seriously... knife bubble?

sloth357

sloth357

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I feel as though the past year a lot of frame locks have sky rocketed in price.. and for no apparent reason that I can see... It must all boil down to "rarity" and how "in" a maker is at the time..

And I don't see how this inflated price for frame locks seems to easily translate to all makers... making all knives, good/bad/great equally over priced... A $600 folder suddenly trying to be sold for $1500 or $2k... HOW SMOOTH can it be.. I don't gold on these knives... hardly engraving, and very slight milling... so to be in "the club" people are shelling out huge sums for these knives to then just try to eeekk out a hundred or so here and there.. Half the time to find, THEY ARE THE ONLY ONE that will pay that stupid price.

It's like OH NOES, nobody wants my $2000 Ti frame lock now.. and WHAT $1800 isn't a big enough discount! COmE On GuYS HELP ME OUT AND SAVE ME hahahahahah

So. My point? It's stupid :D But also, is this something others have noticed or has it always been so out of control???

My limit is about $500.. I've seriously consider a $1300 folder, but it has serious engraving on it by a true artist and some gold :) Otherwise, for Ti framelocks with superconductor or carbon fiber, over $500 just seems... like a fad.
 
You're probably gonna get blown out of the water by haters, but I agree. There isn't much special about a lot of high priced designs, unless they truly are one of a kind. Seems like a waste to pay that much for a knife unless you really love it, or you count it as a calculated business venture.

However, I don't believe the framelock has anything to do with it. The framelock is just an easily accessible, upgraded version of the liner lock that most makers can use instead of making their own lock. It seems to be simple expedience and bare bones design.
 
Common sense tells me the prices should be falling since there are so many makers making them now. But I agree, I have seen prices go way up as well for some makers. Recently an online knife retailer was selling El Patron's for over $800... I almost spit out my coffee. It seemed like a year ago they were $350. IIRC
 
seriously?
i doubt any sane person would be willing to fork out more than "extra money" to finance their habits.
owning an over valued knife might make one feel accomplished for whatever apparent reason to do so.
it is however, the right to make personal choices that one eventually learns how to value what one has.
good luck to anyone keeping up with the Joneses,
as flaunting comes at a price few can follow.
shrewd opportunist know that the world is ever hungry for bling-bling.
design and workmanship can easily up the value
even though the real price lies with the materials in use.
but only works of renown masters will stand the test of time...
 
It seems knifes have become more akin to a high dollar fashion watch than a tool for many. It's not just knives, people just seem to be willing to pay a lot more for many things these days. You'd be amazed how many $2000-$3000 spotting scopes, binoculars, 1911's, AR15's, mountain bikes, SLR cameras, Grills, etc. I see regular middle class people buying and using. If you told people 15 years ago that Lowes and Home Depot would be not only stocking but selling $2000 BBQ grills they'd laugh at you in disbelief.

It's not just high dollar knives either, more and more people are willing to spend $200-$300 on a mass production knife now. Some of that is justified, I'd say the average nice BM/Spyderco and more recently ZT is significantly better quality than they were 10-15 years ago, and I don't think Reeve, Microtech, Strider etc. have basically stayed the same, so the quality gap has closed significantly, and the prices of the production models should reflect that somewhat, and there are still great knives to be had for well under $150.

In the end as long as the consumers are willing to pay the "high" prices, so be it. I don't see it slowing down anytime soon, if anything I think it's going to get worse. When production companies are selling out limited runs at prices approaching $500 and seeing them being resold at much higher prices, they know the market will easily support even higher retail prices.
 
Since were talking such high dollar amounts here I guess were talking pure custom territory. The answer is very simple it is because of the time value of money. A maker may sell someone a custom knife for $600 but that guy probably had to wait 6-18 months to get it. When he sells it later on its going to be worth far more because nobody has to wait to buy it. Time is money.
 
$180 Spyderco PM2s being flipped for $800

$500 ZT 0888 being flipped for $1000+

$700 RJ Martin being flipped for $2200

$1000+ Mayo/Southard/Rexford etc being flipped for $3000+

It's at every level at this point. It's unsustainable, hence the bubble. A lot of people who are paying the inflated prices are going to be taking a serious hit soon.

If you are fortunate enough to win a lottery or go to a show and pick something up and decide to sell it later, there's no problem for making a small premium for your work or giving someone instant access to a knife.

Having sat through the smelly insanity of a Hinderer lottery, I'd be fine paying <$500 for a $385 knife, not $650+ just to not have to go through it again.
 
oharal said:
Since were talking such high dollar amounts here I guess were talking pure custom territory. The answer is very simple it is because of the time value of money. A maker may sell someone a custom knife for $600 but that guy probably had to wait 6-18 months to get it. When he sells it later on its going to be worth far more because nobody has to wait to buy it. Time is money.
Click to expand...

