SAK Mods! Post your pics, questions and ideas

[hsherzfeld]

Guy's(?) Disassembly Method

As a quick refresher, these were the criteria:

-removes the pin without drilling or cutting it
-preserves nearly the entire length of the pin all the way up to the rivet
-has a guaranteed 100% success rate to save the bushing
-does not require destroying the SAK parts (ie: the liners, sideplates, springs, spacers, and tools) to accomplish
-does not involve sawing between the layers
-always works regardless of which layers are present
-only works on the center pin; does not apply to the outside pivots or the back tools pivot

It looks like nobody else knows this method and nobody else figured it out in time based on the criteria that were given. Maybe that means it's my own method? So then, here is the description for how to accomplish both variations of it.


Variant 1: the pinch approach, moderate difficulty

1. Start by filing down the rivet on one side of the back tools pivot and then drive that pivot out with a punch or a small nail. This pivot has no bushings, so we don't need to worry about saving them. You can drill this pivot out if you really want to, but why risk damaging the sideplate?

2. With the back tools pivot gone, you can either push or rotate out the springs. You may also want to open the tools from the two outside layers to get them out of the way. Typically the outside layers are the knife layer and the bottle/can opener layer, but it doesn't matter just as long as you make sure that their tools aren't in the way.

3. Now pinch the aluminum sideplates so that they bow inwards. This will not damage the sideplates; they won't stay permanently bent unless you inexplicably decide to use enough force to crush the SAK for some reason.

4. Pinching the sideplates will free the center pin to move up or down, which allows you to move one of the bushings away from its pin head.

5. With the bushing out of the way, you can now file around the edges of the pin head until its diameter is small enough for the bushing to slide past it, thus freeing the entire pin. Alternatively, you can simply file the whole pin head off. It's quicker and easier, but it will preserve slightly less of the total pin length.


Variant 2: the last pin approach, easy level

1. Save the center pin's removal for last. With all 3 of the tool pivots gone, the only remaining parts still attached will be the sideplates and the liners, with the center pin holding them together.

2. Push the sideplates and liners over to one end of the pin so that they all rest on top of each other like a stack of pancakes. The opposite end of the pin is now completely free for you to work on.

3. On the free side of the pin, move the bushing away from the pin head. You can now file around the edges of the pin head until its diameter is small enough for the bushing to slide past it, thus freeing the entire pin.


And it's that simple! I have to say that I'm really surprised nobody else thought of this.

So in my opinion, here's the most significant thing about this method of SAK disassembly: it allows you to avoid having to drill out both of the small pins, which makes causing damage to either the sideplate or the bushings incredibly unlikely, since the other two pins happen to also be the largest ones. The larger size of those two pivots makes them a lot easier to drill without causing damage to anything else.

Well, at least that's true on a 91mm SAK... On an 84mm SAK, all of the pins are the same size! But this disassembly method will still let you remove up to half of the pins without drilling, which still effectively decreases your odds of making a mistake. The fewer pins you have to drill, the lower your chances are of messing something up.


Have a great weekend, everyone! Stay healthy and stay safe!

That is an interesting method, and one that I’ve never considered. It would have to be done very carefully to avoid bending the aluminum liners, but even bent liners are more salvageable than drilled liners.

 

[Guy McVer]

That is an interesting method, and one that I’ve never considered. It would have to be done very carefully to avoid bending the aluminum liners, but even bent liners are more salvageable than drilled liners.

I’d unfortunately also call it unadvisable for how easy it is to permanently deform aluminum. When you reassemble a knife like that, you might reconsider depending how it operates.

I didn't have any problems with the liners bending when I did it, and I've got the build assembled for testing as of this morning (it's not peened yet), but upon further reflection I do think bending the liners is a valid concern.

Still, if you have a ball peen hammer, a bent liner can be a fun lesson in how to reshape metal. Ask me how I know. It's similar to how I've seen my uncle fix damaged auto body panels. You might be amazed what you can accomplish just by hitting something.

It's probably best to avoid using the pinch approach, but maybe there's a situation where it would be useful. The last pin approach would be the best to use, I think.

I’d gladly call it ‘Guy’s 4th pin removal protocol’.

Call it whatever you like. I've learned a ton of free information about modding on here and from other places around the net, and I'd just be happy to contribute something back that's hopefully helpful in some way, even if it's only a small thing.

