Question about mail tampering

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davec611

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Not sure if this is the right place to put this or not but it is a knife that was tampered with.

I agreed to buy a NIB Emerson Horseman from a private seller. He shipped the knife USPS on Thursday. Saturday at 3pm the mail is delivered to my box. I saw mailman deliver it and went immediately to the mailbox and retrieved the package. I opened it and the Emerson box was inside with a $12 dollar frost cutlery knife inside. I contacted the seller and he stated that was not the knife that he shipped and asked me to check and see if it was damaged or tampered with. I inspected the package and the top had been sliced open and then taped shut. He stated that envelope was not that way when he shipped it and let him know if he can be of any assistance.

I contacted postal inspector and made a complaint about mail tampering. My understanding of PayPal is that they only investigate and make sure an item was shipped not condition of item or correct item was received. Delivery confirmation just verifies SOMETHING was delivered.

I had recently bought another knife from the seller and it was a smooth and pleasant transaction. I have no reason/evidence to believe he is being dishonest.

Seven years of selling items and I have never had anything like this happen. Anyone have something similar happen, or have any advice on what I should do other than I now have a $130 dollar frost cutlery knife?

Dave
 
What are the chances that someone would KNOW there was a knife inside the package and have a cheapo frost cutlery knife on them to throw into the box to replace it? You'd think it'd just be easier to steal the whole package.
 
230grains said:
What are the chances that someone would KNOW there was a knife inside the package and have a cheapo frost cutlery knife on them to throw into the box to replace it? You'd think it'd just be easier to steal the whole package.
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I agree. Also, if I am correct the only possible suspects are postal workers. He stated that he dropped it off at post office and I picked it out of mailbox as soon as it was delivered.

Dave
 
Its nearly impossible for postal worker to know where is knife and take that package and happening so that he happends to have some cheap Frost Cutlery knife he replaced it with. Most peoples do not know difference between Emersson's and Frost Cutlery's quality unless they are knife nuts.

I keep a lot more plausiable that seller tried to double cross you. Ask refund's and return the box. There ain't much what you can do. Its not that you can simply take finger prints of that frost cutlery knife and compeare if they match the seller's... I wish it would be that simple. There wasn't any shipping manifest with it, where people could have seen the content? Then some less decent postal worker might have swapped knife but it does sound... bit unbelievable.

I would check the seller's reputation if possible, the feedback etc.
 
The only other explanation is that someone at the seller's local PO knew what the seller was shipping. I live in a small town and many times while waiting on line I've heard customers telling the clerk what they are shipping. Sometimes very loudly and in great detail.
Of course it's still wrong and the empolyee is taking a huge risk.
 
I would be suspicious of the seller, but I don't think the idea that it was tampered with is completely unreasonable either.

What are the chances that someone would KNOW there was a knife inside the package and have a cheapo frost cutlery knife on them to throw into the box to replace it?
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If it was a dishonest postal worker they'd likely have a knife on them already for opening packages to steal. Maybe when they opened this one they thought "oh I'll just switch it with mine to put suspicion on the seller".
 
davec611 said:
Not sure if this is the right place to put this or not but it is a knife that was tampered with.

[ ... ] I inspected the package and the top had been sliced open and then taped shut. He stated that envelope was not that way when he shipped it and let him know if he can be of any assistance.

I contacted postal inspector and made a complaint about mail tampering. [ ... ]
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Not much I can say at this point, but ...

Comments or complaints on deals go in FEEDBACK, so I moved the thread.

Do I understand the Emerson box was in an envelope? That would be grossly insufficient packaging. Wasn't the box with the knife in it shifting around when you picked up the envelope?

That's too easy for a thief to guess what might be in there and easy to open, filch, and reseal.

Let's see what the Postal Inspectors do. They can be very good, and every report of theft helps them focus in on who could be doing it.
 
Sorry about where I posted this. I wasn't sure where it should go. I meant it as a has anyone had anything like this happen and does anyone have advice what I should do.

I guess I need to reevaluate how I ship as well. I have done the inside padded envelopes. I usually wrap the knife in bubble wrap and then put it in the box to keep it from shipping.

Actually fingerprinting is an option. I am considered LEO (parole/probation) and have a good friend at the SO that told me he would do fingerprints. The issue is whether person who did it has been fingerprinted. We shall see.
 
