Production Emerson Knives Are Not Show Pieces

[WoodenChicken]

A CQC7 costs around $150, I don't find that to be overly expensive for a USA-made, hard use knife. With the wave feature, you have a utility knife that can also be available for a self-defense weapon--no extra charge for that. I've never really understood the argument about the price for these knives, but like I said, I've had the pleasure of actually using the knives for more than another novelty in a "knife collection". I'm not really a knife collector, per se, so I don't baby anything. Actually, I don't really have enough extra money to be a knife collector, but I do use knives and like to buy the best I can. But if I was a knife collector, I doubt I would have much interest in Emersons. They are kind of Plain Jane. On the other hand, I have known many people who have used Emersons, and used them hard. Never heard one complaint about price, or fit and finish.

 

[TEFL0N_D0N_81]

EKI is a small company that is extremely successful in a very competitive industry, so evidently their prices are competitive or else they wouldn't be in business.



It isn't a belief or a marketing statement, it's a fact. A few minutes of research will show that the most popular models are regularly sold out.

...again with the pricing?



Again with the namesake thing? Again with the pricing?



Again with the pricing?
You think other companies are better at the "tangibles" then why are there so many threads touting the awesome warranties from people who have issues with their knives?
Go to some of the other sub forums and read all the complaints about poor sharpening, now look for a thread here, you won't find one.
Why are there so many threads asking "how do I fix...." followed by a ton of responses like "here's what worked for me" or "did you try..."

So don't tell me that other companies charging the same or more for a knife are any better.




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Are they successful? Yup. Are their prices competitive? I don't think so.
And just because they sell well doesn't mean you're getting what you pay for in the tangible product. You're paying for the EKI name.. and I said I'm cool with that. Overall, I have no problem with a company simply charging what they can get customers to pay.

Other companies aren't exempt from this. They've made knives I felt was over priced and I've steered from those knives. I'm not just picking on EKI.

 

[Insipid Moniker]

A CQC7 costs around $150, I don't find that to be overly expensive for a USA-made, hard use knife. With the wave feature, you have a utility knife that can also be available for a self-defense weapon--no extra charge for that. I've never really understood the argument about the price for these knives, but like I said, I've had the pleasure of actually using the knives for more than another novelty in a "knife collection". I'm not really a knife collector, per se, so I don't baby anything. Actually, I don't really have enough extra money to be a knife collector, but I do use knives and like to buy the best I can. But if I was a knife collector, I doubt I would have much interest in Emersons. They are kind of Plain Jane. On the other hand, I have known many people who have used Emersons, and used them hard. Never heard one complaint about price, or fit and finish.

Okay, here's your first one. I have owned Emersons, still own one, used them hard and I have issues with the pricing. My Paramilitary 2, Benchmade 710 and Kershaw Tyrade have all performed just as well and cost less. Again, Emerson makes good knives but, as tools, the price to performance ratio isn't that great. I get that Emerson has a really excellent warranty and that their CS is very good and I appreciate both those things, but for me it doesn't make a 30-80% greater price than other competitive options worth it.

 

[WoodenChicken]

Okay, here's your first one. I have owned Emersons, still own one, used them hard and I have issues with the pricing. My Paramilitary 2, Benchmade 710 and Kershaw Tyrade have all performed just as well and cost less. Again, Emerson makes good knives but, as tools, the price to performance ratio isn't that great. I get that Emerson has a really excellent warranty and that their CS is very good and I appreciate both those things, but for me it doesn't make a 30-80% greater price than other competitive options worth it.

Can't argue with what you say here, since you have experience using all of these knives. My original point, when I started the thread, was not about the price of the Emerson knives. I had said that, in my selling/trading experience, I had run into people who thought that some worn black coating meant that the knife was in bad condition. From that I was commenting that they clearly did not know much about knife use, and that they were more interesting in a shiny knife.

Emerson Knives threads seem to usually go this way, with the complaints about price or sometimes even worse bashing. I've always accepted the price, but I will say that they are not cheap. That being said, I usually obtain them from the secondary market, after they have been used by someone else. I have purchased a couple of new ones over the years.

