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I LOL’dCollection
That’s today’s carry
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The BladeForums.com 2024 Traditional Knife is ready to order! See this thread for details: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/bladeforums-2024-traditional-knife.2003187/
Price is$300$250 ea (shipped within CONUS). If you live outside the US, I will contact you after your order for extra shipping charges.
Order here: https://www.bladeforums.com/help/2024-traditional/ - Order as many as you like, we have plenty.
so.. the sebenza.
- Thread starter aue123
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Having handled quite a few "hard use" knives in my time, I would say that the Sebenza (or Ink or Zaan) is certainly up to handling what I would consider jobs to be done by a hard use folder. There just isn't much to go wrong with them. You have a good steel, pivoting on steel, locking against steel, with a body made out of well tempered and near handfit titanium. The fit is so perfect that slop doesn't develop. The slop is what causes a knife to "work loose", for the most part as when tolerances are relaxed there is more room for additional play to develop. Give an inch, take a mile, etc. On top of that, the blade moves on low friction waifers of PB. No cage of bearings to collect junk. The knife is held together with just a few screws that use a standard hex size.
The Zaan, Inkosi, and 31 all use a ceramic ball to lock up. At first I was worried about the durability, but after looking at it, there is no way short of a bomb going off on the handle to dislodge that ball. It's really encapsulated.
Even the edge profile of the CRK is geared toward working. Instead of going with a full flat or something slicey for opening executive envelopes, Mr. Reeve went with a more convex edge. Tough yet sharp giving up high slicing and hair popping performance for an edge that can work all day without chipping out or rolling or getting dull.
I'm a contractor by trade. I do mostly sales these days, but I have used my Inkosi pretty hard around the warehouse. Cut up boxes, cut nylon banding, trimmed pvc saw cuts, pried open boxes that were sealed with industrial glue, etc. At the end of the day, i dont see it as a fancy knife. I see it as a highend tool that was made to do a generation's worth of work.
The Zaan, Inkosi, and 31 all use a ceramic ball to lock up. At first I was worried about the durability, but after looking at it, there is no way short of a bomb going off on the handle to dislodge that ball. It's really encapsulated.
Even the edge profile of the CRK is geared toward working. Instead of going with a full flat or something slicey for opening executive envelopes, Mr. Reeve went with a more convex edge. Tough yet sharp giving up high slicing and hair popping performance for an edge that can work all day without chipping out or rolling or getting dull.
I'm a contractor by trade. I do mostly sales these days, but I have used my Inkosi pretty hard around the warehouse. Cut up boxes, cut nylon banding, trimmed pvc saw cuts, pried open boxes that were sealed with industrial glue, etc. At the end of the day, i dont see it as a fancy knife. I see it as a highend tool that was made to do a generation's worth of work.
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“clap” “clap” “clap” standing ovation!!
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Getting myself back on track here...
I feel like if the OP thinks that a Sebenza is expensive, then they are most likely to not use it. Therefore, I could see the “not worth the price” thinking.
To really really experience what a CRK is all about, you must have the want to use it, and actually use it. That is where the Sebenza shines. As a fidget toy or a safe queen...most Sebenzas (not the fancy ones) will disappoint.
...Unless tight tolerances is your thing. Haha.
I feel like if the OP thinks that a Sebenza is expensive, then they are most likely to not use it. Therefore, I could see the “not worth the price” thinking.
To really really experience what a CRK is all about, you must have the want to use it, and actually use it. That is where the Sebenza shines. As a fidget toy or a safe queen...most Sebenzas (not the fancy ones) will disappoint.
...Unless tight tolerances is your thing. Haha.
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I think I kiiiiinda see what he's saying.
@goldie I think the difference between the Sebenza, the Koenigs, and Shiros would be as follows. The CRK Sebenza has been winning awards for over 20 years. It's an industry gold standard and has been since before many people who ask that question were old enough to even own a knife. As for Koenigs and Shiros, well Koenigs are primarily pocket jewelry, and on top of that, they're a relative newcomer on the scene of high-end knives. People don't have expectations of them other than "Be really good pocket jewelry". I've never seen a single post here about "Oh man, I bought this Arius so I can carry it in my factory/trades job!". Plenty of people in the trades carry Sebenzas, however. Some of them even take pictures of how hard they work those knives.
Shiros are expensive, and most models cost far more than most CRKs do. High end inlay CRKs with Damascus blades cost in the neighborhood of $600. That won't get you into any Shiro unless you're looking at used. Their higher end models go for thousands, up to tens of thousands. Insane. Nobody would claim that a Shiro anything is objectively worth $14,500 but those exist, and they do sell.
The Seb was meant to be the ultimate distilled essence of a folding working knife, and it does it well. Everyone talking about "Well, is it worth it?!??! HMM? I DON'T THINK SO!!" in these threads always amuse me, because they're essentially showing the poor logic of "I think my subjective opinion is an objective fact.". Clarified as "I don't think it's worth it, therefore it's not worth it."
