Sick of hearing this!

[Deweyknives]

I agree,we all need to do something about our rights and to educate the less informed.As a knifemaker,I make tools and create pieces of art.What a customer does with one of my knives,I can't controll.If I was after someone running down the road,I would'nt chase him with a knife,I'd use my truck!Did this concerne the salesman at the Dodge garage?I don't think sbjects don't kill people,PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE!!! I grew up around guns and knives and NEVER saw one of them do ANYTHING without a PERSON pushing it.My house is full of objects to club and stab with but it's all legal posessions.I sure don't want blood all over something I just spent 50 hours to make!!!

 

[brewthunda]

I keep a knife under the dash, one on the side of the glove box (make it easy to grab), and one Velcro'ed to the inside of a little open dash compartment that's for CD's and cassettes.

I also have a police night stick and 7" fixed blade under the seat and pepper spray in my "console hump" container. And don't forget at least 2 flashlights, one of them hight intensity.

Just make sure that you're ok with any or all of those items hitting you really, really hard during an accident. Someone once posted on here about being in an accident where a benchmade folder in the glovebox managed to get out, open up and imbed itself in the rear seat. My wife was rearended once where the most damage to her was probably caused by a small electric tire pump that hit the back of her seat, really really hard. Her back was seriously injured.

I try to not have anything that could possibly get loose in the cabin other than a padded CD case.

 

[LaBella]

I'm so sick and tired of people labeling knives as deadly weapons/weapons. Why can't people see that knives are designed as a primary to CUT...whether you make a knife a weapon, is your decision...

Anyone else tired of people hassling you because you carry a fixed blade or something "bigger than your palm"?

knives are tools. tell EVERYONE that.

 

[mmarkh]

You can't debate with the ignorant.I'll carry what I want and all those liberal jacka##es can:jerkit:

 

[tristram]

I look at knives as both tools AND weapons.
Humans have been using knives to cut and slice other humans for as long as knives have existed.
HOWEVER.....
I do not condone banning knives of any type (or firearms of any type).
It has been demonstrated time and time again that only law-abiding people obey such bans while criminals ignore them, or worse, take advantage of them.

Admirable exposition,
and faulty conclusion.
That schizo patient might not have a weapon if weapons were banned.
You're a lot safer if neither you nor your all-too-common madman have a FB.
Knives can't be banned in general because they're indispensable tools.
Only the carrying of certain kinds of daggers, swords, hidden tactical knives etc. could be restricted within reason. The necessity for that depends on the empirical occurence of knife abuses (that is, in violent crime).

 

[Whoever Wherever]

That schizo patient might not have a weapon if weapons were banned.

Ignorance must be bliss. Banning something because it "might" keep it out of dangerous hands is about the dumbest thing I've read in along time. Facts are facts. The criminal is such because he has no concern for the law. The brady bill was repealed because it did nothing. Street weapons remain regardless of laws. Our founding father were smart enough to know that every man had the right to deffend his home and homeland. In D.C. handguns are baned. Violence rises there while in the rest of the country its down. Criminals still are using handguns there. Thus it is your point that is flawed. New York has banned daggers and guess what you were right. All violence stopped imediately afterwards. :jerkit:

A man that feels safer without him or the criminal having a weapon is a sheeple and buys into trading freedom for safety that they cannot provide you with. A criminal will break into your house and kill you with a lead pipe if its what he has to do to acomplish his ends.

 

[Gene Martin]

Perhapswe might have a better chance of convincing people that knives are tools if we didn't have quite so many "tacticals", fighters, "the best knife to carry to clear a bar" types hyping the weaponry aspect. We have a knife culture creating an image and we all get stuck with that image, whether it's true or not.

The media learned long ago that perception is reality. They create the perception and make it a reality for the brainless masses. Those who think are both exemp and in the minority.

Look at the names of many of the new knives, both factory and custom, and then tell me you wonder why people think they are weapons. No matter that Ted Kennedy's car has killed more people that your knife. The industry is creating the perception and the anti's are smart enough to milk that cow.

Gene

 

[tholiver]

Could someone seriously consider a SAK a weapon?