 

[TEFL0N_D0N_81]

I own 5 Emersons and not one has been returned due to mechanical failure, try again.

Interesting. If not for mechanical failure, what have you returned them for? Something not related to the "meant to be used as tools" feature perhaps? This should be good.

 

[cncpro11]

Interesting. If not for mechanical failure, what have you returned them for? Something not related to the "meant to be used as tools" feature perhaps? This should be good.

Let me amend that for you. I have never returned or needed warranty repair for any Emerson I own.
I work in a die shop and there is always fun stuff to cut...like reinforced high pressure hydraulic hose and heavy duty zip ties.
Lately I have been carrying my Commander sfs or my Sebanza 25. I find the Super Commander to be too big for my needs at work, so it doesn't see much use other than a primary sd blade when I'm out on the town.
Ernie chose a CQC-7 for my little guy to pose for a picture with, so that knife is actually his. He used it last week to tear apart a pallet and pry a bunch of staples out of a 2 x 4.
I am very fortunate to have a disposable income that has allowed me to build a modest collection of around 70 knives with cost being a secondary concern, so I am able to buy what I like, and I like Emerson knives so I buy them.
If most people can be honest with themselves, for day to day tasks a $50 knife is probably more than enough, but I didn't get into this hobby to collect $50 knives but rather to collect what I want and spend what I want.
I hope this helps.

 

[Seilu]

Let me amend that for you. I have never returned or needed warranty repair for any Emerson I own.
I work in a die shop and there is always fun stuff to cut...like reinforced high pressure hydraulic hose and heavy duty zip ties.
Lately I have been carrying my Commander sfs or my Sebanza 25. I find the Super Commander to be too big for my needs at work, so it doesn't see much use other than a primary sd blade when I'm out on the town.
Ernie chose a CQC-7 for my little guy to pose for a picture with, so that knife is actually his. He used it last week to tear apart a pallet and pry a bunch of staples out of a 2 x 4.
I am very fortunate to have a disposable income that has allowed me to build a modest collection of around 70 knives with cost being a secondary concern, so I am able to buy what I like, and I like Emerson knives so I buy them.
If most people can be honest with themselves, for day to day tasks a $50 knife is probably more than enough, but I didn't get into this hobby to collect $50 knives but rather to collect what I want and spend what I want.
I hope this helps.

I may not get to use my knives in such a manner as you, as I live in the Silicon Valley and all we have here are high tech corporations and liberal city folk, I feel that most knives can get said jobs accomplished. Anyways, I certainly know the feeling of confidence that a pocketed Emerson can inspire, albeit at a highly noncompetitive price for what you get.

You really do pay for a name. One of my Seiko watches is more accurate than even my Baume and Mercier. Just an example of the price you pay for exclusivity, exactly like an Emerson.

 

[TEFL0N_D0N_81]

Let me amend that for you. I have never returned or needed warranty repair for any Emerson I own.
I work in a die shop and there is always fun stuff to cut...like reinforced high pressure hydraulic hose and heavy duty zip ties.
Lately I have been carrying my Commander sfs or my Sebanza 25. I find the Super Commander to be too big for my needs at work, so it doesn't see much use other than a primary sd blade when I'm out on the town.
Ernie chose a CQC-7 for my little guy to pose for a picture with, so that knife is actually his. He used it last week to tear apart a pallet and pry a bunch of staples out of a 2 x 4.
I am very fortunate to have a disposable income that has allowed me to build a modest collection of around 70 knives with cost being a secondary concern, so I am able to buy what I like, and I like Emerson knives so I buy them.
If most people can be honest with themselves, for day to day tasks a $50 knife is probably more than enough, but I didn't get into this hobby to collect $50 knives but rather to collect what I want and spend what I want.
I hope this helps.

In that regard, glad you have a knife you enjoy and trust. Too bad we have our differences in what constitutes fair pricing, but I'll respect your difference as I hope you do mine.

 

[cncpro11]

You really do pay for a name. One of my Seiko watches is more accurate than even my Baume and Mercier. Just an example of the price you pay for exclusivity, exactly like an Emerson.

