Pit Bull mauling and killing in California

OC worked for me. german shep (off leash) went after my border collie (on leash).

again. owners. there are 'dogs must be leashed' signs about every 1/4mi on the trails i use, and this guy decided he was the one person in the world it didn't apply to.

he started having a fit, yelling at me. "i can't believe you did that!". it could have easily escalated, but i just kept eye contact with him, kept walking and calmly told him to go take care of his dog (who had run about 20 yards and started rubbing his face on the ground).
 
It sounds like pepper spray works! Too bad, yet another banned item in Canada unless in bear country.

For those of you who reported success with the spray, what was the working distance and time needed to aim and fire. In each case, it seems that the attacking dog was going after a companion dog rather than the owner. I'm just trying to get a feeling about how long it takes to set up the spray and the range over which it was used. Did you get your own dog in the process?

Thanks for your responses.
 
Dog owners who are ignorant&arrogant enough to let their pets off leash in public places have no right to keep them as they are not thougthful owners.If a dog bothers others,stillworse attacks people in public places, and is a large aggressive dog, this is no joke at all,and not defensible either.

Couple of dogs have had a go at me in public, mostly even fierce dogs will back off if you treat them calmly.But there are times when you can see they won't & then it's you getting savaged or it being kept off! I can look after myself,usually, but can older people or small children or the disabled?? A stick is a very effective defence against a dog, if you wield it seriously,that accompanied by shouting & standing my ground has served me well.Pepper gel could be good in extremis as it's less affected by wind. If you are not trespassing, then no dog should be off the lead full stop.if it is, then owners can't expect the rest of us to view their potential death machine as 'loveable' to you they are, to the rest of us, not.
 
I wouldn't want to have to defend myself from even one dog without a gun, the effectiveness of which can even be questionable. I remember reading an interesting post written by a LEO on a gun forum (THR) about his having to put down a violent dog (pitbull IIRC) with a shotgun- it took 3 rounds of Buck to STOP the dog. Even a gun isn't magic.
 
My wife's nephew has a pit bull he found covered with scars.

It was apparently fought because it is totally friendly to people but he can't take it to anyones house with animals esp dogs because it will kill them.

Pit Bulls and Rotts are the redneck, the homeboy and the drug dealer badass dog around here.

My 17 year old cat was killed by one, my friends 13 year old dog was killed on the chain by the same dog, and my other dog and wife were bit by the same one. I spent 200 bucks patching up my border collie from the attack of another.

What I find interesting, which was mentioned in this thread is the attitude of the owner when the dogs are caught in the act and maimed or shot. It's like they are pissed at YOU for THEIR dog coming on your land and attacking your animals and then YOU shooting it.

The Rott I mentioned at first I actually shot with a shotgun with birdshot. After that if he saw me step into the road he got back down the road. Finally when his owner was serving time in jail and he kept coming up to my place and killing my chickens I did a drive by on him with a .22. But it apparently bounced off his head sent him screaming into the woods but then he was back. But any time he would see my car drive by after that he would go under the trailer:thumbup:

Finally after his owner got busted for meth production one of the other neighbors finally poisioned him:thumbup:

I know there are good examples of these breeds but they are few and far between in these parts.
 
I think HD hit on a good point, every good decent person I know that owns a bully breed has great dogs, the thugs turn their dogs into what they are.

I owned a pit bull a few years back and she was a darling, I had to get rid of her because I was going over seas and where I was going did not allow them, my wife was heartbroken. Chris
 
xinel said:
My grandmother told me about that Tiger getting loose in the US, I know they will be re-looking at our lion enclosure in our zoo :/
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My dad just told me that across the world some maniac in China broke into the zoo, tranquilised a tiger then skinned it and removed its legs and its head.
All for money....
 
kgd said:
For those of you who reported success with the spray, what was the working distance and time needed to aim and fire. In each case, it seems that the attacking dog was going after a companion dog rather than the owner. I'm just trying to get a feeling about how long it takes to set up the spray and the range over which it was used. Did you get your own dog in the process?
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in my case i saw it coming. i could see the dog off the leash, working the sides of the path about 80 yards away. when the dog and owner got to about 30 yards i said "could you leash you dog". he gave the typical response "oh, he won't bother you". at about 10 yards his dog fixed on my dog, ears went up and he squared his shoulders.

at this point, once i figured out the owner was useless, i palmed the Fox Labs OC that i carry in a shorts cargo pocket (after having similar encounters with dumbasses, and nearly getting bit kicking two loose retrievers off my dog).

after staring at my dog for about 5 seconds and giving a low 'wuff', the shepherd charged and made a beeline for my dog. i was taking no chances and put myself between the shepherd and my dog, sighted down my arm and gave it a 3 second stream. easy to get the head, as it was coming straight at me, not circling around.

i'd say i started spraying at about 12' until he broke off at around 5-6'. didn't get my dog, as they never tangled.
 
