So I broke my Rat Daddy

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This happened to my Chopweiler a couple months ago. Almost exactly the same large (dime sized maybe?) chip from batoning through a piece of firewood. Had to send it in. They offered a Rodent 7 or credit for the amount paid ~200. I was bummed they didn't have any extras/surplus in stock. Id sure think they should have held on to more since they offer lifetime warranty. They never offered (and i never asked) to re-profile the blade. I still have the store credit because they had nothing with that handle/ergos I love(d) so much. I bought it from the factory whenever it was last available probably 4 or 5 years ago now. I was not so happy with how things went down--mostly cause I thought they'd have other chops available--but what else could they have realistically done?
 
"Adam,
Unfortunately, we can not replace the Rat Daddy. We will give you a shop credit for the original price of the Rat Daddy. Your shop credit is $248.95.
Thank you"


So, to update you all, I got my answer from Swamp Rat. I can't say I'm particularly pleased with the response, or the solution. I did manage to work out a scenario that puts a big 10"+ chopper in my hands, for about 1/3 of It's current price, using my credit. While I'm not displeased with Swamp Rat as a company, or the product they offer, I am definitely disappointed in their warranty. Apparently shop credit has become the norm for out of production knives, but that is NOT what the Busse website claims, if you click on "Our Guarantee". It clearly states the following:

"Busse Knife Group is proud to have the toughest warranty in the industry.All Busse Knife Group blades are guaranteed for life against any and all unintentional MAJOR damage. Your knife will either be repaired or replaced at our discretion. Please note that aftermarket modifications done to your knife outside of our shop that cause your knife to fail may void your warranty. Busse Knife Group encourages extreme usage of our blades as they are without question "The Toughest Knives in the World". We have no rivals. You can use a Busse Knife Group blade as hard as you like and our warranty has you covered."

They did not repair my knife. They did not replace my knife. I did use my blade as hard as I liked, and their warranty does not have me covered. They wont even send my broken knife back to me, to do with what I please. If not for the random release of the Battle Saw, two days ago, they literally have nothing to cover my broken blade. I'm sorry, but $248 doesn't get you to where it did 10 years ago. To be fair, I will mention that SR "added $50" to my credit for my "inconvenience". It would have been nice to speak to an actual person on the phone as I had requested, once my knife was inspected. But no. Here's your $300, have a nice day...

So that's where I stand. I used a $300 shop credit to buy a $480 Battle Saw. $180 out of my pocket, to get another big Busse in my hands. Its the knife, I'm concerned with, as I said all along. Ultimately I'm happy to have a big chopper again. I still love the company I've sunk thousands into, and I love their product. But I feel their guarantee is a little misleading, certainly not as "tough" as Busse would like you to believe. The biggest issue of all, is that bit of doubt I now have about using my Bussekin blades as hard as I'd like.

Something needs to change, in order to strengthen their guarantee with respect to older blades. Not even mentioning inflation, simply giving me shop credit, with nothing comparable to spend it on, is not very tough. Even Trojan's guarantee on broken condoms has you better covered... :D
 
I understand entirely, you want a huge "pucker factor" look at the original price of a Straight handle Steel Heart or Battle Mistress and think, original price shop credit. Those old ad's would make your heart stop. One knife I got rid of for 500 was originally 150. Makes a person not want to use the old users just out of fear of damage.
 
I think $300 is fair; heck, they gave you more than you paid for it.
But I do think they need to clarify their warranty wording more carefully; as everyone can see from the link I posted to the ad on this forum, I think that term "replacement" is leading to confusion among the general public—and that's not good for the manufacturer's business. When customers feel like they are getting misleading information, it's not good for the Busse brand image. Anyway, congrats on your Battle Saw.
 
"Adam,
Unfortunately, we can not replace the Rat Daddy. We will give you a shop credit for the original price of the Rat Daddy. Your shop credit is $248.95.
Thank you"


So, to update you all, I got my answer from Swamp Rat. I can't say I'm particularly pleased with the response, or the solution. I did manage to work out a scenario that puts a big 10"+ chopper in my hands, for about 1/3 of It's current price, using my credit. While I'm not displeased with Swamp Rat as a company, or the product they offer, I am definitely disappointed in their warranty. Apparently shop credit has become the norm for out of production knives, but that is NOT what the Busse website claims, if you click on "Our Guarantee". It clearly states the following:

"Busse Knife Group is proud to have the toughest warranty in the industry.All Busse Knife Group blades are guaranteed for life against any and all unintentional MAJOR damage. Your knife will either be repaired or replaced at our discretion. Please note that aftermarket modifications done to your knife outside of our shop that cause your knife to fail may void your warranty. Busse Knife Group encourages extreme usage of our blades as they are without question "The Toughest Knives in the World". We have no rivals. You can use a Busse Knife Group blade as hard as you like and our warranty has you covered."