There are many features of an Emerson that draws me to them besides the name, but I can agree with your statement.
I do wonder though, did the Navy Seal who took his CQC-7 with him on the Bin Laden raid consider the name first, or the trustworthiness when he chose it as his duty knife? Off the top of my head I can't think of another production knife that sold for over $31,000 at auction.

In that regard, glad you have a knife you enjoy and trust. Too bad we have our differences in what constitutes fair pricing, but I'll respect your difference as I hope you do mine.

Of course I'll respect your opinion.

 

[Gargs]

I mostly lurk here and every time I read one of these threads I feel caught in an endless loop. I got an Emerson A-100 mini, blade was centered, sharp and everything lined up. Washed it, blew dry, lubed (same with my Military years ago). Threw it in my pocket with keys and change and off we've been going. Today it cut several big boxes that arrived, then got thrown back in the pocket.
I have Sebenza's, more than a few customs and truth be told, I can't make myself carry them because I (like a nut) worry about scratching them or getting pocket fuzz in them. I would be blowing sunshine up my own rear end if I thought I could tell the difference in how the steel performs, so I leave that to the makers. Anyway those knives are nice to look at but hardly used.
Is the Emerson worth what I paid (it's not my first)? If I didn't think so I wouldn't have bought it and I use the crap out of it. Am I am fan, gonna drink from a skull or wear a pirate cap, carry challenge coins...nah. I respect Ernest because he stands for something; has a distinct point-of-view (rather than mere opinions); and continues to work hard to stay where he worked hard to get. Do I get some of the Emerson "vibe" off the knife - sure I do. It's part of the fun, like reading his copy or visiting his site. If I start worry about the cost of screws and do the cost accounting bit - I'll stop having fun and just find something else to spend money on. I like to keep what I enjoy simple.

 

[Lycosa]

I think Ernest said that he sells every knife that EKI makes.
If one understands the Emerson knife, it's pure love man.
rolf

 

[JSMcustoms]

First off I want to extend my thanks to Mr. Emerson for making such a fine cutting tool that has served me well thus far. I've owned my only Emerson, a Mini Commander, for about two months and is a daily carry for me. This knife has been through tons of cardboard, rope, zip ties etc since I've had it. The knife takes a great edge and holds it well while still being fairly easy to resharpen. That being said, here's a few pictures of my Mini Commander's current condition.

The coating has held up better than my expectations. Cerakote is some tough stuff. Bottom line: Is this knife worth the $150 you can find it selling for? Yes.



As others have pointed out, the fit and finish is a little rough, but that doesn't bother me one bit. It's a tool, not something to be looked at and coddled. Even if I purchased something like a Sebenza, it would be used as a knife and not kept in a drawer some place.

 

[dano]

So you equate machining marks or lines not being perfect to a faulty transmission?
I own 5 Emersons and not one has been returned due to mechanical failure, try again.


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How about a scratched up body and dinged-up rims?

 

[HuntBomb]

Good point Dano.
$200 should buy a flawless product.
I like my CQC-15 just fine, but I definitely consider them overpriced, especially after my thumb disk broke off within the first 20 minutes of carrying it. Emerson took care of it through their warranty, but I won't be spending hundreds of $'s on anymore G10/154cm folders.
So expensive for being so basic. And the "wave" feature is not so special IMO.
I also despise the chisel grind.

 

[cncpro11]

How about a scratched up body and dinged-up rims?

Much better comparison, and I don't disagree.
I also own two Sebenzas, superior quality at more than twice the cost.

Good point Dano.
$200 should buy a flawless product.
I like my CQC-15 just fine, but I definitely consider them overpriced, especially after my thumb disk broke off within the first 20 minutes of carrying it. Emerson took care of it through their warranty, but I won't be spending hundreds of $'s on anymore G10/154cm folders.
So expensive for being so basic. And the "wave" feature is not so special IMO.
I also despise the chisel grind.

Whenever I want the latest greatest whatever, I know where to look, and it aint Emerson, and I am fine with that. I know where to look if That's what I want.
In point of fact, I recently read a post by the mod of one of the more popular manufacturers forums and he basically said that the only reason they are successful in such a competitive industry is because they are always trying to please their customers by offering all the latest bells and whistles and then aggressively marketing them.
You think G10 is old news, do you know that many knife makers are still using bone and stag for their handle materials?
Heck, one if the best knives I have ever used is made out of 1075 steel with a chisel grind.
My point is some people go for latest and greatest while others go for tried and true, and nothing is wrong with either.