Really? Listen, it's 2020. Chris Reeve himself isn't even building these knives himself anymore, but their prices haven't dropped, and they continue to sell well. Know why? Because it's what the market has said the knife is worth, and listen, the Market isn't concerned with your feelings. LOL I have a few CRKs myself, and always find myself looking at them whenever I get some knife funds burning a hole in my pocket. I'm just waiting for the right one to call my name.
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Sebenza is more Sinn than Rolex
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Well, sadly, that's where some folks are at*, where they'll spend money that's not really easily discretionary to their budgets, so they basically have to keep a knife pristine, so they could sell it if they had an emergency pop up. I mean, I was there once. I know how that feels. If you can't see the value of the work something is able to perform, versus the initial cost, and the price you could ask on a secondary market, it's probably best to just save your money and buy something cheaper.
* No judgement from me on this.
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No judgement here either.
And don’t get me wrong...I’ve got pristine CRK safe queens myself...
It took me a few years to start carrying one of my sebenzas...but after I took the use/carry plunge...no turning back. They just perform, day in and day out.
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I'd love to hear what your "hard use" go-to folder is.
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Hahahahaha that made me laugh aloud, thank you, I needed that!
Not a Sebenza, but I've used my Umnumzaan hard and never had an issue. Try one out and see how you like it.
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The pricing of the Sebenza is more indicative the iconic status of the knife/brand than it is of the actual "value" of the product. A Rolex Submariner doesn't cost twice what an Omega Seamaster does because it's got much higher quality materials or manufacturing. The same goes for CRK.
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That goes for anything in a capitalistic society, though. The market sets the price. There is a fair amount of built in profit because it IS a CRK, but I see that as an earned profit from sweat equity. That's the capital that was needed to be invested in cultivating a brand and a reputation for taking care of your customers. I'm sure there are some CRK eggheads running numbers to see what that profit should be, and we happily snap them up as fast as they churn them out.
However, I think the fit and finish of the knife and the cost of getting it to that point needs to be acknowledged in to the pricing as well. The amount of buffing and checking and rechecking. Mr. Reeve didn't do it that way because it was effecient. He did it because it ensured he got the product to the level he was wanting, and that takes time, manpower, and money to do so. So while I would agree that there isn't $500 more worth of "real" value of materials in a designer handbag compared to a Jansport backpack, I don't think it's as easy as saying, "They make a titanium frame lock, and they make a titanium frame lock except it has "Idaho Made" stamped on the side and costs $100 more." A CRK is still a production knife, but I can certainly feel the extra quality in one of their knives over any of my ZTs when it comes to fit.
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That and the other companies that are putting out ti framelock knives of similar fit and finish, like say Olamic or Reate, are priced pretty comparably to CRK.
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And yet we don’t get regular posts lambasting them or belittling those who enjoy them.
Some folks raise up other brands with similar Ti framelocks as par for those because they cost the same in the store.
Not so well known marketing trick. Say you want to compete with a big player because you have a similar product. You can do two things with price. Set your price low to get in the door and gain share. Or set your price the same as your competitor so people will consider your quality to be equal because it cost a similar amount.
Not so well known marketing trick. Say you want to compete with a big player because you have a similar product. You can do two things with price. Set your price low to get in the door and gain share. Or set your price the same as your competitor so people will consider your quality to be equal because it cost a similar amount.
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I don’t understand your point. Companies such as Olamic, Hinderer, Reate, etc. are able to charge what they do for Ti framelocks because they absolutely equal (and some arguably surpass...) the quality and f&f of CRK.
ETA: Heck, look at what Spyderco’s models are going for.
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All the banter & debate will never really decide if a Sebenza is right for YOU
But as far as value....it’s really quite simple. The market sets the price. CRK is not having any problems selling their products for their prices. Nor are there many people struggling to sell their CRK’s on the secondary market.
Agreed.....$550 and $600 for a wood inlay large Sebenza 31 is pricey....but try to find one in stock.....
But as far as value....it’s really quite simple. The market sets the price. CRK is not having any problems selling their products for their prices. Nor are there many people struggling to sell their CRK’s on the secondary market.
Agreed.....$550 and $600 for a wood inlay large Sebenza 31 is pricey....but try to find one in stock.....
vjb.knife
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I like variety and I own 3 Sebenzas, 2 large and one small. I am not saying that is the variety but only a small part. There are dozens of knives out there that are every bit as good as a Sebenza. I also rarely carry one, because I have quite a few others that I like better including the Microtech Socom, which you said you already own.
I actually like the Sebenza a lot but I will not over hype it. It is a good solid knife in all respects but there are a lot of good solid knives out there and some of them cost a lot less than $500. I agree with many here that you should probably go see one before buying it. Personally I like the models with the handle onlays a lot better than those without. I think the knife is too flat and plain with just the Ti slabs. The Micarta or wood side pieces make it much more comfortable to hold.
I actually like the Sebenza a lot but I will not over hype it. It is a good solid knife in all respects but there are a lot of good solid knives out there and some of them cost a lot less than $500. I agree with many here that you should probably go see one before buying it. Personally I like the models with the handle onlays a lot better than those without. I think the knife is too flat and plain with just the Ti slabs. The Micarta or wood side pieces make it much more comfortable to hold.
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