They did not repair my knife. They did not replace my knife. I did use my blade as hard as I liked, and their warranty does not have me covered. They wont even send my broken knife back to me, to do with what I please. If not for the random release of the Battle Saw, two days ago, they literally have nothing to cover my broken blade. I'm sorry, but $248 doesn't get you to where it did 10 years ago. To be fair, I will mention that SR "added $50" to my credit for my "inconvenience". It would have been nice to speak to an actual person on the phone as I had requested, once my knife was inspected. But no. Here's your $300, have a nice day...

So that's where I stand. I used a $300 shop credit to buy a $480 Battle Saw. $180 out of my pocket, to get another big Busse in my hands. Its the knife, I'm concerned with, as I said all along. Ultimately I'm happy to have a big chopper again. I still love the company I've sunk thousands into, and I love their product. But I feel their guarantee is a little misleading, certainly not as "tough" as Busse would like you to believe. The biggest issue of all, is that bit of doubt I now have about using my Bussekin blades as hard as I'd like.

Something needs to change, in order to strengthen their guarantee with respect to older blades. Not even mentioning inflation, simply giving me shop credit, with nothing comparable to spend it on, is not very tough. Even Trojan's guarantee on broken condoms has you better covered... :D
Wow, very disappointing. Busse's warranty sure is misleading. Far from the greatest warranty around as some fans like to claim. Not even in the same ballpark as ESEE's no questions asked unconditional replacement warranty, even for intentional damage. I even read of a case where someone used an ESSE to test bullet penetration and they replaced the blade no questions asked!

I think I heard Jerry claim that he's never had a case where their warranty left someone unhappy. They definitely can't claim that now.

At the very least you should have gotten that battle saw for free!
 
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OK. Read carefully. The warranty said your knife will be repaired or replaced at our discretion. The factory could have sent you a knife worth $248 without giving you an option and still been within its rights under the warranty. Instead they offered you a shop credit plus an additional $50 so you could choose your own replacement. That still seems fair to me. But I also get where Dwayne is coming from. Even though the chances are remote, it makes you want to back away from beating on your old classics for fear of breakage. Guess I'll have to go buy a Battle Grade Ratweiler as insurance and retire my Camp Tramp now. :(
 
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Wow, very disappointing. Busse's warranty sure is misleading. Far from the greatest warranty around as some fans like to claim. Not even in the same ballpark as ESEE's no questions asked unconditional replacement warranty, even for intentional damage. I even read of a case where someone used an ESSE to test bullet penetration and they replaced the blade no questions asked!
Actually, Busse has replaced bullet damaged knives and intentional damage.
The Busse warranty itself is actually quite good, it's only on the older out-of-production knives that there is an issue; and the issue (in my view) is the interpretation of the term "replacement."

As the years roll by, the older blanks are used up and they are claiming without blanks they cannot replace the old knives. To some people this seems silly because they have a custom shop; and yes, to some it is misleading and confusing. If ESSEE had as many models as Busse over the years, they might be in the same situation.

At any rate, I think they could solve some of the confusion by simply re-wording their warranty and stop pretending like they have the stock on-hand to replace any knife that breaks, because it's clear that is not happening. Maybe something like:

"Your knife will either be repaired or replaced at our discretion, if the blanks are still available. If we no longer stock blanks you will be offered a shop credit or another model of equal value, if we happen to have such a blade at the time your knife is damaged."

The one question that has not been addressed here is:
how long can a customer expect for BKG to stock extra blanks on any given model? One year past production? Five years? Is there an average time that a customer can expect to truly have their knife replaced with the same model if damaged?
 
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Hmmmm ----- very disappointing for sure. Not to beat on you while you're down ---- but why the heck would you right away spend that shop credit to buy the battle saw --- that makes no sense --- and I'm really frustrated for you and AT you! If you felt that this was not fair/agreeable --- why the heck would you accept what they gave you, then spend it right away, and then complain about it here . . . I'm sorry but that's a little ridiculous

If you wanted to get someone on the phone ---- why would you tell us about it here on the forums --- instead of just calling the shop and asking to speak to Jerry and insisting that you're a long time customer and that it's really important for you to talk to him or someone else capable of making an executive decision. Sorry if I'm being hard on you brother --- but you really didn't handle this the way you should have considering the fact that you're complaining about it now on the forums
 
Seriously. If there's a lesson to be learned here, it's not to smear a warranty issue all over a public forum until you've had a chance to work out a settlement with the manufacturer one to one. I know most manufacturers would appreciate having an opportunity to work out warranty issues privately. Some even consider it a matter of courtesy for their customers to give them a chance to do that. And who could blame them? Try it next time. You've got nothing to lose. And you may end up with a better result.
 
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I can't speak for Adrock but for me the process was just so underwhelming. The warranty service was not what I imagined it would be form other dealings with them. Not especially helpful or regretful it broke or even particularly friendly. It was oh you have to send it in before well even do anything. I thought they'd send out a new one, Id send back the old one may give em a credit card for security deposit. It really was such a different experience than buying from them. I got the impression they just wanted to be done with it.

I'm just giving you this information to sort of put you in the state of mind I was in. Your baby broke... on wood no less. Youve seen it plow through concrete. Sure the company will be shocked and do everything it can to get you out a new one! They're sooooo cool on blade forums! I've gotten so many knives from Busse Co. They're gonna bend over backwards to make me happy. Then that happens.

