Sebenza 25 Lock up question....

Muaddib1116 said:
That was well said. I think everyone needs to just take a step back and cool down a bit. d.weglarz13 may have started a bunch of threads about one central issue, and he may have gotten a bit hyperbolic in his anxiety, but I don't think he ever attempted to speak badly about CRK as a company. At the same time, I think a lot of people overreact to anything they see as criticism towards their knife maker of choice. I'm loathe to use the term fanboy, but I detect hints of it on these forums every now and then. I've read a number of threads where people go and drag a companies name through the mud, before even talking to them, but I don't see that as the case here.
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well said
 
hoppes no9 said:
Amen.
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except many others here have posted their 25 lock up is NOT at 95%. So then using that logic can say that many CRKs are not meeting his own spec and leaving his factory substandard based on how he wants it. jmclfrsh has two, and had a 3rd, at 50%. So there is some disconnect either in communication or quality control.
 
In general, the tone of this thread has been peaceful and courteous--just the way we like it in the CRK forum. However, there have been some negative attitudes and questionable language presented as well--just the things I don't like to see in the CRK forum. I realize I am not a mod and am just another CRK guy, but please keep it respectable.

On topic:
I agree in full with Unit's assessment. I also agree with the sentiment that the early lockup craze is somewhat of a fad and has little bearing on the quality or useful life of a knife. My small Insingo has an 80% lockup (give or take a percentage or two) and it has not moved at all in several years. Others have had similar experiences with theirs as well.

I am interested to see the outcome of this and will keep an eye on this thread for updates when the OP hears back from CRK.
 
fan of fanboys said:
except many others here have posted their 25 lock up is NOT at 95%. So then using that logic can say that many CRKs are not meeting his own spec and leaving his factory substandard based on how he wants it. jmclfrsh has two, and had a 3rd, at 50%. So there is some disconnect either in communication or quality control.
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Or users definition of percentage of lockup which seems to be all over
Which face is the definition of lockup taken from? How is it measured..Is it to the face of the lockbar to the opposite scale? Is it from the detent to the opposite scale? Anyone using measuring instruments or just guestimating?
 
fan of fanboys said:
Have you considered not being a negative a$$hole?
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I don't think his statement was based on this thread alone, but on a number of threads the OP has posted since acquiring the knife-starting with sending his 1st back to the dealer. It is a bit of a strange pattern.
 
bhyde said:
Or users definition of percentage of lockup which seems to be all over
Which face is the definition of lockup taken from? How is it measured..Is it to the face of the lockbar to the opposite scale? Is it from the detent to the opposite scale? Anyone using measuring instruments or just guestimating?
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That is true. But I think some saying 50% and some saying in 90% range is pretty big gap. If everyone was above 75% or so I think would matter more.

Personally I do not care about lock up. Wherever manufacture has it is good for me. They know way more than I do. And OP may very well be an idiot, though I think he just was trying to vent and has been attacked and he has tried to clarify his stance but some posters don't seem to care, but even if an idiot has the right and freedom to do so.

He was not bad mouthing CRK, he mentions he loves knives and CRK knives, he tried to contact them before original thread, and then created this thread with an update. I don't see reason for such huge outrage that he is receiving.
 
Peter Hartwig said:
I don't think his statement was based on this thread alone, but on a number of threads the OP has posted since acquiring the knife-starting with sending his 1st back to the dealer. It is a bit of a strange pattern.
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fair enough. But many other posters here and been able to offer differing perspective, advice, and opinions without being as rude. this forum (the website, not just CRK sub-forum) has a reputation of being rude and other sites mention it and there is even a sticky somewhere referencing that.

That said there are also a ton, even vast majority, of great posters and helpful people on here.
 
MostMenAreRuthless said:
I also agree with the sentiment that the early lockup craze is somewhat of a fad and has little bearing on the quality or useful life of a knife.
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So based on that it is personal preference? So why when other aspects of knife are personal preference, such as scales or colors or scotchbrite, embraced but wanting a diff lock up point results in OP being insulted and degraded? If lock up truly has little bearing on the quality or useful life.
 
fan of fanboys said:
That is true. But I think some saying 50% and some saying in 90% range is pretty big gap. If everyone was above 75% or so I think would matter more.

