Opinions on folding knife blades being centered.

[whateatsrabbits]

I would defiantly prefer a centered blade, but an off center blade wont stop me from buying a knife I like, usually discounted because its off center

 

[Czechmate]

How butt-hurt should I get over buying knives that are centered? Folders of course.... Titanium lock scale, etc. I , of course, want as much done right about a knife for my money, but I was told I was being "anal retentive".:grumpy: A knife had more spacers on the opposite side of the blade from the lock , moving the blade closer to the lock scale.

That's quite terrible and not an acceptable answer to your concern IMHO...

Seems like a really bubba'd up way to fix a "new" knife LOL, a good indicator of their "quality" though. :foot::thumbdn:


I have one off center folding knife with a warped blade; I removed it and checked it against a known flat surface. It wasn't disclosed to me as part of the trade so shame on them for not telling me how bad it was. No way to adjust that out other than sending it back to the company.

Another folder I have either has a wonky pivot or the pivot hole is not machined properly; no amount of tightening can create both a centered and smooth blade opening. The pivot needs to be quite loose to allow the knife to open easily resulting in it rubbing a bit.

 

[EChoil]

Keeping in mind we're talking $100+ knives for the most part, here are a few real hoots; some I had to laugh aloud:

As the owner of rather expensive off center knives.... I don't really care unless it's physically touching the liner.

And everyone else with your knife is probably carrying a GOOD one. If such a fault doesn't bother you after a substantial investment, C'est la vie....

I just wonder if you're always so accepting of such prominent flaws in higher end goods?

Sometimes the blade is actually centered, but when freehand grinding the grind itself can be slightly off. It takes a lot of practice to grind a blade perfectly symmetric. So taking that into account, as long as the blade does not rub I am happy.

So, you're willing to be the test market for someone still practicing grinding a blade and pay the same amount as those who eventually received a perfect copy? OK.....

In the words of Mr. Hinderer..
"A centered knife doesn't necessarily represent a perfect knife".. some blades/knives preform better when they are a little off centered.. otherwise you can start binding things.
Although, I do appreciate a centered knife, it isn't a deal breaker for me as long as the knife functions properly..

That quote is facile, and in no way applies to this topic. What would apply is, "A perfect knife necessarily has a centered blade." And uh....

.....would you mind giving me a couple examples of these knives that perform better when the blade is "a little off center"? Just curious.

Edge retention or ease of sharpening is more important to me. My 112 sits on my hip every working day. Just checked and its not centred and indeed wobbly when closed. Open its tight and sharp. I profiled and polished edge first day i got it and never had to do anything other than stop with green copound since. What it does when shut means nothing to me

Are you saying you accepted it un-centered and wobbly when NEW? That's what we're discussing here.

Your "What it does when shut means nothing to me" may be the best rationalization in this whole thread for accepting pedestrian workmanship.

.... Of course I would like it to be perfectly centered but life is not perfect.

That should serve you well in never having to take a stand, challenge anything or open yourself to disputation in any way. I know others who prefer to go through life the same way....

I have high-end folders with bad centering. I still love them because they're otherwise superb knives. I don't know if centering is a concrete indication of quality. I've seen Sebenzas that weren't perfectly centered. I have Spydercos that aren't. In my experience, the company that consistently does centering best is Cold Steel. I like looking at them and thinking, "now there's a company that really has it locked down", but I realize that in reality it has no bearing on the performance and overall quality of the knife.[/B] I'll draw the line and consider poor centering the makings of a bad knife when the blade rubs against the liner/frame. I had a Benchmade HK Ally that did this. Gave it away.

"Otherwise superb," huh? I wasn't aware there were 'otherwise's' in "superb." I still don't think there are. And I can tell you that NOT centered is a concrete indication of lacking craftsmanship in high-end knives.

So Cold Steel can do it but (Chris Reeve) or Spyderco can't and shouldn't be held to it for that kind of money?

Wrong--an un-centered blade DOES bear on the quality of a pricey folder. Ask most of the people here. You know that. And you say poor centering is only a flaw when it rubs the liner? C'mon Kwon.... I think you know better than all this.

It depends upon the build of the knife. Liner Locks push the blade to the side where as lock backs do not. It also depends upon the Maker of the knife. I'd expect more out of good makers (production or custom).

