"Old Knives"

I think I've found my next project knife. It's stamped "Federal Knife Company, Syracuse NY. and has a faint blade etch saying "City Drug Store" I wonder if the blade originally was a longer spear, and had the name of the city? o_O I believe Federal was a Kastor/Camillus brand, maybe 1920s? The (celluloid?) covers are shrunken and lifting up, so I'm considering redoing them in rosewood. Might have to file out a nail relief for the pen blade, as it is sitting pretty low.
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I had to redo the posts and they’re still confusing.

The 1886 catalog cut on top is of the Ulster.

The 2nd 1890 catalog cut is of the light colored Southington on the right in the comparison.
 
Goins says there are many FAKE pre WWII era Winchester Trade Mark Knives out there. So BUYER beware!

Here are three Winchester Trade Mark tang stamps all from claimed vintage (pre WWII) Winchester Coke Bottle Folding hunters. The top two are from current EBay auctions and the third one from the top is from a Winchester 1920 Coke Bottle Folding hunter I own. According to Goins the one without the dashes before and after Trade Mark is from 1919 and the one with the dashes dates to 1938. So Goins says there are two grades of Winchester knives and “it was after 1931 that the second type of Winchester knife was introduced”. Further, “It is not of the same high quality as the other knives”. Bernard Levine calls these second type Winchester knives without pattern number, only one blade marked and rough black or celluloid handles “inexpensive assortment knives” pg. 122 4th edition.

Goins description of the Winchester Trademark Made in USA c 1932-1942 pg. 304 is very confusing and leaves a lot of holes in the timeline regarding production starts and stops and starting again and who was doing what! Question—were both Trademarks (with dashes and without dashes) used during this 1932-1942 production era?

Question—does anyone know when exactly these Winchester “inexpensive assortment knives” were made? They would be very collectible also I would think.

Question—was Winchester, after the split with Simmons, still making higher grade or grade one knives on Napanoch and Walden equipment up to 1942 when they turned to mainly war production? Also how does Western Cartridge Company fit into the history of Cutlery making at Winchester?

The Coke Bottle Folding Hunter pattern 1920 I have is of exceptional quality and ranks right up there in terms of fit and finish with any pre war Schrade/Ulster, Remington, Robeson or NYKC folder of which I have a number of each.

Thanks for any help or corrections of what I posted or misunderstood!D687CC0A-FA4A-4DFE-9C6C-2A869DA5844C.jpeg 7424D67D-442A-4D55-B80A-979C5B24D6A0.jpeg D6BA1F35-AE68-493B-B989-81DAA4EC0436.jpeg 423EAAF6-BB78-4783-8E42-541066510F2E.jpeg 791B7B6F-6D12-4BAE-A365-8F6DC89B4D90.jpeg
 
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Thanks for the report on Winchester stampings and knives, Lloyd!!
I will dig out the couple of Winchesters I own, and post them, for comparison.
 
As promised - first pics, three Barlows and a small Coke Bottle Jack.
Second pair of pics, two Harness Jacks.
The first Barlow has the word trademark with dashes, as does the bottom HJ.
The bottom HJ also has the older Napanoch style punch, confirming that the "dashes" are on the older knives.
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Thanks Charlie! That then shows that the Trade Mark with dashes was used early on:thumbsup: Charlie what is the marking(s) on the secondary blades?

Goins is just very unclear and muddled in his information and dialogue on the Winchester description and markings.
He does not give ranges on blade marking just a single date. In the case of Winchester these tang marking and the nuances of the Trade Marks apparently ran over a span of years and were perhaps used at different times or even concurrently from 1919 to 1942. It am NOT trying to nit pick I use Goins’ Encyclopedia all the time but in the case of the Winchester entry it is very convoluted and confusing—at least to meo_O.

Thanks again Charlie appreciate you posting photos of some very outstanding Winchester examples!
 
Thanks for the heartwarming expletives, Duncan and David!!:)

From the top, Lloyd:
The older Barlow just has the one tang stamp.
The Clip Barlow has a full stamp on the secondary, no pile side stamps.
The single blade Barlow has 1701 stamped on the pile.
The Coke has 2640 behind the main, and a full stamp on the mark of the secondary.

The small HJ has 2855 behind the main, and no marks on the punch.
The Large HJ has 2927 behind the main, and PAT'D (over) 4/07/08 behind the punch.
(That's when William Carman of Napanoch received his patent.)
 
Great info Charlie mate. My goodness’s man- breathtaking Knives- the two HJ’s = favourites but that Coke bottle kind grew on me - ok it LATCHED onto me immediately!
Napanoch Punch style is awesome - thank you again Charlie for reawakening this style Punch from its deep sleep.
 
Nice Barrel Knife there Alan my friend, thats a real nice one!

Charlie, that Napanoch HJ is a beauty- There must be very few of those out there? interesting that the same stamp - I take it that Winchester would have used old Stock Napanoch stock Punches on their HJ's?
 
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