Personally I do not care about lock up. Wherever manufacture has it is good for me. They know way more than I do. And OP may very well be an idiot, though I think he just was trying to vent and has been attacked and he has tried to clarify his stance but some posters don't seem to care, but even if an idiot has the right and freedom to do so.

He was not bad mouthing CRK, he mentions he loves knives and CRK knives, he tried to contact them before original thread, and then created this thread with an update. I don't see reason for such huge outrage that he is receiving.
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That is why I asked the question..the gap that you are talking about could account for some guessing from detent to opposite scale and others from the backside of the lockbar to the opposite scale which would cover a wide range. Or if you prefer measuring to the blade base. My point is, unless there is a standard point in which to measure from..it's all subjective.
 
fan of fanboys said:
So based on that it is personal preference? So why when other aspects of knife are personal preference, such as scales or colors or scotchbrite, embraced but wanting a diff lock up point results in OP being insulted and degraded? If lock up truly has little bearing on the quality or useful life.
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I am not sure these concepts are the same. Late lockup may be desired by the creator of the frame lock and the subject knife based on design or safety requirements and not a simple preference. Colors and finishes are more likely not a consequence to design/specifications considerations (that is, scale finishes and color options (CGG) variations probably do not result in increased incidences of failure, but non-compliance with lock specifications may)

One thing seems evident, and that is Chris stands to lose the most from a poor design (or specification problem), couple this with his experience with the design, and I see no compelling reason to favor forum preference over his specifications.

As you point out, some report earlier lockup on similar models. This could be attributed to measurement error, or they could actually have very early lockup. Let is assume that they do...do these subjective and unverified observations warrant precedence over current stated standards from the maker's shop/employees? Do they preclude the possibility that the specifications may have been updated since the build date of the units in question? These are things I don't have answers to...so I'll take the OP at his word that CRK changed his lockup and stated that what he reports to have observed most recently is within the desired specs.
 
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I really wouldnt worry about the lockup. Ive been using my 25 every single day for over 2 years now with moderate use and it was around -+90% and hasnt moved a hair on the arse of a tsetse fly.
 
Muaddib1116 said:
Um... judging by all the thread about lock up percentage, apparently lots of people.
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But why..... To prolong the life of the knife? I have never witnessed a sebenza with vertical play. Had Sebenzas for years at lock up past 75%
and never move from that spot. All the worry about lock percentage when it comes to Sebenzas are ridiculous.
 
I think that is definitely a reason a lot of people prefer earlier lockup. Sebenza's (as well as other CRK folders) are rare in how well the lock-bar interfaces with the tang. The exceptional interface means that wear is extremely mitigated, proved by the many stories of late lockup Sebenza's not changing after years of use. Other knives (which comprise the vast majority of most people's liner-lock and frame-lock experience) do not have such a good fit, and often wear a lot over time, causing the lock to travel all the way across the tang. This is probably what causes this phobia in most knife lovers.

Personally, since I understand that CRK folders won't wear as much as lesser knives, don't have a problem with late lock-up, but at the same time, I really don't mind slightly earlier lockup if my CRK happens to come that way. For me, it is because of how much I like to open and close my knife, and an earlier lockup makes my thumb motion just a little shorter when I disengage the lock. This is however, not a deal maker or breaker for me.
 
Muaddib1116 said:
I think that is definitely a reason a lot of people prefer earlier lockup. Sebenza's (as well as other CRK folders) are rare in how well the lock-bar interfaces with the tang. The exceptional interface means that wear is extremely mitigated, proved by the many stories of late lockup Sebenza's not changing after years of use. Other knives (which comprise the vast majority of most people's liner-lock and frame-lock experience) do not have such a good fit, and often wear a lot over time, causing the lock to travel all the way across the tang. This is probably what causes this phobia in most knife lovers.

Personally, since I understand that CRK folders won't wear as much as lesser knives, don't have a problem with late lock-up, but at the same time, I really don't mind slightly earlier lockup if my CRK happens to come that way. For me, it is because of how much I like to open and close my knife, and an earlier lockup makes my thumb motion just a little shorter when I disengage the lock. This is however, not a deal maker or breaker for me.
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True, can't really say the same for other knives which is why I only said Sebenzas. But even so I think we need to dispel the notion that early lockup should be preferred on
framelocks. I'm talking 15% and less. Its just not safe. The chance of the lock slipping or shearing just isn't worth the "extra" life of the lock bar. Besides thats what warranty
departments are for :)
 
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