 

[Guy McVer]

Does any one have some special tools or trix when putting the knife together after reassembling it? Do you start and finish attaching everyting in a special order?

When I reassemble a 91mm SAK, I start with the can opener side scale on the bottom and stack up from there; the bIade side comes last. I do this because the can opener side of the knife will sit flat on a pounding surface, but the corkscrew/Philips prevents the blade side from sitting flat.

Adding to this, it goes a lot easier if you give yourself a little extra length on the brass rods and you file the ends on one side to have a slight taper. I saw some footage from the actual factory in Switzerland and it looks like this is how they were assembling one of the knives by hand. You can cut the tapered ends off before peening.

Personally, I think it's a good idea to assemble the knife without the back tools pivot, and then add that pivot as the final step. This way the tools are nice and cooperative during assembly because there's no tension on the springs. Putting a taper on the back tools pivot makes it go in super easy with a couple good whacks from your peening hammer, and then you're all set to trim and peen.

 

[hsherzfeld]

Adding to this, it goes a lot easier if you give yourself a little extra length on the brass rods and you file the ends on one side to have a slight taper. I saw some footage from the actual factory in Switzerland and it looks like this is how they were assembling one of the knives by hand. You can cut the tapered ends off before peening.

Personally, I think it's a good idea to assemble the knife without the back tools pivot, and then add that pivot as the final step. This way the tools are nice and cooperative during assembly because there's no tension on the springs. Putting a taper on the back tools pivot makes it go in super easy with a couple good whacks from your peening hammer, and then you're all set to trim and peen.

I’ve always assembled with the back tools pivot in place. This has the advantage of ensuring that all the tools are positioned correctly, with the spring tension holding everything in place. The downside is having to force the spring back to fit the last tool in each layer.

I will try your method next time.

When you add the back tool pivots, do you have the back tools in the open or closed position?

 

[Guy McVer]

When you add the back tool pivots, do you have the back tools in the open or closed position?

Closed. The open position causes more tension on the spring. Without the pivot in place, the pivot hole will be farther out of alignment with the tool in the open position.

The taper on the end of the back tools pivot is important. It won't work very well without it. The taper allows the pivot to go in smoothly and easily and draw the back side tools into alignment.

I’ve always assembled with the back tools pivot in place. This has the advantage of ensuring that all the tools are positioned correctly, with the spring tension holding everything in place. The downside is having to force the spring back to fit the last tool in each layer.

If you do a tool swap on the back side, such as corkscrew to Phillips mod, then you end up in a situation where you are driving in the back pivot as the other two tool pivots are already in place. They're already peened too because you never disassembled those pins in the first place. That's where this idea comes from. It works surprisingly well.

I can imagine you would have some difficulty if the tools got knocked out of position while you are trying to put the back side pivot in, so they need to be held in place firmly.

 

[kamakiri.knives]

I will try your method next time.

I like your willingness to try something new. I’ve only worked the back pin solo or last like I’ve shown earlier passing compressive forces from a punch to the pin and back. Mostly so the tools aren’t released by accident. Since your an engineer, you’d know the forces on the center pin are roughly double that if either end pin, right?

Victorinox uses a taper during assembly, even in their workstation jigs, because there is still a bit of misalignment as the individual layers are completed. Each additional liner would be progressively more difficult to install if the pins weren’t tapered or had significant extra length.

Looking forward to your comments after you try.

 

[Guy McVer]

When you add the back tool pivots, do you have the back tools in the open or closed position?

Closed. The open position causes more tension on the spring. Without the pivot in place, the pivot hole will be farther out of alignment with the tool in the open position.

Also be sure to have the other tools on the two side pivots fully open. This combination allows the easiest alignment and assembly.

Front side tools, all fully open. Back side tools, all fully closed.

I have recently done this assembly method without a jig while holding the SAK in in my hands. You can tell how far the back side pivot has gone through by feeling the spring tension on the tools. Strong tension = fully through that layer. Weak tension = partially through that layer. No tension = pivot has not reached that layer yet.

 

[kamakiri.knives]

Also be sure to have the other tools on the two side pivots fully open. This combination allows the easiest alignment and assembly.