As long as the function, safety, and aesthetics of the blade are not impaired does it matter? My Kershaw CQC 5 is not centered perfectly. But the knife still performs like a champ.

I never realized liner locks in a well-crafted knife threw blades off center. Are you talking about on defective knives ??

The OP DOES expect more out of a "good" maker, thus this thread.

I guess it doesn't matter, if you are timid or recalcitrant about addressing it as the shortcoming and deficiency in build it is.

For me a centered blade is simply a bonus, not a necessity.

This is great one ! No comment necessary

Amazing what little jewels of cracked wisdom you find here on occasion. Geeeze, people.....

 

[DangCat]

My original message

Message from Visitor


I have recently become the VERY proud owner of a pair 187DPT knives. However, the second 187 I received today does not have a centered blade and has a birth date of 5/18/15. The other 187 is perfect in every way, 7/08/15 birthdate, with matching grooves on the scale/Ti lock. The May knife has differing grooves. I was hoping you guys could take a look at the "May 187dpt" for me. Thanks for your time, Russell


Database Message ID: 1054

Russell,

Can you send me a picture of the knife and question? Sounds like we may need to have you send it in as an RMA.

Sincerely,
Amy Medford
Customer Relations

Russell,



I showed your pictures to my VP of Operations…it’s time for you to send your black G-10 187 in. If you call the factory, I’ll get you set up with an RMA number.




Sincerely,

Amy Medford

Customer Relations


SO, I called , and Amy says the guy that made the knife was fired for not setting up knives correctly.

The rest you already know. I was going to spend more time on this to give the subject justice. I am out 15 dollars there, and 18 dollars back... shipping. I have an ear full of excuses such as..... We don't offer the Vulcan blade treatment anymore... the knife is old... the knife is hand made... it' only 5 thousandths ( or something like that) .... the knife is perfectly fine, no problem with it... and I'm anal retentive , two more times.

So yeah, juicy stuff right? Well , Amy understood that I was most likely not happy after I was disrespected , discounted, shown contempt and patted on the head. I was too stunned to show any anger towards Greg. She sent me a t-shirt and a patch.

I don't really think you will ever have a warranty issue with a Medford, but if you do, it's only good if the guy agrees with you.

Now to offer up more fairness than I received, I have a Praetorian T, an RMP, a TFF and the two DPTs ( one in route ). Except for the one, they are perfect and tough as hell. However, these knives made the DPT in question feel like a used knife. Ok, I gotta get back to work .

 

[Insipid Moniker]

Well, you've further confirmed my previous opinion of Medford knives. I'll stick with reputable brands, but I hope this gets sorted out for you.

 

[DangCat]

Well, you've further confirmed my previous opinion of Medford knives. I'll stick with reputable brands, but I hope this gets sorted out for you.

Thanks , really, but I think its a done deal, haha. I will most likely end up doing a repair or selling it. My best friend is a rep for Sandvik Coromont and has a Haas Mill. I need to get his lazy butt in gear,

 

[155440]

Keeping in mind we're talking $100+ knives for the most part, here are a few real hoots; some I had to laugh aloud:



And everyone else with your knife is probably carrying a GOOD one. If such a fault doesn't bother you after a substantial investment, C'est la vie....

I just wonder if you're always so accepting of such prominent flaws in higher end goods?

Considering the knives are objectively perfect in terms of fit and finish outside of centering which can be tricky on pinned knives, It is not so important to me.

All are slightly off center. Keep in mind this is more than $1k in knives total, one being made by an ABS Master Smith. Centering is really not that big of a deal. Perhaps it is you who should re-evaluate your standards.

 

[EChoil]

Thought so.

You aren't giving up on this are you, DangCat?

So they were amenable to a return & fix until you placed the call? Not crystal clear from your last post, but I'm assuming everything is still the same--no progress? You received the knife NEW like this, right....as in the pic you posted?

If so, it still seems you're being treated obscenely by them. Won't ask what you payed for the knife, but one of the worst cases I've seen outlined here. A patch and a T-shirt for all that??

Keep us posted.

 

[blade dude]

My off center blades pick up the best I have one that's centered but when open it has play. Centered blade while closed or not centered doesn't always affect performance especially if it locks up fine.