Metis said:
in my case i saw it coming. i could see the dog off the leash, working the sides of the path about 80 yards away. when the dog and owner got to about 30 yards i said "could you leash you dog". he gave the typical response "oh, he won't bother you". at about 10 yards his dog fixed on my dog, ears went up and he squared his shoulders.

at this point, once i figured out the owner was useless, i palmed the Fox Labs OC that i carry in a shorts cargo pocket (after having similar encounters with dumbasses, and nearly getting bit kicking two loose retrievers off my dog).

after staring at my dog for about 5 seconds and giving a low 'wuff', the shepherd charged and made a beeline for my dog. i was taking no chances and put myself between the shepherd and my dog, sighted down my arm and gave it a 3 second stream. easy to get the head, as it was coming straight at me, not circling around.

i'd say i started spraying at about 12' until he broke off at around 5-6'. didn't get my dog, as they never tangled.
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Maybe he just wanted to play, you bully. :D;)
 
It is surpising to hear how many owners get ticked off when someone has the nerve to protect themselves against thier dogs attack.

We own an American Bulldog, and I'm hugely embarassed to admit it, but we had a bite incident with him. One of those "end of the world is near pamphlet peddling Jehovah's Witness types" ignored our "No Trespassing" sign and wandered into the yard way too close to our nine year old son. (the dog is psycho-crazy foaming at the mouth protective of the wife and kid around strangers) The dog latched onto his arm a little and kinda dragged/ drove him out of the yard- then immediately returned to check on the boy.

I apologized profusely to the guy, felt terrible about his getting bitten, gave him the address, phone number, offered to pay any medical bills, etc. The family and I would have grieved his loss, but I wouldn't have blamed the guy if he'd out and out killed my dog.

I just can't possibly relate to someone being angry or threatening because thier off leash dog attacked someone or their pet in the street.:confused:

FWIW, we're still working on trying to get our dog to notch down the agression level- it's much improved, but my tiny little corner of the world is still a bad place to pop into if you're not friend or family. hugely comforting when I'm a thousand miles away in the oilfields and things go bump in the night, not so great when door to door types ignore our "No Trespassing" signs.

If he weren't so damn loyal and wonderful to the family, I'd have lost patience long ago.
 
rebeltf said:
Really pisses me off when folks let their dogs run loose , especially larger dogs that can actually do damage to someone.

To me , that is the height of irresponsibility.
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I am with you on all accounts. When I am walking around, i CC my Karr K40. I had one pit bull try to attack me once with the owner in plain sight. After yelling at the owner to get the dog to no avail, i unholstered and drew down on the dog. The owner freaked out. i very politely told him to take care of his dog or I would. From that day on, the dude kept his dog on a chain. I still dont' take chances.

If you have a dog, and it's dangerous, keep the darn thing inside or on a leash. period.

Brett
 
Mine is not a pitbull but she is a bully breed and I ain't gonna get into the whole Pitbull debate, I do think though that it is always down to how the owners bring them up !

This was mine over christmas with a relatives baby, she just wouldn't leave him alone and kept kissing him, he loved it and it was the baby that was rough if anything and poked my dog in the eye a couple of times.....that kind of thing doesn't bother a bully breed though, that's why they are also known as Nanny dogs !!!!
baby.jpg
 
There was an incident that happened once when my wife and I were out running a couple miles. (damn, that was a long time ago!)

Anyhoo, my wife was pretty far ahead of me (as usual) and I was huffing and puffing my way up the trail behind her when two pits came rippin' across the street after her. It scared the hell outta her, causing her to come to an immediate stop and slip and fall on the ice, placing her throat nicely at jaw level for them. I ran up as quickly as I could and screamed at them to back away- to no avail. They did however show a bit more respect to the large frame S&W revolver I pointed in thier direction. As soon as I drew down on them they tucked thier tails and ran back to the house from whence they came. Never did see the owners. Musta been a good show of "Friends" that night or something. (house was lit up)

wierd that they knew the gun was bad juju though- I wouldn't have at all enjoyed dealing with them using a knife or being unarmed.

Not getting into the good pit/evil pit thing. I guess my bottom line here is that I think it's kinda asinine to go out walking, hiking, etc. and NOT take such risks into consideration.
 
I fully agree that owners and training or lack thereof are responsible for the vast majority of dog problems. I have had experience with a bull terrier I had though that shows genetics play a part also. She was the sweetest dog in the world with people, cats and other dogs for about five years. Then on a long car trip with her and other dogs we stopped to eat and left her in the back of the station wagon with our Rhodesian Ridgeback, her best friend (very cold out no danger of overheating). For some reason, halfway through the meal I decided to go out to the parking lot to check on the dogs. As I approached the car I noticed the entire rear inside of the car was smeared with blood. Arriving at the car I found the Terrier clamped onto the Rhodesian's ear and refusing to let go, the Rhodie was scared to death (she was even afraid of cats). After several minutes of yelling prying and wrestling I could not get the Terrier to let go. I finally had to choke her unconscious to get those jaws to release. The Rhodie immediately took off down the road to the interstate with me chasing. When all was finally sorted, bandaged,and returned to consciousness the trip continued as before and the Rhodie and the Terrier remained best friends with never another incident until their deaths.