Seems suspicious that the seller would ask you to check if it was tampered with right off the bat, IMO it makes him look guilty. I know if I was selling something and someone told me the knife wasn't the correct one I would check around to make sure I didn't send the wrong one and then talk with the buyer to make sure they weren't pulling the wool over my eyes. To instantly suspect tampering on the postal services part is very suspicious. I'm sorry but I have more trust in the postal service than I do in individuals selling items over the internet.
 
davec611 said:
Actually fingerprinting is an option. I am considered LEO (parole/probation) and have a good friend at the SO that told me he would do fingerprints. The issue is whether person who did it has been fingerprinted. We shall see.
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Tell the Postal Inspectors that. They are Federal LEOs. If you get good prints off the knife, they may find a match within USPS or get prints from the seller. If I were the seller, I would volunteer mine, knowing they would exonerate me. Although mine are on file anyway. :)
 
Is there a shipping weight listed on the package and how much does it weigh now?

I personally find it hard to believe a Postal Worker would have the time and knowledge to pull a specific item from all the packages they deal with and be able to swap a specific item out.

He shipped the knife USPS on Thursday. Saturday at 3pm the mail is delivered to my box.
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That knife was moving. When was there a chance to tamper with the mail?


let him know if he can be of any assistance.
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Is he pursueing the issue or helping you pursue it? I'd be pretty steamed if something I shipped was tampered with. I'd be agressively pursuing this.


Mitch
 
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Mitch, you would have to know where the mail came from and went to, and how the different offices along the way operated.

We have had people on a crowded workfloor, sitting next to rows of other people, all sorting mail into pigeon-holes, manage to steal from envelopes. They grow a thumbnail a little longer and file it sharp. When they get an envelope with coins rattling in it, the thumbnail slits the bottom just enough for the coins to be tipped into the thief's hand. Loose dollar bills in a thin envelope can be detected and stolen similarly. So can credit cards.

In a small post office, a possible valuable item in a padded envelope can be pushed aside till everyone else is on break, then opened and taken.
 
AKnife said:
Seems suspicious that the seller would ask you to check if it was tampered with right off the bat, IMO it makes him look guilty.
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I don't think so. That's exactly how a seller would react if they had honestly shipped the knife. If the seller honestly shipped the Emerson, when confronted with this story he knows one of two things happened, either the buyer is lying (which he's not going to say to the buyer) or someone from the postal service stole it.

Do I understand the Emerson box was in an envelope? That would be grossly insufficient packaging. Wasn't the box with the knife in it shifting around when you picked up the envelope?
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Exactly! When you think about that, and the fact that postal workers are a profession that need and carry knives (as we've pointed out), then it doesn't seem that implausible. I would never buy from that particular seller again, but I also don't think it's conclusive that the seller is a conman either.
 
It's a hideous situation, did the seller pack it himself or does he have others who do the packing?...that might need investigating.

I find it suspicious that postal workers or delivery people would risk or bother tampering with a packet and then replace an item&tape it all up, too time consuming&risky, They would just steal the whole thing surely?
 
I'd say check the weight of the package against the shipping weight. If it's different (price wise) then it was tampered with, if not the seller shipped you the wrong knife.
 
Why would a thief go to the trouble of putting a junk knife in the package and taping it back shut and putting it back into the postal system?

Wouldn't they just take the knife and dump the packaging?
 
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Here is the package. The only thing in the envelope was the Emerson box and the knife. Where does it say what the weight was/is?

I have placed a complaint on line with the Postal Inspector and I am trying to get the SO to find time for a report. We have had lots of cuts in rural Ohio but they are going to try and do a report for me.

The more I think about it the more it has to be the buyer, the seller or someone in the home of the two. There just doesn't seem time/opportunity for anyone else. I have asked the seller several times and have yet to get a response to whether he shipped from Post Office himself or placed in box or other.

I am contacting PayPal but since this was the second knife I bought off him i did send as gift this time. I can't dispute a gift.

The seller seems to have taken the stance that isn't the knife he mailed so it isn't his issue. My responsibility to figure it out. I am trying to keep thinking how would I be if I knew I mailed the right item and someone was telling me they received something different.

I just CAN"T BELIEVE something bad has happened twice in two months and never before in the 5 years I have been selling on ebay, glocktalk and other forums.

Dave
 
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