 

[DangCat]

Those knives arent the same scale and look fine to me. its not the blade point end that's at issue. the blade had spacers added so that the lockup would be earlier. I sent the photos and didn't ask for an RMA. They said it was warranty and offered an RMA.

 

[DangCat]

 

[palonej]

First off.....a blade not centered is NOT acceptable to me. When they arrive like that new it is very hard to find the sweet spot on adjustment.....centered but very tight etc. sign of a problem at production.
Customer Service plays a HUGE part of where I spend my cash and I would not stand for that garbage from anyone.
Scott from usamadeblade posted on the first page. I spent lots of cash with him because of that type of service.
When checking out sales threads on the Exchange blade centering is almost always mentioned.......it's important.....period.
Want excellent manufacturer's customer service?? Check out Benchmade, Spydie or Pro Tech.
Hope the OP doesn't settle and gets what he paid for.
Joe

 

[DangCat]

Thought so.

You aren't giving up on this are you, DangCat?

So they were amenable to a return & fix until you placed the call? Not crystal clear from your last post, but I'm assuming everything is still the same--no progress? You received the knife NEW like this, right....as in the pic you posted?

If so, it still seems you're being treated obscenely by them. Won't ask what you payed for the knife, but one of the worst cases I've seen outlined here. A patch and a T-shirt for all that??

Keep us posted.

The phone call was yesterday, the knife is on its way back. We will see. I was caught flat-footed at work, with customers, google maps on the other phone. I was just trying to get off the phone with the guy at that point.

 

[Cutlover]

Raise your rock bottom standards guys, c'mon. If you spend $200+ on a knife, it should be essentially perfect. Accepting a poorly made expensive knife instead of demanding perfection is just lazy and complacent.

Keeping in mind we're talking $100+ knives for the most part, here are a few real hoots; some I had to laugh aloud:



And everyone else with your knife is probably carrying a GOOD one. If such a fault doesn't bother you after a substantial investment, C'est la vie....

I just wonder if you're always so accepting of such prominent flaws in higher end goods?



So, you're willing to be the test market for someone still practicing grinding a blade and pay the same amount as those who eventually received a perfect copy? OK.....



That quote is facile, and in no way applies to this topic. What would apply is, "A perfect knife necessarily has a centered blade." And uh....

.....would you mind giving me a couple examples of these knives that perform better when the blade is "a little off center"? Just curious.



Are you saying you accepted it un-centered and wobbly when NEW? That's what we're discussing here.

Your "What it does when shut means nothing to me" may be the best rationalization in this whole thread for accepting pedestrian workmanship.



That should serve you well in never having to take a stand, challenge anything or open yourself to disputation in any way. I know others who prefer to go through life the same way....



"Otherwise superb," huh? I wasn't aware there were 'otherwise's' in "superb." I still don't think there are. And I can tell you that NOT centered is a concrete indication of lacking craftsmanship in high-end knives.

So Cold Steel can do it but (Chris Reeve) or Spyderco can't and shouldn't be held to it for that kind of money?

Wrong--an un-centered blade DOES bear on the quality of a pricey folder. Ask most of the people here. You know that. And you say poor centering is only a flaw when it rubs the liner? C'mon Kwon.... I think you know better than all this.



I never realized liner locks in a well-crafted knife threw blades off center. Are you talking about on defective knives ??

The OP DOES expect more out of a "good" maker, thus this thread.

I guess it doesn't matter, if you are timid or recalcitrant about addressing it as the shortcoming and deficiency in build it is.



This is great one ! No comment necessary

Amazing what little jewels of cracked wisdom you find here on occasion. Geeeze, people.....

Props to Echoil for speaking the truth. :thumbup:


So, you guys enjoy knives with off center blades? Might as well go ahead and get that Ford pickup truck that veers to the right. Still runs, doesn't it? Also might as well pick up that computer with the dead pixels in the screen....you still can see the screen, right?. After that, might as well head to the store and pick up that designer jacket with the stitching loose...still in one piece, looks fine to me.

 

[EChoil]

Considering the knives are objectively perfect in terms of fit and finish outside of centering which can be tricky on pinned knives, It is not so important to me.