Anything(from fingernails to planetoids) can be a weapon...IF you have the mindset to do damage.
Whenever anyone mentions SAK's as a defensive weapon i remember that scene from the movie "True Romance". After being pummelled for a bit Patrica Arquette fights back and rips the hell out of Gandolfini's foot with the SAK corkscrew! Of course thats just a movie but still.

And damn was she hot in that movie! lol!

 

[Whoever Wherever]

Gene while your point is a valid one we cannot bow to such criteria for knives IMO. The NRA has done a great job of keeping the anit's away from most all guns because they understand the fanatic lobyists tactics. The people who would ban things like knives and guns are more than happy to use partial victories to build a set of rules and regulations that works towards there ultimate goal. In England as we speak there is a program to rid anyone of carrying a knife outside there home ever. It also encourages people to turn in there firends if they cary a knife outside there home. The fact is that tactical folders have done wonders for the knife industry just like 1 handed openers and pocket clips. They have gotten people to buy new knives when they might have just kept using an old clunker (nothing against a good old knife ). Maybe the names dont "have" to be tactical sounding but come on. I am not buying a cudly wudly in S30V no matter what it looks or cuts like. To sell to your average guy (although plenty of women use knives I think men are the main target audience) you use cool sounding names. Changing ourselves is not the answer. Standing up for our rights because we are right and we are law abiding citizens is better than trying to change a bunch of people that wouldnt listen to logic, or crime statistics or anything else that all points in favor leaving responsibility in the hands of the public. Also I think many major knife companies already do this (onion, chive, manix ect.) and many of the mean named knives are for serious hard use up to and including combat duty. Tops, Busse and the like advertise there knives as combination weapons/tools because they are and there is nothing wrong with that. If our soilders need quality knives they should be able to get them and I would rather that they had a busse than what the army might be able to afford to give them. Its nice to think we can shape teh image the public has of us but they dont read knife magazines to see what most knives are called. The most they might do is find a mean sounding knife name to prove a point and they could always just use an old name even if they were all changed tommarow. You average joe who didnt grow up in a major city already knows a knife has more uses than a weapon and the big city dweller who doesnt probably isnt going to let his mind be changed by the knife industry itself or a red neck gun nut like me. Just my 2 cents. (edit: I do not mean by my last statement that people from a big city can't be intelligent knife users and enthusiasts.)

 

[allenC]

Quote:
Originally Posted by allenC
I look at knives as both tools AND weapons.
Humans have been using knives to cut and slice other humans for as long as knives have existed.
HOWEVER.....
I do not condone banning knives of any type (or firearms of any type).
It has been demonstrated time and time again that only law-abiding people obey such bans while criminals ignore them, or worse, take advantage of them.

Admirable exposition,
and faulty conclusion.
That schizo patient might not have a weapon if weapons were banned.
You're a lot safer if neither you nor your all-too-common madman have a FB.
Knives can't be banned in general because they're indispensable tools.
Only the carrying of certain kinds of daggers, swords, hidden tactical knives etc. could be restricted within reason. The necessity for that depends on the empirical occurence of knife abuses (that is, in violent crime).

I don't see any "faulty conclusion" at all.

Maybe you did not understand what I said....
Again:

I do not condone banning knives of any type....

I don't think that swords, machetes, daggers, autos, or any other type of blade should be banned.
But I think it is silly to refuse to recognize that knives are tools AND weapons.
Saying otherwise will not change that fact.

 

[DRM]

You can't debate with the ignorant.I'll carry what I want and all those liberal jacka##es can:jerkit:

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

 

[JCaswell]

You're a lot safer if neither you nor your all-too-common madman have a FB.

No, you're a lot safer when you're armed and the 'all-too-common madman' is locked up in jail or hospital where he belongs.

If I was thrown in a cell with a madman, I think I would be safer if I was armed. (The 'weapon-free' environment of prisons doesn't make them a safe place to live.)

If I'm walking down the street I think I'm safer armed than hoping the bag guys and madmen got the memo that they shouldn't carry a knife, gun, screwdriver, heavy stick ... you name it. (If you're unarmed, they can kill you with ANYTHING or with NOTHING at ALL). They're really not very nice, you know.