The bulk of end tools use the same spring preload open or closed. You can verify by looking at the ends of the backspring in either position and comparing. Unlike the slide lock spring, it drops into the frame a lot when the blade is open (which is how the lock engages) and the force on the tang is reduced. Most other main blades are slightly opposite and have a bit more preload when open. Another big exception are the ‘85+ caplifters. More preload at 90°, and even more fully open.

 

[Guy McVer]

The bulk of end tools use the same spring preload open or closed. You can verify by looking at the ends of the backspring in either position and comparing. Unlike the slide lock spring, it drops into the frame a lot when the blade is open (which is how the lock engages) and the force on the tang is reduced. Most other main blades are slightly opposite and have a bit more preload when open. Another big exception are the ‘85+ caplifters. More preload at 90°, and even more fully open.

When you're doing this, the springs and tools won't stay in position unless the tools are fully open. Otherwise they won't cooperate. The tools flop around, which pushes against the springs, and this moves the holes. It's best to just have the tools open (but not the back tools, which should be closed). They'll stay in place with just a tiny bit of pressure on the spring.

 

[kamakiri.knives]

When you're doing this, the springs and tools won't stay in position unless the tools are fully open. Otherwise they won't cooperate. The tools flop around, which pushes against the springs, and this moves the holes. It's best to just have the tools open (but not the back tools, which should be closed). They'll stay in place with just a tiny bit of pressure on the spring.

The 4th pin takes care of the lateral movement in the outer 3-tool ‘Spartan’ layers. I’d leave those closed.
Layers that have a retained backspring end (like scissors, saws, scaler, and pliers) will also have no lateral movement issues. I’d leave those closed too.

 

[Guy McVer]

I figured out a variation of this method of assembly that allows you to build the SAK one layer at a time. This again requires no jig. It also requires no pushing on the springs to get the tools in place.

You start by assembling the first layer with only the two outside pivots. Assemble the whole layer; the sideplate, the front side tool(s), the spring, and the back side tool. Everything. Then you top it off with the liner for the next layer.

Now insert your tapered back side pivot through the sideplate first. Push it through the back tool, and through the liner so only the tip pokes out. This is the first layer and the pivot is tapered, so you should be able to just push the pivot through by hand.

The first layer is assembled! Stop at this point. Only a small part of the tapered end of the back tool pivot should be poking through the liner! Do not push the pivot any farther!

Now assemble your next layer. The whole layer, again only on the two outside pivots. Top it off again with a liner. Notice how the tip of the back pivot is poking part way into the hole of the back tool, but since it's the small end of the tapered part, it doesn't push on the tool and doesn't cause any spring tension. Pick up your peening hammer, and tap the back tools pivot through this layer until just the tip is poking out through the other side.

See how simple this is? Repeat until you've assembled every layer. As a last step, push the center pin in by hand. Seriously, it should easily go in by hand. No hammering needed. A slight taper on the pin will make this easier, though.

Notice how easy this is. We are putting each layer together under zero spring tension, and then the back tools pivot comes in and tightens up the spring for each layer as we move on to the next one. We go one layer at a time, and we can even stop at any moment and reverse the process if we want. We never need to struggle with pushing on the springs to get everything together. It's almost too easy.

With this method, assembling the SAK has become effortless! Anyone can do it!

 

[Guy McVer]

Please excuse the "Camping" scales. They were just on hand.

Front side tools: main blade, small blade, scissors, inline Phillips driver, magnifying glass, metal saw, wood saw, cap lifter, can opener.
Back side tools: corkscrew, parcel hook, small flat screwdriver (a.k.a. "dolphin"), chisel, awl.

I have been wanting this tool configuration on a SAK for a while... except for the magnifying glass. I've never been a fan of the magnifier, but it is kinda growing on me.

Here you can see that the inline Phillips driver is roughly centered. This layout makes accessing the metal file's nail nick a bit awkward. You have to open the Phillips driver first. Correction: Evidently if you have normal fingernails then you can access the file's nail nick just fine... Apparently I'm just a weirdo who cuts my nails super short because I care about having good hygiene.

The parcel hook is next to the corkscrew, which makes it easier to open since the key ring isn't in the way.

The chisel has been moved all the way over next to the awl. This makes the chisel a lot easier to use. A cutout had to be made in the liner to make the chisel's nail nick accessible. The dolphin screwdriver must also be opened before the chisel can be accessed.

