So I broke my Rat Daddy

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adrock1978 said:
"no questions asked, lifetime warranty" doesn't feel all warm and fuzzy when you're on this side of the fence with a broken 20 year old knife.
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Sorry, but Swamp Rat Kinife Works is only 12 years old, 2013 was the 10th anniversary...
 
I do feel for you and your concerns. I work in a shop and we machine one offs daily. We don't mass produce anything so everything we build is per customer so we make one offs everyday. With the right machinist it's not a big deal. . It's not to difficult at all. Plus we keep all programs so if customer needs more or replacements we can easily remake them. Wouldn't be DHT but I'd rather have a rat daddy through hardened than any shop credit and or a R9. Keep us posted
 
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You raise an issue I've wondered about myself. I'll be interested to see what they do. It's definitely a tough situation for a company.
 
cut it out said:
I do feel for you and your concerns. I work in a shop and we machine one offs daily. We don't mass produce anything so everything we build is per customer so we make one offs everyday. With the right machinist it's not a big deal. . It's not to difficult at all. Plus we keep all programs so if customer needs more or replacements we can easily remake them. Wouldn't be DHT but I'd rather have a rat daddy through hardened than any shop credit and or a R9. Keep us posted
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Same here.... Thanks. I will.

Do you guys think if it comes down to a shop credit, they'll require I give up the broken knife? $248 would feel a lot nicer if I could also try to salvage my RD as well. Probably asking too much, huh?
 
adrock1978 said:
Same here.... Thanks. I will.

Do you guys think if it comes down to a shop credit, they'll require I give up the broken knife? $248 would feel a lot nicer if I could also try to salvage my RD as well. Probably asking too much, huh?
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You'll probably have to give it up.
If they wouldn't then some guy might get the credit and sell it. The next owner then again might seek to get a shop credit for the damage and so on.
Maybe they can mark it to avoid that and then give it back to you?
 
From what I've read over the years, broken blades are kept and destroyed. :eek: :(
 
I would cry if I broke a rat daddy!! Always wanted one but knowing what they cost used I wouldn't risk it now
 
adrock1978 said:
I'm just saying I'm in a tight spot with this particular scenario. It's too bad to fix, to old to replace, nothing really comparable, currently available.
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It seems that when you use a knife that has gained in value, you incur the risk. You could have sold it for market value and bought a new knife at retail value to use, unless nothing currently available would work for you. And if you had kept the knife because you really like it, then you would probably want to use it, so that is how you got into the tight spot.
 
There is always some risk involved if you intend to (ab)use an out of production blade that tends to sell for 2-3x (or more :eek:) the original retail price due to rarity and a lower volume in circulation. As much as it sucks when one breaks, the manufacturer can't be held liable for the secondary market price of the knife. It's a risk you take when beating on unreplaceable out of production knives that should be taken into consideration. That being said, one of my favorite blades is a really rare model of vintage SHBM that, if it did ever break, would be devastating, because not only did I pay multiple times more than the original retail value, that even if I did get what I paid for it, there would be no way to replace it. It's a risk you take to enjoy the blades that made Jerry's reputation what it is. And to me, that risk is worth the reward. It's up to you to decide if you're willing to eat the loss on the off chance you do break a vintage blade.
 
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bdmicarta said:
It seems that when you use a knife that has gained in value, you incur the risk. You could have sold it for market value and bought a new knife at retail value to use, unless nothing currently available would work for you. And if you had kept the knife because you really like it, then you would probably want to use it, so that is how you got into the tight spot.
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If no one used a knife that increased in value, there would be no need for a lifetime warranty. Its a knife. A tool. I used it as such without any regard for the resale value. I took comfort in the warranty, which now seems to decrease in value, as the knife ages and increases in value.

I understand the position I'm in. I don't think its unique though. I just think a lot of people will find themselves in this position sooner or later, without having really thought about it, until it happens. The life-time, no-questions-asked warranty sounds great, until the day after your knife comes down off the website, goes up in price by 1/3 on the secondary market and you manage to break it some how.

I don't expect any more from SR. Their warranty is what it is. I'm not complaining. I got a lot of use out of my RD. At this point I'm just participating in the conversation, and awaiting SR's decision.
 
Tyrade83 said:
There is always some risk involved if you intend to (ab)use an out of production blade that tends to sell for 2-3x (or more :eek:) the original retail price due to rarity and a lower volume in circulation. As much as it sucks when one breaks, the manufacturer can't be held liable for the secondary market price of the knife. It's a risk you take when beating on unreplaceable out of production knives that should be taken into consideration. That being said, one of my favorite blades is a really rare model of vintage SHBM that, if it did ever break, would be devastating, because not only did I pay multiple times more than the original retail value, that even if I did get what I paid for it, there would be no way to replace it. It's a risk you take to enjoy the blades that made Jerry's reputation what it is. And to me, that risk is worth the reward. It's up to you to decide if you're willing to eat the loss on the off chance you do break a vintage blade.
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The risk was well worth the reward. I wouldn't have it any differently... aside from the breakage of course. I'd rather not have the knife at all, than to have it and not beat the snot out of it.