The practical reality is that you're NEVER safer being helpless.

 

[Cornelis Böhms]

Perhapswe might have a better chance of convincing people that knives are tools if we didn't have quite so many "tacticals", fighters, "the best knife to carry to clear a bar" types hyping the weaponry aspect. We have a knife culture creating an image and we all get stuck with that image, whether it's true or not.

The media learned long ago that perception is reality. They create the perception and make it a reality for the brainless masses. Those who think are both exemp and in the minority.

Look at the names of many of the new knives, both factory and custom, and then tell me you wonder why people think they are weapons. No matter that Ted Kennedy's car has killed more people that your knife. The industry is creating the perception and the anti's are smart enough to milk that cow.

Gene

So true!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Andrew Colglazier]

Perhapswe might have a better chance of convincing people that knives are tools if we didn't have quite so many "tacticals", fighters, "the best knife to carry to clear a bar" types hyping the weaponry aspect. We have a knife culture creating an image and we all get stuck with that image, whether it's true or not.

The media learned long ago that perception is reality. They create the perception and make it a reality for the brainless masses. Those who think are both exemp and in the minority.

Look at the names of many of the new knives, both factory and custom, and then tell me you wonder why people think they are weapons. No matter that Ted Kennedy's car has killed more people that your knife. The industry is creating the perception and the anti's are smart enough to milk that cow.

Gene

Wait! Stop.

Let us not fall into the trap of acceeding to the vocabulary of the enemy. Thought follows words, action follows thought.

If we are educated to stop even using words to describe objects as what they are or could be, soon we will stop thinking of those objects in that way, and soon we will stop seeing the utility of the object. It will be that much easier to ban, at that point.

I like guns. Some guns I own are suitable for hunting, some for target shooting, some for plinking, and some for defense. My defensive firearms are weapons. End of story. That describes their use, that clarifies their utility for me. I won't shy from that reality.

In the shooting community there is a schism between "sport" shooters, such as shotgunners and small bore rifle shooters, and "combat" shooters, folks who like to shoot rifles and pistols in a simulated combat environment such as IDPA or USPSA. "Sport" shooting is acceptable in circles such as the Olympics, etc. but "combat" shooting is not. Certain disciplines have changed the shape of their targets from humanoid to simply geometrical because they didn't want the sheeple to be scared by the sport, although the sport arose from defensive roots.

Sport shooters often criticize combat shooters because they feel combat shooters, by using "scary" black "assault" weapons and hurt the image of gun ownership.

Look at hunting today. Already we are being educated into calling hunting "harvesting" in the hopes it will be more acceptable to the squeamish. We shy away from discussing the killing which is integral to hunting, and we deny we gain enjoyment from that killing, although without the killing there would be no hunting.

Slowly the words are selected, then the thought, then the reality.

Don't help this process along by shying away from the reality we choose to enjoy.

Andy

 

[allenC]

Wait! Stop.

Let us not fall into the trap of acceeding to the vocabulary of the enemy. Thought follows words, action follows thought.

If we are educated to stop even using words to describe objects as what they are or could be, soon we will stop thinking of those objects in that way, and soon we will stop seeing the utility of the object. It will be that much easier to ban, at that point.

I like guns. Some guns I own are suitable for hunting, some for target shooting, some for plinking, and some for defense. My defensive firearms are weapons. End of story. That describes their use, that clarifies their utility for me. I won't shy from that reality.

In the shooting community there is a schism between "sport" shooters, such as shotgunners and small bore rifle shooters, and "combat" shooters, folks who like to shoot rifles and pistols in a simulated combat environment such as IDPA or USPSA. "Sport" shooting is acceptable in circles such as the Olympics, etc. but "combat" shooting is not. Certain disciplines have changed the shape of their targets from humanoid to simply geometrical because they didn't want the sheeple to be scared by the sport, although the sport arose from defensive roots.

Sport shooters often criticize combat shooters because they feel combat shooters, by using "scary" black "assault" weapons and hurt the image of gun ownership.