Also you might notice there's a small gap between the Phillips layer's backspring and one of the liners next to it. Oops! I think I know exactly how that happened, and it was definitely my fault. Oh well. It's probably too late to fix now. All of the tools have a good snap and there's no sideplay, so this is just a small cosmetic issue.





This SAK was made by combining an old 91mm Ranger with the inline Phillips layer from an old 91mm Explorer. The Ranger was pretty beaten up and had to be completely disassembled in order to restore it, so it made sense to just go ahead and mod it at that point. This took a bit of work. I had to sand all of the liners, and I ended up having to customize two of them.

I consider this to be a "rough draft". If I did this again I would tweak it a little bit and I would use newer parts.

 

[kamakiri.knives]

I had to sand all of the liners, and I ended up having to customize two of them.

Was wondering where some of the parts came from until I read this..

That‘s certainly an interesting arrangement you got there! Good job saving a couple of knives and getting another mod under your belt.

 

[Guy McVer]

The awl is 2mm, so only about 0.25mm thicker than the SD or Chisel.

!

For some reason I had it in my head that the awl was thinner. I was all set to use a washer as a spacer to fit the awl in the back of a saw layer. That won't work, will it? Even if the base of the awl is filed down it still won't fit because the whole tool has to sit in the slot when it is closed. That means one entire side of the awl has to be filed down 1/4th of a millimeter to make it fit.

 

[kamakiri.knives]

!

For some reason I had it in my head that the awl was thinner. I was all set to use a washer as a spacer to fit the awl in the back of a saw layer. That won't work, will it?

It’s well into the ‘maybe’ range. Might not cause any operation issues and could just be a cosmetic one. I suggest mocking it up to get a better idea.

Even if the base of the awl is filed down it still won't fit because the whole tool has to sit in the slot when it is closed. That means one entire side of the awl has to be filed down 1/4th of a millimeter to make it fit.

Yes, but not necessarily for all awls. An awl from ~1980 to 1986 (later if 84mm) is tapered for most of its length. Much less would need to be cut/milled away, and mostly from the base side. Only the c. ‘85-‘86 side eoukd have the eye, if desired. An Explorer with the collar around the 4th pin would likely have this awl. In pics of the back side, the tapered awls are pretty easy to spot.

Knowledge about part interchange or sources, is why I got into chronology.

 

[Guy McVer]

An awl from ~1980 to 1986 (later if 84mm) is tapered for most of its length. Much less would need to be cut/milled away, and mostly from the base side.

I bought some old junker on a whim. It's completely trashed but the price was right, so I figured I would use it for parts.

It has an awl with no sewing eye. That means it's from before 1985.

The 91/84mm version with a sewing-eye, prior to 1985 it did not have a sewing-eye.

source: https://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Reamer

The corkscrew is fluted and the key ring attachment is on the spacer for the secondary blade.

 

[kamakiri.knives]

I bought some old junker on a whim. It's completely trashed but the price was right, so I figured I would use it for parts.

It has an awl with no sewing eye. That means it's from before 1985.


source: https://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Reamer

The corkscrew is fluted and the key ring attachment is on the spacer for the secondary blade.

Does it have an awl with a tip grind, the taper or neither? All of those are possible, but otherwise look mostly the same. Unless you’re crazy like me and can spot most of the annual differences.

Good luck, it has more than 50% chance of being what you want.

 

[Guy McVer]

Does it have an awl with a tip grind, the taper or neither?

I don't know. I'm ignorant about this stuff.

If it looks like the tip is kinda worn down, is that a "tip grind"?

All of those are possible, but otherwise look mostly the same.

Good luck, it has more than 50% chance of being what you want.

 

[Lee D]

Not much of a mod, but my Super Tinker is getting a new set of scales and black toothpick and tweezers today.

 

[Barbababa]

They both started out as 84mm Sportsman

https://imgur.com/TkiOSJ3

The latest, wich is more of a mod than a build. I just acid washed the tools and made new scales in Ivory Snake Juma. And new brass pins...

https://imgur.com/hTxnQMZ

I made a brass pocket clip for the amber bone build, now I need to make one for the Albino Mamba as well
I am going to thin it down a little more, not as thin as the other, just 1/2-1mm
It almost felt like cheating when keeping the original aluminum liners and only do new scales. On the positive side it was very quick and is almost as light as original

https://imgur.com/dLbQUZc