They either don't have the blanks or don't want to replace an old knife for a new. (I didn't realize my chop was now going for $500+) You're just encouraged to take the credit. I tried to get the recently sold out Rottweiler LE since it was the closest (but any finish would have done) but nope just $200 or a Rodent 6/7. I don't really consider those replacements because a blade is so much more than length.

But look on the other hand I don't know how any reasonable policy could work. I'm a small business owner. They can't keep huge stocks of blanks around unsold. Or have a policy where they refund you current market price for your blade. And it just wouldn't make sense to do a custom every time someone broke their blade or we'd all have customs! So I'm not sure what else would work...
 
When they talk about 'replacement', one could interpret that a few different ways:
1-Direct replacement of an identical item
2-Replacement at the original purchase price
3-Replacement with an item that is roughly equivalent (for example, a 10" blade for a 10" blade, even though the handle design might be different)

It's understandable that they may not be able to stock enough blanks for every warranty claim on every model, but BKG has chosen the second option and, as has been noted, they can claim that they are fulfilling their warranty.
The problem, as has been noted, is that the way the warranty is stated and promoted, it leads almost everyone to believe that they would do either option 1 or 3. There are a knife companies, as well as tool companies that I've dealt with, that do exactly that.
There is also the fact that 2010 dollars do not equate to 2015 dollars, so getting an 'equivalent' knife still requires a significant outlay, adrock didn't get a replacement at 1/3 the cost, he still had to invest another $180 to get a 'roughly equivalent' knife.
And what about the hogs who go through the bloody ritual of the Ganzaas and score a sweet deal on piece of INFI, SR101, or SR77 ? You're out even more if it comes to trying to buy an equivalent knife with shop credit.

It's possible that Busse has done this, but the examples that are being presented, as well as the statements and affirmations of the 'shop credit' policy, don't offer much hope of that.
 
That does suck dude. :barf: Sorry to hear it. :( Can't say I'm surprised though (and I said as much earlier in this thread). I do agree that they should likely reword the warranty to be clearer on this subject for those that don't understand this kind of situation.

To be fair, how many Bussekin knives have we seen broken? What are the odds of it even happening? Unfortunately, it is a manufactured product, and even the very best have a flaw slip in here and there, that's just the way it is. I won't stop using my classics for fear they'll break, even knowing this (granted, most of mine were bought first-hand from the Swamp). If you can't enjoy them, might as well sell them to someone who will.

Again, sorry for your loss.


Well, that model was still being produced, so that's not really a fair comparison. I'm sure that if that were the case here, adrock would be getting a replacement RD.
 
I can't speak for Adrock but for me the process was just so underwhelming. The warranty service was not what I imagined it would be form other dealings with them. Not especially helpful or regretful it broke or even particularly friendly. It was oh you have to send it in before well even do anything. I thought they'd send out a new one, Id send back the old one may give em a credit card for security deposit. It really was such a different experience than buying from them. I got the impression they just wanted to be done with it.

I'm just giving you this information to sort of put you in the state of mind I was in. Your baby broke... on wood no less. Youve seen it plow through concrete. Sure the company will be shocked and do everything it can to get you out a new one! They're sooooo cool on blade forums! I've gotten so many knives from Busse Co. They're gonna bend over backwards to make me happy. Then that happens.

They either don't have the blanks or don't want to replace an old knife for a new. (I didn't realize my chop was now going for $500+) You're just encouraged to take the credit. I tried to get the recently sold out Rottweiler LE since it was the closest (but any finish would have done) but nope just $200 or a Rodent 6/7. I don't really consider those replacements because a blade is so much more than length.

But look on the other hand I don't know how any reasonable policy could work. I'm a small business owner. They can't keep huge stocks of blanks around unsold. Or have a policy where they refund you current market price for your blade. And it just wouldn't make sense to do a custom every time someone broke their blade or we'd all have customs! So I'm not sure what else would work...


Did you see that the Ratweiler CG was just announced??? Might be able to get one of those. Have you finalized your claim yet? That seems it would be a pretty fair replacement (the 1/4" thick version).

PS - Choppy for $500+??? :eek: :rolleyes: Maybe on the bay, but definitely not here. I've seen them go on the X recently for ~$375 shipped/insured. ;)
 
I think you guys may be a bit hard on them. If they sold you a knife for $300 which later became rare and desirable worth $5000 on the open market I do not think they owe you $5000 if you damage said knife. Nor can one expect them to pull a spare out of inventory of every knife they ever made.
 
I think you guys may be a bit hard on them. If they sold you a knife for $300 which later became rare and desirable worth $5000 on the open market I do not think they owe you $5000 if you damage said knife. Nor can one expect them to pull a spare out of inventory of every knife they ever made.
At least replacing it with a knife of the same value would be great. Is value what somebody paid back then or what somebody would pay for it now? Value for me should be length and kind of steel. This way you wouldn't have to pay additional hundreds to get back a similar blade under warranty!
 
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