Look at hunting today. Already we are being educated into calling hunting "harvesting" in the hopes it will be more acceptable to the squeamish. We shy away from discussing the killing which is integral to hunting, and we deny we gain enjoyment from that killing, although without the killing there would be no hunting.

Slowly the words are selected, then the thought, then the reality.

Don't help this process along by shying away from the reality we choose to enjoy.

Andy

Excellent!:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

 

[Esav Benyamin]

Let's not get carried away by worrying over names and the perceptions of people who are determined to oppose us no matter what. What frightening names does Strider give their knives? Spyderco? Kershaw?

How about car ads showing fanciful speeds and even fantasy flights through the air? Do these diminish sales and call up bans on fast cars?

People depend on cars, so they forgive the hype. People don't depend on knives the way everyone used to, so they lose familiarity with them, and learn to fear what they no longer understand.

It has very little to do with the names we see on some knives, most of which names are unknown to the people who flinch when we pull out a SAK or an Opinel.

Let's fight ignorance, not each other.

 

[tirod3]

"Let's fight ignorance, not each other."

It would seem that we do agree - knives can be tools or weapons. Their size and shape determine their best use. A double edge Sykes-Fairbain is not a good deer knife, and a Case slipjoint is a poor weapon, just as a Walther .22 is a poor elk gun, or a 12 gauge Vang Comp a poor squirrel meat getter.

It's when we bump up against the non user that the problem arises, and most knife carriers are using folders, even the most "benign" SAK styles, which are being called out as "weapons" by the ignorant and fearful.

My earlier point that women are the largest users of knives in armed violent encounters (regardess of the cause of the domestic disturbance) is to throw it back in the face of the most likely accuser - ignorant and fearful women.

Of course, I have matured enough to realize no gender differentiation is implied by the term "woman." It can apply equally to both, as it reflects a helpless state of mind that overreacts to stimuli outside their control.

Therefore, using humor as the best answer to defuse (and embarrass) the accuser, we need to be proactive about learning smart comments to "fire" back at our philosophical enemies - ones who are really trying to deconstruct our inalieable right to possess knives.

So check the posts for those sarcastic, cutting comments that will slay them.

 

[Band-aid]

it depends a lot on whats needed. as a civilian my knives were tools. skinning, chopping, whittling hickory whistles, or any cutting chore that would arise.
now i am a soldier, my knives usefulness stands as a far more ugly affair. i carry weapons that get used for other tasks.

in the end its really just a word game and i have no interest in playing. call a flame anything you want, it will still burn your hand if you touch it....and knives are still knives.

 

[tirod3]

I know you're not saying that you use knives for your self defense - and your rifle for a tent stake.

I had to put down our old family dog last night when she wandered under the wheels of our family van as we were leaving the house. Poor dumb dog. I didn't use a knife. Not the proper tool.

Most people use something else for self-defense more often than a knife - another DOJ statistic. By something else, I mean, firearms excluded, something at hand that had equal or better use as a weapon in that circumstance. Which includes a digital camera in a purse. Knives rate a poor third as a weapon, after guns and anything else. It is because we don't want to close with the enemy that we choose something else - something with reach - which few knives offer.

High lumen flashlights offer more control. Blinging your pocketknife with tactical looks doesn't improve it's limitations one bit - it just amplifies the intimidation factor. Which feeds ignorance and fear.

If someone really wants to knife fight, check out what the "experts" recommend as the ultimate knives - blades 8 to 14 inches long. A gladius.
Now that's a actually a short sword. Again, more reach. So I'm better off with my Cold Steel cane (no hidden blade) than a knife. Which is what polite society used in the day, and I can carry on an airline flight, now being old enough and actually having used one.

No doubt I don't play with fire much anymore, but the choice between a Bic lighter or flamethrower for self defense is pretty obvious.

The mind is your most important weapon, choose your tools carefully for the task.

 

[Suerte]

I'm so sick and tired of people labeling knives as deadly weapons/weapons. Why can't people see that knives are designed as a primary to CUT...whether you make a knife a weapon, is your decision...

Anyone else tired of people hassling you because you carry a fixed blade or something "bigger than your palm"?

The mall ninja factor (just look at Practical Tactical or even this fourm) doesn't help push the non-weapon angle.