What would be awesome though, is if SR or Busse strengthened their warranty by agreeing to remake a particular knife, for a certain fee. Maybe it wont be DHT, but I would gladly pay up to original retail for a new RD if that was an option. I know there are certain logistical costs and issues behind the scenes involved in reproducing a discontinued knife. I guess that would be up to Busse to determine if it would be worth it.
 
adrock1978 said:
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What would be awesome though, is if SR or Busse strengthened their warranty by agreeing to remake a particular knife, for a certain fee. Maybe it wont be DHT, but I would gladly pay up to original retail for a new RD if that was an option. I know there are certain logistical costs and issues behind the scenes involved in reproducing a discontinued knife. I guess that would be up to Busse to determine if it would be worth it.
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^^^^ what he said.
I have given this a lot of thought since I found out the warranty specifics RE older blades.
I think its bogus.
What point is having this super warranty if they can seemingly step away from it with old models because 'not make that no more'.. Maybe SR isnt as bad, but busse are almost all 'short term' models as far as production goes, so doesnt that give them an out on pretty much any warranty claim within a few years at most? 'Store credit' is not a replacement for the knife you likely loved to death, and it stings bad if your blade is only a few years old. Worse if you couldnt buy it at retail.

I would be fine with, say, paying for the metal and some time on a smaller cnc to blank out the blade to replace whatever I had broken. That would be totally fair for me, knowing there would be a cost but I could get a knife shaped like the one I broke if it was no longer a current model.. I would be more willing to call that a bombproof guarantee, but not so much the 'go pick out one that is 1/3 the blade you had, becuz retail' approach.

I hope I dont ever need anythjng but handle or finish work on the nmfsh I have coming. I might end up sad. That said, I doubt I ever will because of the beastly strong blades all these brands are, and I am comfortable that I can use them without invoking a warranty claim because of their performance record is there for more extreme use than mine tends to be. Because of that I might buy more in the future, more than how I view their warranty practices. Basically I would buy another because I doubt it will need replaced, not because they will or wont replace it as I see fit.

But that was exactly what the OP was thinking as well, I'd imagine..
Good luck, sir.
 
Jerry Busse said:
We will replace any knife with a knife of similar selling price. . . . of course "selling price" refers to the price that we originally sold the knife for. Some old Busses have increased so greatly in value that we would have to clear out the entire shop if we offered replacements at current market value.
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In some instances, we have kept some old blanks available for any warranty issues that might occur.

Hope this helps,

Jerry Busse
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Source: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...red-model-and-it-breaks?p=1081042#post1081042
 
AndreLinoge said:
I hope I dont ever need anythjng but handle or finish work on the nmfsh I have coming. I might end up sad. That said, I doubt I ever will because of the beastly strong blades all these brands are, and I am comfortable that I can use them without invoking a warranty claim because of their performance record is there for more extreme use than mine tends to be. Because of that I might buy more in the future, more than how I view their warranty practices. Basically I would buy another because I doubt it will need replaced, not because they will or wont replace it as I see fit.

But that was exactly what the OP was thinking as well, I'd imagine..
Good luck, sir.
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I wish I could tell you I was chopping my way out of an M1 Abrams or prying some concrete out of a wall when my RD broke, but alas... I was merely batoning through a log when the edge snapped. I doubted I'd ever need another 10"+ blade, or the warranty it came with, but I was wrong.
 
This is the problem with guarantees from companies that do a lot of one ofs and limited editions vs. a company with constant current production models. Makes you afraid to actually use the knife because if it breaks you just get original cost and no replacement, which you can't even use to buy a replacement, so you don't use it and it just sits collecting dust. I don't know about you, but I like to actually use my knives.

Busse has a custom shop, I don't see why they can't remake the rat daddy, or a close proximity to it. Is it that hard to order a $35 piece of 52100 from one of the steel suppliers? Diferentially tempering it shouldn't be a problem either. Or step it up, and use an infi blank if you can't or won't get 52100. I mean it's not like they are constantly getting a steady stream of broken knives in for replacements anyway, they are somewhat rare occurrences as they are known as "tough knives" so it shouldn't trouble them to take the time and minimal cost to replace the couple broken ones that do come in.

Also, if the break was due to an inherent issue in the blade (like a crack or air bubble, etc) then he got a knife that was defective off the bat, that wasn't his fault no matter what he did to it.

I also laugh at the people rushing to bash this guy and call what he was doing "abuse". If chopping wood with a chopping knife is abuse, then that speaks more of the knife than the user (I think Bark River said the same at some point too about a broken knife). Point is, the guy should get a replacement blade made for him. Otherwise, I don't blame him for being pissed, and it means you can't actually use any busse product since *every* model becomes discontinued at some point... It would be one thing to get replacement value if they still made the knife, but to get original purchase price from 10 years ago, and not even accounting for inflation would not be acceptable to me either.

Heck, even my local custom maker told me that if I actually break one of his knifes through legitimate use, he will either fix it or make me a new one. Obviously, he said he would prefer to fix it if he could than make a new one, but he will if he has to. Busse isn't a small time company, they should make this right. Otherwise, this is what can be said of the "guarantee".

[video=youtube;a5dpBpaFiMo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5dpBpaFiMo[/video]
 
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Right. But if you bought the knife from the factory, you wouldn't actually be out anything if you received a shop credit for the full amount you paid for it. The real problem is what happens to the value of Busse knives on the secondary market. And that, obviously, is something Busse Combat has no control over or responsibility for.

To my way of thinking, if you want to use a Busse knife, you should buy it from the factory. And in the rare circumstance that it becomes damaged beyond repair and a replacement isn't available, you should be satisfied to be made whole.
 
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