All of my dogs are obedience trained to the point where some of them I competed in trials with but that incident gave me a real eye opener both as to nature overcoming training and previous experience. I have four German Shepherds now and all are totally trustworthy, 100% as well as trained. They all also love my four year old daughter and would I believe kill for her but I have never and will never leave her alone with the dogs even in the other room unless I am with them.
 
Very interesting thread, especially the last post. No matter how well raised and trained, theyre still animals, their brains arent clock work and I guess you never know what might cause their instincts to take over.

Even my old cats can be erratic, rolling around purring one moment, then for no apparent reason theyre latched to your hand clawing you up.

Ive never been attacked by a dog, had to jump a fence to avoid what might have been once, and I always make sure my knife is ready, or find a stick if I see a stray dog, or one off the leash.

I wonder how unarmed defense would go. Do you think a solid kick to the head when theyre rushing you would deter it? If it latches on, would an elbow to the head or spine would scare it off, or would you have to gouge its eyes out?

Too bad having adequate means of defending yourself in canada is illegal.
 
In my limited experience, a kick to the head or ribs will do nothing on an attacking dog. when i lived in phoenix when I was 16, I saw a pit bull rip a girl's scalp completely from her head despit two grown men beating the crap out of the dog. it was a vicious and troubling lesson. A knife, a gun, a bat, mace, whatever you need to use.

take care,
Brett

sketchbag said:
Very interesting thread, especially the last post. No matter how well raised and trained, theyre still animals, their brains arent clock work and I guess you never know what might cause their instincts to take over.

Even my old cats can be erratic, rolling around purring one moment, then for no apparent reason theyre latched to your hand clawing you up.

Ive never been attacked by a dog, had to jump a fence to avoid what might have been once, and I always make sure my knife is ready, or find a stick if I see a stray dog, or one off the leash.

I wonder how unarmed defense would go. Do you think a solid kick to the head when theyre rushing you would deter it? If it latches on, would an elbow to the head or spine would scare it off, or would you have to gouge its eyes out?

Too bad having adequate means of defending yourself in canada is illegal.
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I agree on the owner being at fault. I knew someone once who had a nieghbor who was strung out on drugs and never fed or took care of his pits. The pits terrorized the neighborhood killing other pets and scattering everyones trash and chasing joggers
UNTIL, after repeated calls to the Sheriffs dept and over a dozen conversations with the owner ( who denied his dogs would do that despite being shown PICTURES of what they were doing), Someone...who shall remain nameless, confronted one of the pits on his property with a semi-auto shotgun and a heavy dose of #4's at very close range... the Sheriff was duly notified, and the other pit was disposed of by the owner the next day...
BUT, I still think the owner was at fault.
Good breed if you give them lots of love and attention, bad breed if you abuse them....
 
It may sound ridiculous, and I have never had to try this and I hope I never will but I have been told by K-9 handlers that the neck is the weak spot. I have taken bites from police dogs (on a sleeve) and it feels to me that if you can take the original bite on a forearm you can, if you can keep your cool in a situation like this, use your arm as leverage and the dogs body as a counter weight and while forcing your arm into (I know it's counter intuitive) the dogs mouth and force the head back with all your strength the neck should break realatively easily. Alternatively take the bite and try to jump with all your weight onto the dogs rib cage landing with the points of your knees you should hopefully puncture a lung or heart.

This is simply last ditch though. If at all possible avoid the bite and shoot the dog before he gets a bite.
 
I haven't read every single post in this thread.

I'm sure what I have to say will upset some people, but I could care less. It's my opinion.

There isn't a breed of dog out there that doesn't have a mean streak somewhere in it. Most NEVER show it, but they're animals, it's there. Thing about pit bulls is this; they were trained to handle bulls. They are mean dogs. Every pitbull that has ever lived has it in their bloodline somewhere. You can't say that about most other dogs. Yes, there are some that are similar, but for the most part, they aren't. I have been around pits my whole life. One of my favorite dogs of all time was a pit named Ruger. But that little mofo was meaner than a SOB when someone he didn't like or know came around (mainly kids). My buddy that owned him wasn't mean to him or raise him to be like that, that's just how he was. Sorry, but it's not a cooincidence that pitbulls are responsible for so many deaths. I'm sure there are a lot of other cases in which pits aren't involved, but I don't think anything will top pits. I think Rot's are next on the list. Just a little info I have come up with myself over my time dealing with these dogs.

Cole
 
yes, part of being a responsible owner is recognizing the -potential- problems with a breed.

most rescue/adoption/breeder/show organizations realize and mention that certain breeds are -less- likely to respond well to strangers and/or other dogs.

had one friend that bred Great Pyrenees for show and my best man's girlfriend bred Akitas. both are -standoffish- with strangers and require 'introductions'. both are known to be aggressive with other dogs.

what it comes down to with Pits/Bullys/etc. is that when they do bite, it's bad. i haven't checked that stats for about 2 years, but last i knew Cocker Spaniels were responsible for far and away the most reported bites per year. but with all the hype on Pits, and the damage they -can potentially- do, it becomes more newsworthy.

if i strayed OT, i'm sorry, but i like dogs more than people typically.

back OT: if you have a dog, be a good owner. when you're out it public, realize that many aren't good owners and take what precautions you can to protect yourself for that eventuality.
 
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