All are slightly off center. Keep in mind this is more than $1k in knives total, one being made by an ABS Master Smith. Centering is really not that big of a deal. Perhaps it is you who should re-evaluate your standards.

Perfect outside of centering, huh? :triumphant: That reminds me of a phrase posted earlier herein: "Otherwise superb." Still chuckling over that one.....and now yours.

Maybe centering's not important to you, but it is to me. First, they're all trads. Had you asked, I may have a different opinion on those. But....

....only says to me your Mastersmith (should I preface that with "alleged"?) didn't get it centered. Neither did your Notquitemastersmiths either, huh? Maybe it IS harder to do on trads. I don't know because I'm not into 'em. I bet a lot of good trads ARE centered.

I only see an off-center in the middle one. If, in person, I'd noticed the same flaw in the others, so be it. Can't tell from the pics.

Re-evaluate what? My "standards" on the topic originally under discussion are unflinching and re-eval isn't necessary. This thread involved a modern folder, not a pinned trad. Good modern folders have centered blades.

You paid over a grand for THOSE?? I wouldn't; esp. with cocked blades. If you want to have what you consider high-dollar knives with cocked blades have at it. If your Mastersmith can't center a blade when new on a pinned knife, keep buying from him if you want.

I say again...I expect a centered blade on a high quality knife from a high quality craftsman to whom I paid high quality dollars. Funny how people have differing tastes and quality criteria, isn't it?

But thanks for your input....I guess. Not sure what it was all about.

 

[EChoil]

The phone call was yesterday, the knife is on its way back. We will see. I was caught flat-footed at work, with customers, google maps on the other phone. I was just trying to get off the phone with the guy at that point.

Cool. Glad to hear it. Hope you'll keep us posted. Not that it's worth anything but I back you 100% on this. One of my few pet peeves in knifedom, right up there with being sent knives as new that had already been returned a time or two.

Hey, think this may have been a return they tried to foist off on you??

 

[EChoil]

Raise your rock bottom standards guys, c'mon. If you spend $200+ on a knife, it should be essentially perfect. Accepting a poorly made expensive knife instead of demanding perfection is just lazy and complacent......Props to Echoil for speaking the truth. :thumbup:

So, you guys enjoy knives with off center blades? Might as well go ahead and get that Ford pickup truck that veers to the right. Still runs, doesn't it? Also might as well pick up that computer with the dead pixels in the screen....you still can see the screen, right?. After that, might as well head to the store and pick up that designer jacket with the stitching loose...still in one piece, looks fine to me.

Aw shucks, Cut.

 

[HwangJino]

Usually I wouldn't care, I never even noticed until I got into sebenzas. Now, any chris reeve I buy HAS to be centered. Any other knife, who cares, they still cut.

If it's just a knife that an electrician uses, whatever, if it's pocket jewelry, like a watch, it should be more 'crafted'.

 

[The Aflac Duck]

I've taken away 2 things from reading this thread:

-Medford continues to make me cringe
-EChoil has way too much time on his hands

 

[CSTLandscapes]

Perfect outside of centering, huh? :triumphant: That reminds me of a phrase posted earlier herein: "Otherwise superb." Still chuckling over that one.....and now yours.

Maybe centering's not important to you, but it is to me. First, they're all trads. Had you asked, I may have a different opinion on those. But....

....only says to me your Mastersmith (should I preface that with "alleged"?) didn't get it centered. Neither did your Notquitemastersmiths either, huh? Maybe it IS harder to do on trads. I don't know because I'm not into 'em. I bet a lot of good trads ARE centered.

I only see an off-center in the middle one. If, in person, I'd noticed the same flaw in the others, so be it. Can't tell from the pics.

Re-evaluate what? My "standards" on the topic originally under discussion are unflinching and re-eval isn't necessary. This thread involved a modern folder, not a pinned trad. Good modern folders have centered blades.

You paid over a grand for THOSE?? I wouldn't; esp. with cocked blades. If you want to have what you consider high-dollar knives with cocked blades have at it. If your Mastersmith can't center a blade when new on a pinned knife, keep buying from him if you want.

I say again...I expect a centered blade on a high quality knife from a high quality craftsman to whom I paid high quality dollars. Funny how people have differing tastes and quality criteria, isn't it?

But thanks for your input....I guess. Not sure what it was all about.

-This