I agree with that. Time is money. And really the key here is that it's their money. Their money to do what they please with. If you believe that it's a bubble which will pop then don't spend.
I remember early this year with the sandy cook drama causing a call for an assault weapon ban. This caused a huge increase in all things gun related. $700 colt AR 15s selling for $3000-5000. High capacity mags like magpul Pmags that cost $11 going for $75-100 each. Ammo because because of it being in short supply doubling and tripling in price. .22 ammo used to cost like 2 cents a round. 550 rounds of blazer ammo used to go on sale all the time for $15 going for over $100.

Did I buy any of those things? No. I waited it out. Did I make the right call? Yes. But what if something passed? Then it would of been a bad choice.
Now there are a lot of people with 600 rifles that they paid thousands for and will never get back. That's their choice and their loss. I don't feel bad for them. No one forced them to spend their money.
 
I haven't found a need or desire to go beyond a large Sebenza or Umnumzaan. I've had some customs and two XM-18's, but they're gone. The CRK's still are in my favor. Once you have experienced an older Sebbie that's all smoothed out...it's a bit of heaven.
 
oharal said:
Since were talking such high dollar amounts here I guess were talking pure custom territory. The answer is very simple it is because of the time value of money. A maker may sell someone a custom knife for $600 but that guy probably had to wait 6-18 months to get it. When he sells it later on its going to be worth far more because nobody has to wait to buy it. Time is money.
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Bingo! Granted, some people and dealers will inflate prices just for the sake of making a profit but think as paying a bit extra as a "convenience fee". For those who can't wait or can't get on a maker's list, the extra charge is worth it. It's supply and demand just as in any collecting hobby.
 
Yes, agreed. I started a thread on this a little while back in another area. What can you do, as long as people are willing to pay the earth for a knife as long as its made by a 'name' then it will continue. I don't know how they justify it to themselves, but that's between them, their bank and their priest.
 
The real problem is many of these makers no longer have 'lists', which really drives the prices up on the few knives that become available through shows and dealers etc.

DrOpPoInT1110 said:
Bingo! Granted, some people and dealers will inflate prices just for the sake of making a profit but think as paying a bit extra as a "convenience fee". For those who can't wait or can't get on a maker's list, the extra charge is worth it. It's supply and demand just as in any collecting hobby.
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When Jeremy first started selling his folders through Howe's they were $425, now they are precisely double that from the same retailer.

eschwebach said:
Common sense tells me the prices should be falling since there are so many makers making them now. But I agree, I have seen prices go way up as well for some makers. Recently an online knife retailer was selling El Patron's for over $800... I almost spit out my coffee. It seemed like a year ago they were $350. IIRC
Click to expand...
 
Buffalohump said:
The real problem is many of these makers no longer have 'lists', which really drives the prices up on the few knives that become available through shows and dealers etc.
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I agree but sometimes that is the only way a maker can fairly sell their knives when they are in high demand.
 
I dont blame the makers... I would say most still sell their knives directly to the public for reasonable sums via lotteries or whatever. Its simply a case of low supply and high demand and those who will take advantage of that because people are willing to pay up no matter what.

DrOpPoInT1110 said:
I agree but sometimes that is the only way a maker can fairly sell their knives when they are in high demand.
Click to expand...
 
Buffalohump said:
I dont blame the makers... I would say most still sell their knives directly to the public for reasonable sums via lotteries or whatever. Its simply a case of low supply and high demand and those who will take advantage of that because people are willing to pay up no matter what.
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Sad but true unfortunately. I hate seeing dealers enter lottos as well only to flip them. It takes the chance away from those who truly want the knife.
 
I can see both sides of the discussion here as I've gone through the "phases" of knife collecting/buying/trading/selling. For me everything depends on the alignment of the sun, moon, stars, the tides, and my bank account :o

Growing up I was satisfied and over excited just to own a Swiss Army Knife, anything by Gerber, and a Buck 110 was the holy grail of Boy Scout knives. Once I discovered bladeforums, was out on my own for finances, and mainly when I discovered bladeforums :D I had that void that needed to be completed by buying the next best thing (much like people and cell phones/tablets nowadays). My knife buying limits slowly escalated until the "buy a Sebenza" saying finally got me to (you guessed it) buy a Sebenza. For me my top out limit would be a Sebenza or Strider SMF in price and value. There seems to be a price point where you are paying more for the name than you are for actual materials and a reasonable amount for "labor" especially in a production knife.

I fully believe that you can accomplish 99% of your cutting tasks with a SAK or a small inexpensive fixed blade (think mora) as long as you are using a knife as a "knife" and not trying to pry open a car hood or bushwhack a tree in half (not a sappling or twig....a frikk'n tree). However, there is that satisfaction of owning what you want and the happiness of getting to put it to use. For me if I could afford an embellished Sebenza with all the bells and whistles I would get one but I would probably baby it too much for it to be an effective tool and henceforth it would be a fancy paperweight.
 
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