set in in the drivers seat
still slidn down the rd on the drivers side
that ol van had external door hinges
what an incredible morbid light show that was as they ground into the pavement
then the on coming car piled me up about 2 feet behind my head
I went pining like a bottle
after it was all over with I looked like Frankenstein I had so many stitches
a state trooper came to the ER just to see who was in that van and lived
during this whole bloody mess I got bagged twice
one just so happened to be from an ol boy that had just got back from Viet Nam
he gave me a present he didnt even know he had
hep c
now that weve talked about my medical conditions
what reliance does it have in any of this thread??
why would U ask me that question???
other than to be a prick}





? Larry decided that he doesn't like the " stirring up" this post provided.

Larry, you need to make knives more, and get riled up less. I could give a popcorn fart about what riles you up, and we can talk about it at Blade, if I make it out there this year, which I plan to. But since we are chatting about it now....could you please at least attempt to make some sense in your posts, punctuation and spelling and all that? AND....FWIW,



I really don't care for your baiting of Ed Fowler.....he is a great guy....gives a lot to the community, and POSITIVELY promotes knives and knife craft. What did he do to you to pull your chain?

{ U been reading comic books again??}

Am I an expert? On some knife related things, maybe

{ and just what knife related things R U an expert at
I see nothing related to knives that requires a pompous bombastic know it all}




. On others, I don't know crap.....be the first to admit it, any day, any time.

3. Josh, you get riled up by Les pretty easy. He has his strong points, just like you, and he gets a whole bunch of people interested in forged blades, which benefits every forger in the long run. Consider working WITH him, instead of wanting to kick his ass every month or so, and you both will be much more productive.

I'm not going to have much internet access for the next two weeks or so, but will check in when possible.

Most of you know the intent and reason behind this post in the first place. There is not much more to it than that. Status quo is BS right now, too much momentum to ignore. The Guild crapped away so much momentum and strength due to a weak leadership and petty political squabbling, I would sooner die right now, than see that happen to the ABS.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson


2knives
larry,
Your ass is bigger than your mouth. As much as you keep talking, it all smells like it is coming out the wrong end.
First, Mr. Balls, U should use " " when you are quoting other people, or no one will know what you are saying. Lard ass!

u know one thing bothers me about your post
how come u know so much about my ass
are u one of them rump rangers??
u seem to have scoped mine out pretty good
and that s kinda creepy
say u was at my hammerin?? was U scoaping everyone's ass or just mine
seem I recall my ass get kind warm a few hammerins ago
i.ll bet that was u lookn at my ass
be nice
dont look at other mens asses
was that u lookn at my ass butt boy
hey that can be your new name "butt boy"
how bout that
butt boy

and yes i got a big ass and a big mouth
as a matter of fact my ass is so big it can cash about any ck my mouth can write}


Your contempt and disdain.. Did your mother beat you? If we are talking about knives, I've attended one of your hammerins.. Nothing too special. Your knives don't do anything for me. I doubt you have any clue what Ed Fowler has done, nothing like you will ever do. Period.

It is easy to insult, it takes a greater degree of refinement to approach some level of dignity.

{ and your have done it with this post of yours u tiny minded smeller of other peoples butts
watch it if ed stops too fast u will break your nose butt boy:)}


We can all agree about that, hopefully.

Really remarkable, someone like Larry Harley who is supposed to represent knives and his peers in a good way would denegrate, and be such a loud mouthed idiot here.
David

{oh yes and dave if u were ever at one of my hammerins u sure werent as brave then as u are now

this whole thread proves her point
esp the rantings of dufus and butt boy}

xoxoxoxo
see u round butt boy
harley
p.s.
laughing so hard i cant see
 
Hi Joe,

I don't have enough hair for dreadlocks! LOL :D

As for the other stuff, I think your "meditation experience" may go back a few years further than mine. :D

WWG
Nah........that's 90's neo-pseudo-hippie stuff, man. How do i know? Well, let's just say that the "fringe benefits" were well worth putting up with the quirky behavior for a few months:D
 
Mr. Harley,
I did get to see a few of your knives on your website. I will not denegrate your work, whatever it has been. I am really unfamiliar with your knifemaking to a great extent. Actually, I did have a nice conversation with you on your visit to Winston Salem, North Carolina last year. And can hardly believe you are the same man as the ass here making these remarks. I read your response post, with the humor I suppose it was intended, sure funny to start.. butt, not all that funny. I am not above seeing you as a human being, but a deeply flawed man who is oddly bored into making some desperate remarks, for his own entertainment.

One can point out people's weaknesses but it doesn't mean that they will fix them. Character flaws run deep. I have no interest in fixing Harley's attitude, but the man must have been raised with no manner of respect. Sure, I baited his responses possibly, but it takes a low class player to sit around trade insults, just a low class person to start with.

I do see a lot of good character in STeven's post. I am proud of his ability to make his points of view and stick to his conscious. Good job STeven!
David
 
Let's stop with the name calling & dick waving, folks. If you want to offer criticism of the ABS, make it constructive criticism. Past that, there's no need to be rude.
 
At the root of the issue is lack of understanding and communication.

Wouldn't hammer-in's be more effective at teaching if the ABS could webcast them all over the world?

Wouldn't the Reno Show be more effective if it had its own website with preview pics of the makers knives?

Wouldn't this forum be less interesting without people like Larry and STeven?
 
Hi B&B,

There is no communication. Please re-read this thread.

Wouldn't hammer-in's be more effective at teaching if the ABS could webcast them all over the world?

Yes, it would be. However, the ABS Charter only trains makers. Beyond that violates their charter and non-profit status.

Wouldn't the Reno Show be more effective if it had its own website with preview pics of the makers knives?

Yes, it would be. However, the ABS Charter only trains makers. Beyond that violates their charter and non-profit status.

Wouldn't this forum be less interesting without people like Larry and STeven?

Yes, it would be.

WWG
 
At the root of the issue is lack of understanding and communication.

Wouldn't hammer-in's be more effective at teaching if the ABS could webcast them all over the world?

Wouldn't the Reno Show be more effective if it had its own website with preview pics of the makers knives?

Wouldn't this forum be less interesting without people like Larry and STeven?

It would be cool to web-cast hammer-ins. How would you do that? I am completely ignorant to that kind of technology. Would this be difficult? At my hammer-in I'm not sure how it could happen since it is mostly outside and in my forging shop. Do you have a possible solution for that?

The only issue I could see is if some makers would not want that due to the fact that they may have videos out they'd like to sell. I doubt that would come up very often but it could. It could also be easily avoidable. I see it as increased exposure for that makers.

Reno show website and preview knives. That's a great idea. A couple issues would be getting all of the makers to commit to photographing their knives prior to the show. I think the majority finish their knives quite close to the show. A certain number could be photographed though. I'm sure this would increase incentive for makers to finish their knives early.

Nice post bladeandbarrel. Some people are cynical and like to have a doomsday approach with no solutions, while others offer constructive criticism and good ideas that can be put into effect, albeit not overnight.

www.joshsmithknives.com
 
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