 

[fzla226]

That's because the majority of forum-dwelling Knife Folks haven't worked in an engineering environment.

Mr. Emerson has 30+ years as a knife maker and tool/die machinist, amongst other things. This background, along with running his own manufacturing facility, allows him to understand the complexity of making a hard use knife manufacturable at a particular price point. Remember that his knives are constructed from Made in USA sourced materials and put together by your neighbor (figuratively). He knows where to apply higher finishing processes (see the stonewashed finish and satin grinds he puts on the knives now) and where not to (who cares is the liners have waterjet cut marks or if the G10 doesn't line up exactly?) to make a knife that is intended for a rough-and-tumble life. Extra finishing on the liners and G10 costs more $$$. Want to pay more for some nicely brushed liners with lightening holes? I don't and neither does the rest of his customer base or else he would do so.

Consumers have now been conditioned to look for the newest, hottest, bestest (?) steel. The coolest handle materials (zirconium - really?). Thickest locks possible and even thicker blade stock, cutting geometry be damned.

When I pick up an Emerson vs. other brands, there is a highly-refined quality to them gets overlooked by others because the oh my gosh the G10 doesn't mate up to the edges of the titanium liner and the blade is slightly off-center these things bother me and have now skewed my view of this particular knife and now I feel compelled to post a YouTube video or a long forum post outlining why I will never be spending money on these knives again!! mentality is here to stay.

More for me I guess. And good on Ernie for honing his business to cater to people that actually look forward to their purchase because they're going to use the hell out of it. Don't get much better than that :thumbup:

How does poor fitting of materials or poor value make a knife more "hard use". Let alone something like a Benchmade Axis lock or similar type of knife would stand up to things that would break that emerson easily and those cost less, and have generally better F&F.

 

[cncpro11]

How does poor fitting of materials or poor value make a knife more "hard use". Let alone something like a Benchmade Axis lock or similar type of knife would stand up to things that would break that emerson easily and those cost less, and have generally better F&F.

Just curious, what do you use your knives for that would cause them to break?

 

[macknife12]

I like my Emersons, great to sharpen and they hold a nice edge.
This is after work today, a few boxes and some nylon twine.
I gave her a few wipes on some paper towel is all. Sorry for the bad phone pic.

Cheers

 

[freewheeling]

The prices are a reflection of the materials, R&D, labor costs, overhead costs for his manufacturing facility, on and on and on and on and on.

Taken in context, the prices (around the $200 mark, less for some models, more for some models) work for the niche Mr. Emerson has created. If anything, the accountants have done an exceptional job.

All the proof you need is to monitor dealer stock as the production runs hit the shelves. Dealers don't hold onto inventory for very long for a reason........

Well, the prices are a reflection of what people will pay and we went beyond the labor theory of value with Adam Smith. I only own two Emersons and they're both karambits. I've looked around and don't think there's a better folding karambit on the market, although the Fox FX599 comes close. The ring on the Fox is too large though, and that's probably a reflection of the guy who modified the design from the 479. The larger Fox knives were made to be worn with gloves and when they shrunk the knife for barehanded use the ring stayed the same size. The larger ring size seemed like a good idea, but again it's too large to ensure control during extensions and retractions so the design is not optimum.

There are problems with just about every brand of knife I've tried and they also all have their good points. You can get a mini-Commander for about $140 and a mini-Roadhouse for about $190. For the same respective prices you can get a ZT0566 and a ZT0801. Are those better deals than the Emersons? To my mind they may be, but it's a judgment call and I'm not aware of all the variables. It's not a slam dunk either way, but I think the edge goes to ZT for those two knives because they're just less likely to *require* warranty service, which increases their relative resale value. But I'd be happy with any of those four knives.

 

[freewheeling]

Plus, we all know that it's the "wave" that keeps Emerson competitive. Once the patent expires on that Emerson had better have something else in the pipeline or they won't be around.